GNR Women's Discussion - Part 2

[MillionsOfSpiders]

Day tickets for Download are going on sale early 2018.

I got Iron Maiden tickets for Manchester Arena last week. 

[MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle]

2 hours ago, Padme said:

The only song I remember he mentioned as written during the UYI tour was TIL. Then apparently there are other songs Axl, Slash and Duff wrote with Izzy. But that was around 94 or 95. Izzy didn't stay very long. Hard to say much they got done

Yeah, he wrote TIL and he wrote Oklahoma which he later changed to Berlin for some reason.  There was speculation that he laid down some melodies for the scrapped 96 sessions but he never sang anything.  @Blackstar I can't remember where I read that about the melodies?  Do you know anything about that?  Then he played around with something for a Jackie Chan movie which never came off - during Slash's 'probationary' period.  Basically tinkering around the tool shed.  

After Slash left the tinkering stopped altogether and he started collecting guitarists, producers and various musicians for his menagerie.   In 95?? he wrote Down By The Sea or whatever that was called with Izzy.  I find it interesting that after the Bob Ezrin debacle, when the label lost faith in Axl and Axl lost faith in everyone, he returned to that Izzy song and considered it (for CD).  Can't remember why he never did anything with it in the end, but it's almost as if was trying to go back, in order to move forward...maybe trying to return to his roots?  He must have been in such a confused state at that time. 

Edit: he mustn't have written melodies for 96 sessions.  Don't know why I had that in my head.

"I didn't write for years [after the Illusions]. [During the UYI tour, Slash, Duff and Stephanie Seymour] did damage to my ability as a writer.  To those three it was all crap.  It beat me down so much." (Axl, USA Today, 11/01/12).

Edited November 29, 2017 by MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle

[Blackstar]

@MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle I don't remember reading something about Axl writing melodies without words in that period. Zakk Wylde said there were no melodies, no lyrics, no vocals (in '95). Slash said he probably hadn't heard Axl sing for the whole '94-'96 period - nothing about melodies from what I remember. (Axl did vocals though in '96, on West Arkeen's band's album). The '96 sessions with Slash were seemingly very short, 1-2 weeks or so. Most of the scraped material with Slash that's in Axl's vault must date back to '94.

Maybe you mean later (about early '98), when Youth had been recruited as producer and said that they were strumming guitars and writing songs with Axl in his kitchen and he finally got Axl to sing again after 18 months?

Izzy had written more songs during the sessions with Duff in '95 (or maybe he had them ready beforehand) but he took most of them with him when he left, and it seems Axl kept only Down By The Ocean.

Oklahoma was written in '95 the earliest (imo it was written later), because it had to do Erin's lawsuit and the civil case trial which took place in Oklahoma in that year.

 

Edited November 29, 2017 by Blackstar

[MillionsOfSpiders]

7 hours ago, KiraMPD said:

Still hoping for that Angus/Axl collab. 

Me too: 

This song is legitimately the most rock n roll thing I've ever experienced   

The band, the vocals, the crowd, the sheer volume.....Angus Young!!! 

I couldn't stop bouncing  

Edited November 29, 2017 by MillionsOfSpiders

[MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle]

21 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

@MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle I don't remember reading something about Axl writing melodies without words in that period. Zakk Wylde said there were no melodies, no lyrics, no vocals (in '95). Slash said he probably hadn't heard Axl sing for the whole '94-'96 period - nothing about melodies from what I remember. (Axl did vocals though in '96, on West Arkeen's band's album). The '96 sessions with Slash were seemingly very short, 1-2 weeks or so. Most of the scraped material with Slash that's in Axl's vault must date back to '94.

Maybe you mean later (about early '98), when Youth had been recruited as producer and said that they were strumming guitars and writing songs with Axl in his kitchen and he finally got Axl to sing again after 18 months?

Izzy had written more songs during the sessions with Duff in '95 (or maybe he had them ready beforehand) but he took most of them with him when he left, and it seems Axl kept only Down By The Ocean.

Oklahoma was written in '95 the earliest (imo it was written later), because it had to do Erin's lawsuit and the civil case trial which took place in Oklahoma in that year.

 

Yes, I remember Zakk Wylde's comment now and about Youth.  I think you're right - I got confused with vocals for West Arkeen's album.  Thanks for the clarification.

Honestly, the whole thing is such a mass of dates and timelines and I don't have a database. Drives me crazy.    I don't know how you keep up with it all, but you're a champion for doing so!

Just to add, apparently the Oklahoma song was written in tribute to the Oklahoma bombing.  Seems the timing with Erin's lawsuit, for which he had to appear the day after, affected him.

