ludurigan Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 7 hours ago, RussTCB said: It's so weird. I have a copy of Chinese Democracy right next to me so I double checked it. In 3 different places (cover, back cover and spine) it lists it as a Guns N' Roses album. I checked inside just to be sure, and sure as shit, there were pictures of the Guns N' Roses lineup that played on the album. Looking further, I found writing credits for the members of Guns N' Roses that were involved in writing each Guns N' Roses song. yeah man but axl called the shots, axl chose the players, the songs, the producers, everything needed to be approved by axl, we all know that dont we? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 I wouldn't call it NIN/Industrial. Shackler's Revenge is actually a Korn rip-off. Undoubtedly Nu-metal and one of the worst songs on Chinese Democracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamillos Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Ya guys comparing two different eras again? And what’s more, the worst, falling apart period of the old one with a different approach of the latter one? The fact Axl had to approve shit on ChD doesn’t mean he necessarily had to have been an ayatollah about it, does it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmenjello Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 2 hours ago, DieselDaisy said: I wouldn't call it NIN/Industrial. Shackler's Revenge is actually a Korn rip-off. Undoubtedly Nu-metal and one of the worst songs on Chinese Democracy. Korn? Have you listened to their first two albums? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludurigan Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 3 hours ago, jamillos said: Ya guys comparing two different eras again? And what’s more, the worst, falling apart period of the old one with a different approach of the latter one? The fact Axl had to approve shit on ChD doesn’t mean he necessarily had to have been an ayatollah about it, does it? it just means he was the boss and everybody else worked for him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Carmenjello said: Korn? Have you listened to their first two albums? I have had the misfortune to see them live. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F*ck Fear Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 11 hours ago, RussTCB said: It's so weird. I have a copy of Chinese Democracy right next to me so I double checked it. In 3 different places (cover, back cover and spine) it lists it as a Guns N' Roses album. I checked inside just to be sure, and sure as shit, there were pictures of the Guns N' Roses lineup that played on the album. Looking further, I found writing credits for the members of Guns N' Roses that were involved in writing each Guns N' Roses song. Come to think about it, every ticket stub I've collected from shows I attended since 2002 also say Guns N' Roses. Interesting. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamillos Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 1 hour ago, ludurigan said: it just means he was the boss and everybody else worked for him Apparently, they worked both for him and with him; he was the boss all right, but the results stemmed from common effort, where everybody contributed with their own visions, as they said themselves. No mystery about that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucketfoot Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Shackler's also sounds a bit like 'Heresy', which came out in '94. Just saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 I have always thought Slash's guitar lines on ''Estranged'' sound like 1970s porno music. Wah wah wah waaahh, wah wah wah whooo. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jekylhyde Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Shackler's intro riff sounds a bit like Korn's Good God, but other than that, I don't hear any resemblance with Korn. Not that I would mind, because I'm a Korn fan. That aggressive bridge part of Better sounds a bit like Korn too. As NIN fan I have to say that Shackler sounds nothing The Hand That Feeds. When it comes to composition at least. On ChiDem there's some metal/nu metal/alternative moments (mostly with guitar tones), but it's more like a hard rock ballad record with excessive production. I don't think there is actually a word or a genre that can describe ChiDem. It's a good album, but it is not for everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killuridols Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 I find the similarities (The Hand & Shackler's) mostly in the chorus part, it's the rhythm, the cadence in both of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucketfoot Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 31 minutes ago, killuridols said: I find the similarities (The Hand & Shackler's) mostly in the chorus part, it's the rhythm, the cadence in both of them. Definitely the rhythm/pulsating beat is what I was getting at. You could also say it sounds a bit like The Prodigy in that regard. People waffling on about melodies/chord progressions and shit Anyway, I best not offend sensitive souls by suggesting Axl hasn't come up with something completely original. Edited February 23, 2018 by bucketfoot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killuridols Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 34 minutes ago, bucketfoot said: Definitely the rhythm/pulsating beat is what I was getting at. You could also say it sounds a bit like The Prodigy in that regard. People waffling on about melodies/chord progressions and shit Anyway, I best not offend sensitive souls by suggesting Axl hasn't come up with something completely original. Yes, that's what I dont understand what is the big offense we do by saying these things. I dont have time right now to be looking for/pasting quotes but if you read the reviews of Chinese Democracy from 2008 made by the major music media, most of them make a reference to NIN, The Prodigy, Manson and nuMetal, so I really don't get what is the big deal if what we say has been said too by people who work as music critics in magazines and newspapers Edited February 23, 2018 by killuridols Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Order of Nine Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 45 minutes ago, bucketfoot said: Definitely the rhythm/pulsating beat is what I was getting at. You could also say it sounds a bit like The Prodigy in that regard. People waffling on about melodies/chord progressions and shit Anyway, I best not offend sensitive souls by suggesting Axl hasn't come up with something completely original. Yeah cause chord progressions, melodies, they mean absolutely NOTHING. And if you took a few minutes to A and B the two you could see they are COMPLETELY different. 