Satanic Baphomet statue unvealed in Detroit

[Forsaken]

[Iron MikeyJ]

I know Page was into a lot of that stuff, and that's his peragative. I learned a while ago to separate my own personal beliefs from those of my favorite musicans, if I hadn't I would be shacking up with some brazialian nany, right?lol.

But as for this topic, as you guys have said, and I have read elsewhere that a lot of satanism is just about abundunce, do what you want, rebellion, and what not. Which is all fine with me, but why associate with Satan is my question? That's where they lose me. If you are going to sit in a dark room listening to slayer, than whatever man. But if you are congregating with fellow "Satanist", wearing pigs and goat masks, and sacrficing goats and drinking the blood, well that is some weird Shit imo. Also, as I said before, if you are a mother and are raising children in this atmosphere, isn't that even more perverted than anything organized religions have to offer? But they sit around and mock organized religion, yet they practice this Shit? Seems very hypocritical imo.

There seems to be two separate forms of sataninst, those that are really atheists that for some reason disguise themselves as sataniats, which I don't understand. IMO that's the same as being an athestis but claiming to be cathloc. Then their are the true goat sacrificing, devil worshippers. Which those kind are unearving imo. But it's really the first group that I don't understand.

Having said all of this, I am not denying they have the right to exist, and practice whatever they want to practice. My problem tends to stem from the fact that they are making this big stance at the moment. Its just more of this "accept everybody" crap that's going on these days. This is an example of pushing the envelope, just to push the envelope. What happened to being told no?

Is it any weirder then eating a piece of bread and drinking wine claiming it is the body and blood of Christ? or that birth control and premarital sex is a verboten.

Or worst of all that being Gay is evil yet your priests are buggering alter boys and your church covers it up?

He who lives in a glass house should not throw stones yes?

I have no dog in this fight, as I am an atheist, but I find it very odd that some here are against Satanists practicing their religion. And with all due respect Mikey on one hand you claim to be tolerant to their religion and then go on to criticize it and infer some should just say no to that practice?

Man I don't know where to start with this post. For one, I never told what or if my religion even is, you just assumed. But since you did, yes sacrificing a goat then drinking it's blood is far stranger imo than pretending bread and wine is the body and blood of Christ.

Secondly, I don't have a problem with people practicing it, I have a problem with displaying a statue just to cause a stir. That's what I think should have been said "no" to. Which that's not just for satainist I feel this way about, if they wanted to put a giant statue of Christ in downtown Detroit, I would understand people not likeing that as well. That wouldn't personally bother me so much, but to Jewish, Arabic, and other religions of greater Detroit might take offense. I wouldn't argue that the statue should go up, nor would I argue against it being taken down.

Thirdly, I question the validity of "atheists" that are disgusing themselves as satanists. More than anything, I would just like to understand why they choose to side with them. Like you said, you are an atheists, which is fine imo. More power to you. But for "Satanist" that are really atheists seems hypocritical imo. They are essntially choosing a side, but also saying they believe in nothing. You can't have it both ways is my point.

Finally, the true goat killing satanists are a different breed imo. Yes they have a right to exist, I'm not saying they don't. But the true Anton Levay Satanists are about as "wacked" as you can get. They essentially do believe in everything all the other major religions do, but they choose to play for the other team. That's just plain crazy imo. To me, that's like accepting that aids exists and actively seeking out an aids patient to have unproductive sex with. Its like "what did you think was going to happen?" do they actually think the devil is going to put them not the less hot section of Hell? Its playing Russian rulloet with a gun that is fully loaded.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Iron MikeyJ

[Jakey Styley]

People like to feel a part of something.

[classicrawker]

I know Page was into a lot of that stuff, and that's his peragative. I learned a while ago to separate my own personal beliefs from those of my favorite musicans, if I hadn't I would be shacking up with some brazialian nany, right?lol.

But as for this topic, as you guys have said, and I have read elsewhere that a lot of satanism is just about abundunce, do what you want, rebellion, and what not. Which is all fine with me, but why associate with Satan is my question? That's where they lose me. If you are going to sit in a dark room listening to slayer, than whatever man. But if you are congregating with fellow "Satanist", wearing pigs and goat masks, and sacrficing goats and drinking the blood, well that is some weird Shit imo. Also, as I said before, if you are a mother and are raising children in this atmosphere, isn't that even more perverted than anything organized religions have to offer? But they sit around and mock organized religion, yet they practice this Shit? Seems very hypocritical imo.