"This person is spewing all kinds of things and 168 people just got killed. And this person I'm sitting there with, she don't care. Obliterating me is their goal.'" (Axl, Rolling Stone, 2000)

"'I was sitting in my litigation with my ex-wife [Erin Everly], and it was [April 20th, 1995,] the day after the [Oklahoma City] bombing,' Rose remembers with a wince." (Rolling Stone, 2000)

"Axl wrote [Oklahoma] with inspiration from the Oklahoma City bombing (more as a tribute to those who died, if I'm not mistaken)." (Dave Dominguez, Sp1at, 02/07/05)

[Blackstar]

@MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle, yes, the timeline is a mess. Even Chinese Whispers, which is an admirable work and great collection of sources (these people who made it must have put a lot of work and spent a lot of time to complete this thing) messes it up here and there, esp. for 1994-96. I combine sources, dates of interviews etc.

[Politania]

6 hours ago, Georgina Arriaga said:

@Politania.....thanks in advance for the information, but like the other ladies said, if the info comes from Fortus...huge grain of salt.

By the way...in your info there is something AC/DC ish in the works?

According to this lady, Axl was coughing a lot last night, I put the video here because Axl looks less chubby

 

Axl is not that chubby. He works out a lot.

For what i know there are not any plans for Axl abd Ac/Dc

6 hours ago, Padme said:

If you mean CD II, Axl wasn't the only writer. He did it with the help of Finck, Buckethead, Brain, Stinson, Dizzy and Pitman. Still we don't know all the facts. Axl already said in 2001 they were working on more than one album. We have titles of songs. But we don't if all of them are finished songs ready to go. Even if that was the case. I'm not so sure Slash and Duff will happy if they have to rewrite all those songs

No, I didnt mean CDII. 

[Politania]

6 hours ago, Blackstar said:

If I understand correctly , @Politania doesn't mean CDII, but songs Axl had written during the UYI tour. He has mentioned that he'd written some songs during that period (which, my understanding is, he had abandoned and have nothing to do with CD)

Exactly.  Frank mentioned about it either

[Padme]

25 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

@MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle, yes, the timeline is a mess. Even Chinese Whispers, which is an admirable work and great collection of sources (these people who made it must have put a lot of work and spent a lot of time to complete this thing) messes it up here and there, esp. for 1994-96. I combine sources, dates of interviews etc.

Ok then, with the exception of TIL nothing was written during the UYI Tour. At least there is no clear evidence of such a thing.

[Blackstar]

10 minutes ago, Padme said:

Ok then, with the exception of TIL nothing was written during the UYI Tour. At least there is no clear evidence of such a thing.

There is the Axl quote @MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle posted above:

"I didn't write for years [after the Illusions]. [During the UYI tour, Slash, Duff and Stephanie Seymour] did damage to my ability as a writer.  To those three it was all crap.  It beat me down so much." (Axl, USA Today, 11/01/12).

Also this:

"Also, anything I had written I felt was in similar directions [to Appetite] then, during and after the 'Illusions' tour was more than rejected by both Slash and Duff at a time, which greatly helped destroy whatever confidence I may have had at the time." (Axl interview by Del James, spinner.com, 2009)

12 minutes ago, Politania said:

Exactly.  Frank mentioned about it either

When did Frank mention it? And how does Frank know?

 

Edited November 29, 2017 by Blackstar

[MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle]

I'm almost certain there are multiple reasons for Axl not having released anything since CD, however, I wonder if one of the main reasons is because he simply lacks confidence in his ability?  

When you think about Slash and Duff rejecting his work (their opinions would have mattered to Axl the most, especially Slash's) and then with ongoing rejection from Geffen/Interscope (I will never forgive Jimmy Iovine for siding with Bob Ezrin at a crucial time), plus the hiding CD copped from the fans once it was released and the mixed reception from critics, and the under performance of CD sales wise, you have to admit, that would dent anyone's confidence.  

No matter how we perceived things to have gone down, in Axl's mind he did all he could.  In Axl's mind, he gave it his all and couldn't have tried harder.  Maybe he just gave up because he thought what's the point?  No one is going to appreciate my efforts, no matter what I do.

Funnily enough, in the years after, in interviews, Axl would say on more than one occasion that what he likes is strength in a person and the ability to 'bounce back' from a knock down.  He doesn't appear to have bounced back from his knock-down, has he?  Or has he?  

[Padme]

42 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

There is the Axl quote @MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle posted above:

"I didn't write for years [after the Illusions]. [During the UYI tour, Slash, Duff and Stephanie Seymour] did damage to my ability as a writer.  To those three it was all crap.  It beat me down so much." (Axl, USA Today, 11/01/12).

Also this:

"Also, anything I had written I felt was in similar directions [to Appetite] then, during and after the 'Illusions' tour was more than rejected by both Slash and Duff at a time, which greatly helped destroy whatever confidence I may have had at the time." (Axl interview by Del James, spinner.com, 2009)

When did Frank mention it? And how does Frank know?