1 hour ago, killuridols said: I find the similarities (The Hand & Shackler's) mostly in the chorus part, it's the rhythm, the cadence in both of them. Lmao... And where is the cadence in both of these songs where the V chord resolves to the 1 chord????????!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Order of Nine Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 7 hours ago, DieselDaisy said: I wouldn't call it NIN/Industrial. Shackler's Revenge is actually a Korn rip-off. Undoubtedly Nu-metal and one of the worst songs on Chinese Democracy. Post the evidence of your claims. What song. And if your going to make claims like this you BETTER at least know some basic music theory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Order of Nine Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 8 hours ago, ludurigan said: yeah man but axl called the shots, axl chose the players, the songs, the producers, everything needed to be approved by axl, we all know that dont we? A band that has a leader???!? Oh no god forbid! You mean like Angus is the leader of ACDC? Get a grip Edited February 23, 2018 by Order of Nine 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Order of Nine Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 1 hour ago, killuridols said: I find the similarities (The Hand & Shackler's) mostly in the chorus part, it's the rhythm, the cadence in both of them. Did it Dawn on you yet that we pointed out the hand was released in 2005 and. Shackler's was recorded sometime BEFORE 2004 when Bucket was in the band or are you going to keep ignoring this fact??? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucketfoot Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 49 minutes ago, Order of Nine said: Did it Dawn on you yet that we pointed out the hand was released in 2005 and. Shackler's was recorded sometime BEFORE 2004 when Bucket was in the band or are you going to keep ignoring this fact??? Who gives a fuck when it was written for fucks sake?! It was a general observation that Shackler's has a bit of NIN about it. I've just said it also sounds like 'Heresy', released in '94, was Shackler's written before that? No, didn't think so. Edited February 23, 2018 by bucketfoot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Order of Nine Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, bucketfoot said: Who gives a fuck when it was written for fucks sake?! It was a general observation that Shackler's has a bit of NIN about it. I've just said it also sounds like 'Heresy', relesed in '94, was Shackler's written before that? No, didn't think so. This song that literally plays one note for over 30 seconds and the riff at 107. Where the hell does ANY shackler's riff fit into that?????? Trent is pretty monotone on this chorus, pretty much TWO notes. Come on man analyze instead of making GENNERAL statements 5 minutes ago, bucketfoot said: Who gives a fuck when it was written for fucks sake?! It was a general observation that Shackler's has a bit of NIN about it. I've just said it also sounds like 'Heresy', relesed in '94, was Shackler's written before that? No, didn't think so. Because you guys are basically claiming shackler's was a rip off of hands!! Now either make a legit claim and back it up or get a CLUE. Edited February 23, 2018 by Order of Nine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Order of Nine Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 9 minutes ago, bucketfoot said: Who gives a fuck when it was written for fucks sake?! It was a general observation that Shackler's has a bit of NIN about it. I've just said it also sounds like 'Heresy', relesed in '94, was Shackler's written before that? No, didn't think so. And it's got the SAME beat the ENTIRE song!! Absolutely no chord progression under anything and other then that riff at 1:07 is pure ear candy. Where's all the melodies that are similar? Chords? VOCAL lines??? Axl does triplets on the chorus! That's gonna be a pretty tough find to make a correlation with ANY NINs song. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucketfoot Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 2 minutes ago, Order of Nine said: And it's got the SAME beat the ENTIRE song!! Absolutely no chord progression under anything and other then that riff at 1:07 is pure ear candy. Where's all the melodies that are similar? Chords? VOCAL lines??? Axl does triplets on the chorus! That's gonna be a pretty tough find to make a correlation with ANY NINs song. I've just said it's more of a rhythm/beat thing. Also, the verse vocal is similar, obviously not every element of the song. You disagree, that's fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Order of Nine Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, bucketfoot said: I've just said it's more of a rhythm/beat thing. Also, the verse vocal is similar, obviously not every element of the song. You disagree, that's fine. The NIN beat has the snare coming in on 2 and 4 of the beat the ENTIRE song!!! Shackler's has NO similarities in that aspect. Trent's vocal line is 3 notes at best and they are NOT even remotely similar, Not an opinion a fact, Do you want me to post the notes??? I sure as hell can Edited February 23, 2018 by Order of Nine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucketfoot Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 1 minute ago, Order of Nine said: Do you want me to post the notes??? Not particularly, no. Thought you might have calmed down a bit by now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Order of Nine Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, bucketfoot said: Not particularly, no. Thought you might have calmed down a bit by now. No. That's good. Now go back to being a "fan". And if your going to make a claim at least analyze what your looking at instead of making GENNERAL claims and assumptions. Edited February 23, 2018 by Order of Nine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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