There seems to be two separate forms of sataninst, those that are really atheists that for some reason disguise themselves as sataniats, which I don't understand. IMO that's the same as being an athestis but claiming to be cathloc. Then their are the true goat sacrificing, devil worshippers. Which those kind are unearving imo. But it's really the first group that I don't understand.

Having said all of this, I am not denying they have the right to exist, and practice whatever they want to practice. My problem tends to stem from the fact that they are making this big stance at the moment. Its just more of this "accept everybody" crap that's going on these days. This is an example of pushing the envelope, just to push the envelope. What happened to being told no?

Is it any weirder then eating a piece of bread and drinking wine claiming it is the body and blood of Christ? or that birth control and premarital sex is a verboten.

Or worst of all that being Gay is evil yet your priests are buggering alter boys and your church covers it up?

He who lives in a glass house should not throw stones yes?

I have no dog in this fight, as I am an atheist, but I find it very odd that some here are against Satanists practicing their religion. And with all due respect Mikey on one hand you claim to be tolerant to their religion and then go on to criticize it and infer some should just say no to that practice?

Man I don't know where to start with this post. For one, I never told what or if my religion even is, you just assumed. But since you did, yes sacrificing a goat then drinking it's blood is far stranger imo than pretending bread and wine is the body and blood of Christ.

Secondly, I don't have a problem with people practicing it, I have a problem with displaying a statue just to cause a stir. That's what I think should have been said "no" to. Which that's not just for satainist I feel this way about, if they wanted to put a giant statue of Christ in downtown Detroit, I would understand people not likeing that as well. That wouldn't personally bother me so much, but to Jewish, Arabic, and other religions of greater Detroit might take offense. I wouldn't argue that the statue should go up, nor would I argue against it being taken down.

Thirdly, I question the validity of "atheists" that are disgusing themselves as satanists. More than anything, I would just like to understand why they choose to side with them. Like you said, you are an atheists, which is fine imo. More power to you. But for "Satanist" that are really atheists seems hypocritical imo. They are essntially choosing a side, but also saying they believe in nothing. You can't have it both ways is my point.

Finally, the true goat killing satanists are a different breed imo. Yes they have a right to exist, I'm not saying they don't. But the true Anton Levay Satanists are about as "wacked" as you can get. They essentially do believe in everything all the other major religions do, but they choose to play for the other team. That's just plain crazy imo. To me, that's like accepting that aids exists and actively seeking out an aids patient to have unproductive sex with. Its like "what did you think was going to happen?" do they actually think the devil is going to put them not the less hot section of Hell? Its playing Russian rulloet with a gun that is fully loaded.

Fair enough and I respect your opinion but you are assuming there is a hell.

[Iron MikeyJ]

I was only assuming there was a Hell in my final point. I was basing that assumption upon the fact that the "true" Satanist believe that Lucifer is the deity that reigns over Hell. So by them believing in that, they also must believe in angels and heaven as well. Therefore, yes I find it to be idiotic and misguided to purposly side with Evil. Its just not something I really understand, because if Satan does indeed exist, it would be very unsatan like to show sympathy towards anyone, including his own followers. I guess the only thing I can relate it to us people that purposly join a crazy cult, then drink the special kool aid. What did you think was going to happen?

For me, it's just a logical principal. If you are going to choose to believe in the supernatural, then it is only logical to choose the side that is deemed "good". If then you are proven wrong, what have you really lost? Not much, because you are dead and nothing is left. But if you purposly choose the side of evil and are proven right, what have you gained? But again, it's predicated on the idea of belief, if you don't have that then it doesn't really matter either way I suppose.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Iron MikeyJ

[Len Cnut]

I think George pretty much nails it in these two videos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r-e2NDSTuE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CE8ooMBIyC8

But he doesnt though, does he? Listen, I love George Carlin but posting excerpts of stand up comedy shows as reflective of the length and breadth of your position regarding things like religion or any weighty topic is not really the way to be taken seriously about these things. Not cuz they dont very often have a point cuz they do but on the scale of things its like a 4 yr old doing their take on the Mona Lisa in crayon. Edited July 29, 2015 by Len B'stard

[SoulMonster]

I think George pretty much nails it in these two videos

But he doesnt though, does he? Listen, I love George Carlin but posting excerpts of stand up comedy shows as reflective of the length and breadth of your position regarding things like religion or any weighty topic is not really the way to be taken seriously about these things. Not cuz they dont very often have a point cuz they do but on the scale of things its like a 4 yr old doing their take on the Mona Lisa in crayon.

