STEVEN ADLER: "Izzy is just as heartbroken as I am that the three of them decided to leave us out and bring three strangers in–who are those people?"

[SoulMonster]

7 minutes ago, Padme said:

Tell all this to SoulMonster. He doesn't believe that Adler's addiction to drugs was deminishing his ability to play. And that's the reason why he was fired. He thinks Adler was fired because he was inmature. 

Huh? I have never said that at all 

[Blackstar]

8 minutes ago, Padme said:

Tell all this to SoulMonster. He doesn't believe that Adler's addiction to drugs was deminishing his ability to play.

It's not my understanding of what @SoulMonster said. I think he said the same as the Slash quote I posted.

[EvanG]

4 minutes ago, Padme said:

He doesn't believe that Adler's addiction to drugs was deminishing his ability to play. And that's the reason why he was fired.

I don't think anyone would argue with that. He couldn't play because he was intoxicated most of the time and he didn't get his act together. If he had the ability to still play while being intoxicated or if he made sure that he would be sober enough for rehearsals or recordings, he wouldn't have been fired. Period. 

I'm going to lock this thread now.

[SoulMonster]

1 minute ago, EvanG said:

I don't think anyone would argue with that.

Actually, @DieselDaisy would argue against Steven being fired due to his diminishing ability to play -- according to DD this is just a lie In fact, DD has proven this by pointing out that in DD's opinion, Steven played perfect during Farm Aid, and because it is a known fact that Slash has lied before. Q.E.D. 

[DieselDaisy]

23 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

You are, you are claiming that they are lying 

Your "alternative interpretation," that Steven was kicked out for merely being an addict, is not only highly stupid but also highly implausible.

No. Many of the quotes are from Duff's book.

I never said he was ''kicked out for being an addict''. That was some side argument you created over semantics because you wanted an argument. 

[SoulMonster]

4 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

I never said he was ''kicked out for being an addict''. That was some side argument you created over semantics because you wanted an argument. 

Here is what you wrote: "That band, consisting of three of those same addicts still indulging in their addictions, sacked that fourth addict for his addiction."

And later: "Three drug addicts and a nutter booted their drummer out of the band for a drug addiction! Hypocrisy of the highest order".

So yeah you did. Not only are you unaware of what GN'R band members have said, you don't even manage to remember your own nonsense.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 17, 2018 by SoulMonster

[EvanG]

21 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Not only didn't Axl like Steven particularly much (Axl didn't even want him in the band at the beginning), also Slash and Duff disliked him.

I haven't read Steven's book so I can't comment on that, but I was always under the impression that it was merely Axl who had a problem with him. Slash has said many times that Steven was one of his best friends and Duff has always spoken fondly of him too, except that he didn't like him in the beginning.

Duff, January 1990

Quote

I hated Steven, he was a real little asshole. He had a double-drum, all these drums and shit, and he was just a little asshole. I love him now to death, but he'll tell you himself, he was an asshole then.

 

[DieselDaisy]

8 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Here is what you wrote: "That band, consisting of three of those same addicts still indulging in their addictions, sacked that fourth addict for his addiction."

So yeah you did.

 

 

 

 

I was speaking rhetorically, i.e., Guns claim to have sacked him for drugs, and that reason is therefore completely hypocritical as they were also drug addicts. You then decided you wanted a tedious argument over semantics of the (Guns N' Roses) claim.

My theory is as stated earlier, 

Quote

The reality is that Rose wanted rid of Adler because he talked back to Rose, and seemed to believe some ''incident'' involving Erin (which was also probably nonsense). The other two, scared of upsetting Rose, went along with it.  

Bringing in some of Ronin's arguments about power and money. 

Edited April 17, 2018 by DieselDaisy

[SoulMonster]

Just now, EvanG said:

I haven't read Steven's book so I can't comment on that, but I was always under the impression that it was merely Axl who had a problem with him. Slash has said many times that Steven was one of his best friends and Duff has always spoken fondly of him too, except that he didn't like him in the beginning.

Duff, January 1990

 

Steven spends a lot of time in his book discussing how Duff and Slash started to avoid him. It could be argued that this is Steven's strategy to present a different case for him being fired than due to him being unable to play due to addiction. In any way, he talks a lot about how they avoided him and froze him out. Slash and Duff is more generous in their books, and don't say these things as explicitly, although it is there between the lines. I will come back with more quotes on this later, I don't have time now.