 

I'm not so sure Slash and Duff were in a position to reject or support anything. Those two were wasted 24/7 during the UYI Tour. And Axl had little relationship with both of them. He was always with his entourage. His own separated room back stage. I read that interview in USA Today. He just sounded so butt hurt blaming Slash, Duff and Stephanie for everything. On top of that how could he say his songs were kinda like AFD when CD has zero similarities with anything AFD?

[Asia]

2 minutes ago, Padme said:

I'm not so sure Slash and Duff were in a position to reject or support anything.

How were they not when they had to agree for everything Axl puts on the record, not to mention they had to write their guitars to it? They were equal partners in the band. They were in a position to support and reject everything.

 

4 minutes ago, Padme said:

And Axl had little relationship with both of them

Apparently not, considering how hurt and for how many years he felt after what they've done.

[MillionsOfSpiders]

 

(sorry to interrupt :p)

[Tori72]

1 minute ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

 

(sorry to interrupt :p)

I don't get it.... 

[Asia]

Me neither but I like this picture

[Tori72]

Isn't it from the Argentinian interviews. He looked so adorably awkward in it when the interviewer said he was attractive. 

[MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle]

5 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

 

(sorry to interrupt :p)

Feel free to interrupt with Slaxl? 

[MillionsOfSpiders]

There was some Australian band who said GnR stole the music for SCOM from them 

[Blackstar]

5 minutes ago, Padme said:

I'm not so sure Slash and Duff were in a position to reject or support anything. Those two were wasted 24/7 during the UYI Tour. And Axl had little relationship with both of them. He was always with his entourage. His own separated room back stage. I read that interview in USA Today. He just sounded so butt hurt blaming Slash, Duff and Stephanie for everything.

I don't know... Slash had written stuff during the tour although wasted. And they had some direct contact, since they were recording TSI on the road. Of course we can't take Axl's word as a fact.

Spoiler

On top of that how could he say his songs were kinda like AFD when CD has zero similarities with anything AFD?

Axl started writing CD years later though. He didn't have an album like CD in his mind in the UYI era.

[Padme]

9 minutes ago, Asia said:

How were they not when they had to agree for everything Axl puts on the record, not to mention they had to write their guitars to it? They were equal partners in the band. They were in a position to support and reject everything.

 

Apparently not, considering how hurt and for how many years he felt after what they've done.

They said in their books that during the UYI Tour how pissed off they were with Axl because he was always late. And they also said they were wasted with so much drugs and alcohol. And how little they talked to Axl. How could they discuss new songs and album direction?

[Asia]

Just now, Padme said:

They said in their books that during the UYI Tour how pissed off they were with Axl because he was always late. And they also said they were wasted with so much drugs and alcohol. And how little they talked to Axl. How could they discuss new songs and album direction?

Well, because they werent pissed 24/7 most likely. If you listen to their interviews from the 90-s there are plenty of cases where they mention discussing this or that with the other yesterday or the day before. Both Axl and Slash. And not only album direction but every day stuff.

[MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle]

1 minute ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

There was some Australian band who said GnR stole the music for SCOM from them 

Ahh...that was Australian Crawl.  Not true.  However it is well known that Guns were obsessed with certain Aussie bands at the time, and Aussie Crawl was one of them. Unpublished Critics (the song in question) is one of my all time favourite songs from that band. I don't think you can even hear a similarity?

https://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/rock/6568203/guns-n-roses-sweet-child-o-mine-australian-crawl

[BorderlineCrazy]

For those who don't understand, here you can see what that's about. http://www.metalinjection.net/shocking-revelations/did-guns-n-roses-sweet-child-o-mine-rip-off-an-australian-rock-song

Apparently they stole the song from a subpar version of The Police 

2 minutes ago, Tori72 said:

Isn't it from the Argentinian interviews. He looked so adorably awkward in it when the interviewer said he was attractive. 

It is. Bs.As. means Buenos Aires. The good old Frankless days.

-----------------------------------------------

Slash was never as wasted as we tend to believe, everyone who knows him have talked about it. He was always very professional and would take care of the business, handle the press, etc.

[MillionsOfSpiders]

Just now, MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle said:

Ahh...that was Australian Crawl.  Not true.  However it is well known that Guns were obsessed with certain Aussie bands at the time, and Aussie Crawl was one of them. Unpublished Critics (the song in question) is one of my all time favourite songs from that band. I don't think you can even hear a similarity?

https://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/rock/6568203/guns-n-roses-sweet-child-o-mine-australian-crawl

No me either, or the other band that claimed they stole patience. It just made me laugh