Religions are weighty things with lots of nuances, traditions, etc etc, and you can't really criticise all of this in brief comedy skits, right. But when it comes to the religions' rationale for belief, their arguments for believing what they do, why we should trust in whatever they profess to be truth, then it becomes very weak, feeble and simple; although they have attempted for thousands of years to dress up this lack of any good reasons with multiple layers of pseudo-intellectual theology. So this core of theism, the lack of reasons for belief, the irrationality of theisms, can easily be mocked, riduculed and completely destroyed through short snippets of monologue primarly written for comedic relief.

[Len Cnut]

I think George pretty much nails it in these two videos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r-e2NDSTuE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CE8ooMBIyC8

But he doesnt though, does he? Listen, I love George Carlin but posting excerpts of stand up comedy shows as reflective of the length and breadth of your position regarding things like religion or any weighty topic is not really the way to be taken seriously about these things. Not cuz they dont very often have a point cuz they do but on the scale of things its like a 4 yr old doing their take on the Mona Lisa in crayon.

Religions are weighty things with lots of nuances, traditions, etc etc, and you can't really criticise all of this in brief comedy skits, right. But when it comes to the religions' rationale for belief, their arguments for believing what they do, why we should trust in whatever they profess to be truth, then it becomes very weak, feeble and simple; although they have attempted for thousands of years to dress up this lack of any good reasons with multiple layers of pseudo-intellectual theology. So this core of theism, the lack of reasons for belief, the irrationality of theisms, can easily be mocked, riduculed and completely destroyed through short snippets of monologue primarly written for comedic relief.

I dunno about completely destroyed but i agree overall with what you say, you can construct a kind of soundbytey summation of your position that can get to the core of what a lot of people believe makes religions kinda backwards, as you can with many things by way of comedy.

[Dazey]

Satanism is an imaginary religion practiced by zitty smelly heavy metal nerds in order to look controversial.

All religions are imaginary but otherwise you're pretty much correct.

[classicrawker]

I think George pretty much nails it in these two videos

But he doesnt though, does he? Listen, I love George Carlin but posting excerpts of stand up comedy shows as reflective of the length and breadth of your position regarding things like religion or any weighty topic is not really the way to be taken seriously about these things. Not cuz they dont very often have a point cuz they do but on the scale of things its like a 4 yr old doing their take on the Mona Lisa in crayon.

Arguing religion is a waste of time IMHO as you will never change the other persons beliefs....................but I do reserve the right to "take the piss out" of the Christians here who seem to think their worship of their imaginary deity is somehow more noble then others worship of an imaginary deity...you of all people should appreciate that...........

[Len Cnut]

I think George pretty much nails it in these two videos

But he doesnt though, does he? Listen, I love George Carlin but posting excerpts of stand up comedy shows as reflective of the length and breadth of your position regarding things like religion or any weighty topic is not really the way to be taken seriously about these things. Not cuz they dont very often have a point cuz they do but on the scale of things its like a 4 yr old doing their take on the Mona Lisa in crayon.

Arguing religion is a waste of time IMHO as you will never change the other persons beliefs....................but I do reserve the right to "take the piss out" of the Christians here who seem to think their worship of their imaginary deity is somehow more noble then others worship of an imaginary deity...you of all people should appreciate that...........