[PatrickS77]

24 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Not only didn't Axl like Steven particularly much (Axl didn't even want him in the band at the beginning),

And that's my point from months or maybe even years ago. The reason why Steven is not there is not because he's supposedly not reliable. No, the reason is, that Axl doesn't like Steven. And unlike Slash, who makes the whole difference, him not being there doesn't have a big effect on ticket sales. I do think that Slash and Duff would be more willing to work with him, but obviously don't care enough about him to be there to really press Axl on this issue.

[SoulMonster]

1 minute ago, DieselDaisy said:

I was speaking rhetorical, i.e., Guns claim to have sacked him for drugs, and that reason is therefore completely hypocritical as they were also drug addicts.\

They never claimed to have sacked him for being on drugs, this is just something you claim so you can label them as hypocrites. They claim to have sacked him for wasting their time in studio due to him not being able to pay anymore. Why don't you read all the quotes I provide? Why are you so reluctant to learn and have your misconceptions corrected?

[Order of Nine]

4 minutes ago, PatrickS77 said:

And that's my point from months or maybe even years ago. The reason why Steven is not there is not because he's supposedly not reliable. No, the reason is, that Axl doesn't like Steven. And unlike Slash, who makes the whole difference, him not being there doesn't have a big effect on ticket sales. I do think that Slash and Duff would be more willing to work with him, but obviously don't care enough about him to be there to really press Axl on this issue.

How can anyone take Adler seriously all these years later and not wonder how big of a liability he could be? He has not matured much imho since his departure and his antics while sober are irritating at best. 

The people that insist that he had this elusive drumming style just happened to get used to his timing issues and have grown accustomed to it! They didn't sit Steven down to a click track to record appetite.

Go listen to farm aid 1990 and ask yourself if you would want a world tour with that guy. 

[Blackstar]

9 minutes ago, EvanG said:

I haven't read Steven's book so I can't comment on that, but I was always under the impression that it was merely Axl who had a problem with him. Slash has said many times that Steven was one of his best friends and Duff has always spoken fondly of him too, except that he didn't like him in the beginning.

Going by what they all have said publicly about Steven, even Axl has said nice things at times.

Steven said that they were "dicks" to him, they started leaving him out of the loop and that they even set him up for Farm Aid by playing songs he didn't know.

[Padme]

28 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Huh? I have never said that at all 

Yes, you claimed Steven was fired because he was inmmature and annoying. Besides his innability to play. Duff and Slash agreed he couldn't played anymore. Adler admitted he couldn't play Civil War. But it wasn't because of lack of talent. The guy was really fucked up.

Well now that's not the case anymore. So why Adler isn't the GN'R drummer? Axl, Slash and Duff don't want him in the band. Still the question is why

 

[EvanG]

18 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Steven spends a lot of time in his book discussing how Duff and Slash started to avoid him. It could be argued that this is Steven's strategy to present a different case for him being fired than due to him being unable to play due to addiction. In any way, he talks a lot about how they avoided him and froze him out. Slash and Duff is more generous in their books, and don't say these things as explicitly, although it is there between the lines. I will come back with more quotes on this later, I don't have time now.

Ok, well, I can understand that when you've been helping someone trying to get their act together and they keep fucking up, you eventually get frustrated, especially when you're trying to write and rehearse new songs. I've already mentioned the gun incident Duff had with Steven's dealer, you don't do that if you don't like him.

Slash, February 1991

Quote

Our rehearsals began for the new record, his chops were all over the place. And he was lying to us on a daily basis. I was trying to talk some sense into him but it never happened. He wouldn't listen to anybody. And Axl and Duff had had it. (.......) So now I don't see him anymore. I call his doctor and I think about him a lot. And I worry, cos it's a scary thing. And he was my best friend for a long time.

 

Edited April 17, 2018 by EvanG

[Order of Nine]

1 minute ago, Blackstar said:

Going by what they all have said publicly about Steven, even Axl has said nice things at times.

Steven said that they were "dicks" to him, they started leaving him out of the loop and that they even set him up for Farm Aid by playing songs he didn't know.

If that's the case his reaction to this "setup" was just more of the same, him shooting himself in the foot.

[SoulMonster]

6 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

Going by what they all have said publicly about Steven, even Axl has said nice things at times.

Steven said that they were "dicks" to him, they started leaving him out of the loop and that they even set him up for Farm Aid by playing songs he didn't know.

Yep, and here are a few quotes from Steven's book:

It was Axl's idea to do "Knockin' On Heaven's Door." He told Slash about it, they learned it, and we did it. They never even mentioned it to me though, just expecting me to pick up on the beat on the fly. I didn't know if this was a tribute to my drumming adaptability or a sign of their abject disregard for my needs as a member of the band (but I could venture a pretty good fucking guess). [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 126]

[...] this growing disrespect only snowballed until it put me in an awfully embarrassing situation at Farm Aid [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 127]

WTF! when I got out [from rehab], someone asked me why I hadn't appeared on the American Music Awards. I didn't know what the hell he was talking about. He proceeded to tell me that GNR performed "Patience" [...] with someone else on drums. [...] I was completely blindsided by this, so stunned and hurt, I can't begin to describe the feeling of betrayal [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 188].

We'd always have blow on us at the studio. But when I'd offer to cut them a line they would refuse. Then Slash and Duff would go in some other room to party. "Hey, where ya going?" I would begin to follow them only to find that they had shut the door on me. To this day I have no idea why, other than I felt they believed I just wasn't cool enough to hang out with anymore [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 190-191].

At rehearsals, I felt I was getting pushed out of the songwriting circle as well. we would be working on the dynamics of a song and the three of us would throw around ideas. Then suddenly the exchange would be limited to Duff and Slash. I learned just to sit and wait patiently. They would agree on something, then turn to me and say, "Okay, Steven, this is what we're going to do" [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 191].

Instead of confronting them and flushing out whatever the hell it was that seemed to be getting worse, I let the drugs take me into a dark valley of despair, where I could wallow in my own self-pity [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 191].

8 minutes ago, Padme said:

Yes, you claimed Steven was fired because he was inmmature and annoying. Besides his innability to play. 

Ah, but not ONLY because he was immature and annoying. That's what I thought you meant.

In my opinion, he was mainly fired because he was a fuck up, and then because the other band members started to dislike him more and more.

[SoulMonster]

10 minutes ago, Padme said:

Yes, you claimed Steven was fired because he was inmmature and annoying. Besides his innability to play. Duff and Slash agreed he couldn't played anymore. Adler admitted he couldn't play Civil War. But it wasn't because of lack of talent. The guy was really fucked up.

Well now that's not the case anymore. So why Adler isn't the GN'R drummer? Axl, Slash and Duff don't want him in the band. Still the question is why

Because he is an unreliable manchild who they dislike and who has a history of filing lawsuits at them and lying about them in the press? Just my 5 cents...

[EvanG]

2 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Yep, and here are a few quotes from Steven's book:

It was Axl's idea to do "Knockin' On Heaven's Door." He told Slash about it, they learned it, and we did it. They never even mentioned it to me though, just expecting me to pick up on the beat on the fly. I didn't know if this was a tribute to my drumming adaptability or a sign of their abject disregard for my needs as a member of the band (but I could venture a pretty good fucking guess). [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 126]

[...] this growing disrespect only snowballed until it put me in an awfully embarrassing situation at Farm Aid [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 127]

WTF! when I got out [from rehab], someone asked me why I hadn't appeared on the American Music Awards. I didn't know what the hell he was talking about. He proceeded to tell me that GNR performed "Patience" [...] with someone else on drums. [...] I was completely blindsided by this, so stunned and hurt, I can't begin to describe the feeling of betrayal [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 188].

We'd always have blow on us at the studio. But when I'd offer to cut them a line they would refuse. Then Slash and Duff would go in some other room to party. "Hey, where ya going?" I would begin to follow them only to find that they had shut the door on me. To this day I have no idea why, other than I felt they believed I just wasn't cool enough to hang out with anymore [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 190-191].

At rehearsals, I felt I was getting pushed out of the songwriting circle as well. we would be working on the dynamics of a song and the three of us would throw around ideas. Then suddenly the exchange would be limited to Duff and Slash. I learned just to sit and wait patiently. They would agree on something, then turn to me and say, "Okay, Steven, this is what we're going to do" [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 191].

Instead of confronting them and flushing out whatever the hell it was that seemed to be getting worse, I let the drugs take me into a dark valley of despair, where I could wallow in my own self-pity [Steven's biography, "My Appetite for Destruction", 2010, page 191].

Poor guy, he sounds like every drummer I've ever played with. 

The drummer is always the odd man out.

[BorderlineCrazy]

3 minutes ago, Order of Nine said:

How can anyone take Adler seriously all these years later and not wonder how big of a liability he could be? He has not matured much imho since his departure and his antics while sober are irritating at best.