Thats all well and good but I'm not sure what its got to do with what i was saying. You said Carlin 'nailed it' in those videos, which i took to mean he nailed the whole thing about religions, condensed and covered the issue of religion succinctly and i disagreed...how do you get from that to what you just posted? Did you feel someone was suggesting you didn't have the right to take the piss out of something? I wasn't, I wasn't even talking about any piss-taking, i thought you were trying to make a point with the Carlin vids, not taking the piss.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Len B'stard

[classicrawker]

I think George pretty much nails it in these two videos

But he doesnt though, does he? Listen, I love George Carlin but posting excerpts of stand up comedy shows as reflective of the length and breadth of your position regarding things like religion or any weighty topic is not really the way to be taken seriously about these things. Not cuz they dont very often have a point cuz they do but on the scale of things its like a 4 yr old doing their take on the Mona Lisa in crayon.

Arguing religion is a waste of time IMHO as you will never change the other persons beliefs....................but I do reserve the right to "take the piss out" of the Christians here who seem to think their worship of their imaginary deity is somehow more noble then others worship of an imaginary deity...you of all people should appreciate that...........

Thats all well and good but I'm not sure what its got to do with what i was saying. You said Carlin 'nailed it' in those videos, which i took to mean he nailed the whole thing about religions, condensed and covered the issue of religion succinctly and i disagreed...how do you get from that to what you just posted?

You are taking what I posted way too serious as I was just taking a piss mate as arguing religion is a fools errand.......... Considering how you were joking around earlier in the thread I never realized you were so passionate about religion.

[Len Cnut]

I think George pretty much nails it in these two videos

But he doesnt though, does he? Listen, I love George Carlin but posting excerpts of stand up comedy shows as reflective of the length and breadth of your position regarding things like religion or any weighty topic is not really the way to be taken seriously about these things. Not cuz they dont very often have a point cuz they do but on the scale of things its like a 4 yr old doing their take on the Mona Lisa in crayon.

Arguing religion is a waste of time IMHO as you will never change the other persons beliefs....................but I do reserve the right to "take the piss out" of the Christians here who seem to think their worship of their imaginary deity is somehow more noble then others worship of an imaginary deity...you of all people should appreciate that...........

Thats all well and good but I'm not sure what its got to do with what i was saying. You said Carlin 'nailed it' in those videos, which i took to mean he nailed the whole thing about religions, condensed and covered the issue of religion succinctly and i disagreed...how do you get from that to what you just posted?

You are taking what I posted way too serious as I was just taking a piss mate as arguing religion is a fools errand.......... Considering how you were joking around earlier in the thread I never realized you were so passionate about religion.

Just trying to make sense of what you're saying...and apparently getting nowhere So when you said 'Carlin nailed it', that was a joke? A joke on who, George Carlin? See what I'm saying about not making sense, you were taking the piss out of religion by way of making light of George Carlin...where he's criticising religion?

If you can make sense of that i will give you a million pounds Just to clarify, I'm not saying you are not making any sense in defence of some religion, I am not saying you are presenting an anti-religious argument that has holes in it, I am saying i literally cannot understand what you are talking about at all

Edited July 29, 2015 by Len B'stard

[classicrawker]

I think George pretty much nails it in these two videos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r-e2NDSTuE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CE8ooMBIyC8

But he doesnt though, does he? Listen, I love George Carlin but posting excerpts of stand up comedy shows as reflective of the length and breadth of your position regarding things like religion or any weighty topic is not really the way to be taken seriously about these things. Not cuz they dont very often have a point cuz they do but on the scale of things its like a 4 yr old doing their take on the Mona Lisa in crayon.

Arguing religion is a waste of time IMHO as you will never change the other persons beliefs....................but I do reserve the right to "take the piss out" of the Christians here who seem to think their worship of their imaginary deity is somehow more noble then others worship of an imaginary deity...you of all people should appreciate that...........

Thats all well and good but I'm not sure what its got to do with what i was saying. You said Carlin 'nailed it' in those videos, which i took to mean he nailed the whole thing about religions, condensed and covered the issue of religion succinctly and i disagreed...how do you get from that to what you just posted?

You are taking what I posted way too serious as I was just taking a piss mate as arguing religion is a fools errand.......... Considering how you were joking around earlier in the thread I never realized you were so passionate about religion.

Just trying to make sense of what you're saying...and apparently getting nowhere So when you said 'Carlin nailed it', that was a joke? A joke on who, George Carlin? See what I'm saying about not making sense, you were taking the piss out of religion by way of making light of George Carlin...where he's criticising religion?