How can anyone take Axl seriously all these years later and not wonder how big of a liability he could be? He has not mature at all since he was in school in Indiana and the fact that he has to carry a brazilian family to take care of him everywhere he goes is embarrasing at best.

Also, every single GNR show that went wrong (started late, ended early causing a riot, got canceled) was Axl's fault, not Steven's, Slash's, Buckethead's or anyone else's. The only exception is Donington 88.

Using your beyond stupid logic, go watch St. Louis 1991 and ask yourself if you would want a world tour with that guy.

The only decent answer to all this is "there's no GNR without Axl" and that's true but that proves the hypocrisy of certain fans who judge Steven way harder just because they don't care about him and don't think he's important.

[Padme]

15 minutes ago, Order of Nine said:

How can anyone take Adler seriously all these years later and not wonder how big of a liability he could be?

Yes, he could be a liability. We are not sure. You know what. I'd rather see Adler as full time drummer. If he fucks things up, you can tell me "I told you so". At least we all will know for sure that he doesn't deserve another chance.

 

4 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Ah, but not ONLY because he was immature and annoying. That's what I thought you meant.

In my opinion, he was mainly fired because he was a fuck up, and then because the other band members started to dislike him more and more.

But then you agree the main reason he was fired it was drugs. He was fucked up because of drugs. I'm not so sure other members dislike him

[SoulMonster]

1 minute ago, Padme said:

But then you agree the main reason he was fired it was drugs. He was fucked up because of drugs. I'm not so sure other members dislike him

No, the main reason was his inability to play not simply because he was on drugs. 

7 minutes ago, BorderlineCrazy said:

How can anyone take Axl seriously all these years later and not wonder how big of a liability he could be? He has not mature at all since he was in school in Indiana and the fact that he has to carry a brazilian family to take care of him everywhere he goes is embarrasing at best.

Also, every single GNR show that went wrong (started late, ended early causing a riot, got canceled) was Axl's fault, not Steven's, Slash's, Buckethead's or anyone else's. The only exception is Donington 88.

Using your beyond stupid logic, go watch St. Louis 1991 and ask yourself if you would want a world tour with that guy.

The only decent answer to all this is "there's no GNR without Axl" and that's true but that proves the hypocrisy of certain fans who judge Steven way harder just because they don't care about him and don't think he's important.

Where's the hypocrisy in not caring about Steven or having the opinion that he is not important for GN'R? Sure you use 'hypocrisy' correctly?

[Blackstar]

7 minutes ago, EvanG said:

Poor guy, he sounds like every drummer I've ever played with. 

The drummer is always the odd man out.

He also said when he filed that lawsuit that when they were dividing the publishing for AFD, the rest of the band didn't want to give him songwriting credits.

 

[Order of Nine]

6 minutes ago, BorderlineCrazy said:

How can anyone take Axl seriously all these years later and not wonder how big of a liability he could be? He has not mature at all since he was in school in Indiana and the fact that he has to carry a brazilian family to take care of him everywhere he goes is embarrasing at best.

Also, every single GNR show that went wrong (started late, ended early causing a riot, got canceled) was Axl's fault, not Steven's, Slash's, Buckethead's or anyone else's. The only exception is Donington 88.

Using your beyond stupid logic, go watch St. Louis 1991 and ask yourself if you would want a world tour with that guy.

The only decent answer to all this is "there's no GNR without Axl" and that's true but that proves the hypocrisy of certain fans who judge Steven way harder just because they don't care about him and don't think he's important.

Yeah. You make PERFECT sense. Let's see guns do a show without Axl.

Your brilliant!! 

[Srushti7]

On Thursday, April 12, 2018 at 5:45 PM, ludurigan said:

"My goal was to finish what I started, and Izzy’s too. Iz is just as heartbroken as I am that the three of them decided to leave us out and bring three strangers in–who are those people?"
[Steven Adler, Hysteriamag.com, April 2018]

Full interview here = http://www.hysteriamag.com/steven-adler-guns-blazin/

 

I don't think heartbroken and Izzy fuck with each other at all.

Jokes apart I don't think Izzy gives a fuck about the reunion. If he gets paid well he'll do it else not. 

Slash? I don't know the exact reason why's he doing it. Maybe coz of the divorce sucking him out of half his money (his ex wife is a joke 😂) or maybe because he genuinely wanted to do it because he did seem open to the idea of a reunion. 

No special thoughts on Duff

Axl don't know why's he doing it 

Steven seems the only one who is heartbroken over it. 

PS for whatever reasons they're doing it, the outcome is fucking awesome.