If you can make sense of that i will give you a million pounds Just to clarify, I'm not saying you are not making any sense in defence of some religion, I am not saying you are presenting an anti-religious argument that has holes in it, I am saying i literally cannot understand what you are talking about at all

Sorry Lenny I am not seeing your point as I seem to have gotten under your skin concerning my busting the Christians stones. As I say I was just taking a piss at the holier than thou Christians here who seem to think their religion is something special. If you can't understand that then I guess my intent will have to remain one of the great mysteries in life. Never took you for the religious type but to each his own.

[Len Cnut]

I tap out Nevermind, it's OK man, you're right

[DieselDaisy]

Satanism is an imaginary religion practiced by zitty smelly heavy metal nerds in order to look controversial.

All religions are imaginary but otherwise you're pretty much correct.

It is not imaginary if you believe in that religion. It is the only true reality if you have faith in said religion.

[Lithium]

I believe in unicorns and leprechauns, therefore they exist.

[DieselDaisy]

Well if you believed in them they would exist or at least you would believe they existed.

[Lithium]

[Iron MikeyJ]

One thing I will say is that none of you can prove some sort of afterlife does not exist. You can mock organized religion all you want, it is a very flawed concept. Because it is a flawed concept does not mean that it has some validity or that it isn't based on something that COULD actually be a reality. The ability to disprove religion is just as weak as trying to prove it.

I just see and hear a lot of straw man arguments when it comes to religion. A lot of "millions of people have been killed in the be of God" and "Priests have touched little boys so therefore cathlocs are full of Shit" and of course my favorite "it's just a story book, it never happened."

My response is you can point out the problems or dwell on the negativity in anything, but that doesn't make you right. Has a lot of bad things been done in the name of religion? Yes of course. But who's really to blame for those things, religion or the humans that bent relgion to suit their needs? I think it's clearly people that have skewed religion to their own selfish needs. Its abusing the system, just like anything else. If a person commits crimes, is society to blame, or the person that did them? Religion has become a major scape goat For a lot of people, which I find to be sad. Sure you can make a strong argument that over the centuries religion was used to control the masses, and I don't disagree with that. That might be the biggest crime religion has ever committed. But again I have to go back and blame the people that were dumb enough to blindly follow anything without questioning it. To quote star wars, "who is the bigger fool, the fool or the fool who follows him?" especially in today's day and age.

What I'm trying to say, is that their is a lot of really good things you can get from religion. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. Sure their are crazies in both sides, those that accept everything and those that accept nothing. But like everything, isn't the truth somewhere in the middle? It doesn't matter What religion you follow, they all have certain things in common, they all believe in the same God (which is really interesting if you think about it), and they all preach peace and being a good person. I don't know how that isn't something that isn't positive. We should all strive to be good people, shouldn't we? If we all tried to be the best people we could be, wouldn't this world be a better place? I don't know how that couldn't be considered a good thing? That's the basic principal behind all major religions. They just don't all agree on the semantics, but instead of focusing on the differences, we should be looking at the similiarties.

[ZoSoRose]

Nothing can be as bad as our fucking stupid fist statue. Good ol' Detroit...

[DieselDaisy]

Nothing can be as bad as our fucking stupid fist statue. Good ol' Detroit...

Jesus, what the hell is that? It resembles something from Stalin''s Russia.

[Len Cnut]

Nothing can be as bad as our fucking stupid fist statue. Good ol' Detroit...

Jesus, what the hell is that? It resembles something from Stalin''s Russia.

Joe Louises fist/hand.

Nothing can be as bad as our fucking stupid fist statue. Good ol' Detroit...

Jesus, what the hell is that? It resembles something from Stalin''s Russia.

You take that back and pay your proper respects to the champ!

[Dazey]

Satanism is an imaginary religion practiced by zitty smelly heavy metal nerds in order to look controversial.

All religions are imaginary but otherwise you're pretty much correct.

It is not imaginary if you believe in that religion. It is the only true reality if you have faith in said religion.

Faith without evidence is meaningless.

[Iron MikeyJ]

I'm with Len on this one, that's Joe Louis' fist. That is my favorite statue in the entire freaking state. Shows some respect Zoso, lol. Did you know who's fist that was?