Who Have the Bigger Say in the Band- Slash or Team Brazil?

[double talkin jive mfkr]

19 hours ago, Top-Hatted One said:

There is no Team Brazil if there wasn't a Slash

this x1000

[Ota]

Axl was sick on Bridge School Benefit/ RIR 2011 probably too   And it's the fault of TB. It´s easy to find stick to beat dog.

https://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/190052/axl-rose-covers-neil-young-with-strep-throat/

http://ultimateclassicrock.com/guns-n-roses-singer-axl-rose-suffering-from-bronchitis-and-montezumas-revenge/

[killuridols]

6 hours ago, Ota said:

Axl was sick on Bridge School Benefit/ RIR 2011 probably too   And it's the fault of TB. It´s easy to find stick to beat dog.

https://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/190052/axl-rose-covers-neil-young-with-strep-throat/

http://ultimateclassicrock.com/guns-n-roses-singer-axl-rose-suffering-from-bronchitis-and-montezumas-revenge/

It's easy to make excuses for things that shouldn't happen to huge rockstars like Axl Rose, especially when they are being exposed to thousands of people on television.

It is called "taking care of the artist, of his image and name". That's what management do. 

[blackrose87]

On 8/31/2017 at 9:16 PM, MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle said:

Axl used to say it was him and Slash that managed the band and took care of business and they'd run ideas by Duff.  He used to say they were partners and that he was proud of that.  Personally, I wish he'd fire TB and go back to it being him and Slash running ideas by Duff again.  Cut loose all the extras and streamline.

Except that's impossibe. You can't have a giant "corporation" that is GNR with no kind of in-between management handling things.

[Tucknroll]

Anyone think axl put TB in his will? What if something happens to him? Who would own the name?

[ASLayerAODsk]

how is this even a question??

[killuridols]

8 hours ago, Tucknroll said:

Anyone think axl put TB in his will? What if something happens to him? Who would own the name?

Something will definitely happen to him. Just like to all of us.

[Tonto]

On 01/09/2017 at 5:54 AM, tremolo said:

Learning on the job is the best way to learn. Of course studying management and marketing helps a lot, and it is necessary for anyone who wants to build a career on that field, but learning hands on, learning from experience puts you way ahead of the game compared to those who rely solely on books.

But also depends who you are learning from. Fernando learned from his mother. And who are we kidding... what does his mother know? No disrespect intended, but come on...

It's safe to say management in GNR has been absolute shit for a long while. The same applies to marketing.

It is the way it is and it would be naive to expect any different.

Iovine? Come on, for fucks sake, that guy has a natural talent and that showed from very early in his career. He didn't get where he is because he was someone's son. The guy has proven himself to have the right mindset for what he does. Comparing Fernando and Iovine is plain nonsense. One got where he is because of his talent. The other got where he is because he is Beta's son.

Maybe Fernando has a natural talent too? Point is you don't know anything about it or anything about what Beta knows or doesn't know.

[Tonto]

On 31/08/2017 at 9:07 PM, killuridols said:

You said all sides were amicable many times over the years and that's not true. Especially for Slash and Axl.
Slash said he never talked to Axl since that day he quit GN'R, so I don't know how that can be considered an amicable situation.

Axl playing with Izzy doesn't mean he wanted him back in the band. He said he couldn't rely on Izzy for tours so he was invited to play a couple shows but that was it.

Axl never wanted to reunite with Adler for anything. Made peace but broke up again. I assume Adler was able to play the shows in 2016 because Duff and Slash convinced Axl, somehow, but it didn't last long.

Fernando is FAMILY to Axl. Before a manager, he was the son of whom Axl considers his "mother". So as a family member, you are supposed to take care of the ones you love and if you love your (uncle, dad, cousin, brother or whatever Fernando considers Axl to be) you care for their health and their well being.

It is not true that Axl was bigger in 2010 than 2014. Or you have vision problems. Also hearing problems. 2010 was one of the best years for Axl, singing wise. While by 2014, Mickey had full reign inside that throat.

This is 2010 Axl non-fat and great voice:

This 2014 super fat Axl, Mickey Mouse possesion:

 

Things done for me??

Who am I? Madonna?

If Fernando (or TB) had achieved anything that would have put this band back at the top of mountain, many years ago, when it should have happened, then OF COURSE I'd be praising him and thinking he is a great manager. Why would I say the contrary?

Not sure what is the bias you're talking about because there would be a bias if I was rooting for someone else, but I am not. Are you so ridiculous to think that I have some personal interest in this whole management thing?

His unexperience is really beside the point if for some reason the guy and his team would have done something to be proud of, as fans, but he hasn't and I listed all the failures before, so nope.... that's not solely the reason why I think these people are not good managers.

Of course I believe TB were involved and "instrumental" (tools) in the negotiations. Axl said it himself... "I told Fernando, get Slash number and call him"... so Fernando got the number and pressed the buttons . Now if you think that calling a number equals being the pivotal element that brought these guys together, then you truly have no idea what you're talking about.

 

Some many words and so very little said. I couldn't read it all to be honest, it's basically you having a conversation with yourself.

Get back to me when you have a rebuttal to my earlier points and please try and keep it under 300 words, you're lucky we're giving you any time at all, but don't take the piss, mate, some of us have other things to do. Short, sweet and to the point, that's what we expect from you in the future.

 

[Modano09]

I don't know who's calling the shots or who's ideas they've been, but since the reunion this whole operation has been pretty tight. The Trubadour show, show specific merchandise, the GNR museum, Axl/Slash/Duff's wardrobe being a throwback to the 90's sometimes.....there's just an attention to detail and professionalism to this that wasn't there through "Nu-GNR".

[killuridols]

1 hour ago, Tonto said:

Some many words and so very little said. I couldn't read it all to be honest, it's basically you having a conversation with yourself.

Get back to me when you have a rebuttal to my earlier points and please try and keep it under 300 words, you're lucky we're giving you any time at all, but don't take the piss, mate, some of us have other things to do. Short, sweet and to the point, that's what we expect from you in the future.

That clearly explains why you've called yourself TONTO.

[Tonto]

53 minutes ago, killuridols said:

That clearly explains why you've called yourself TONTO.

That's better!

[Tom2112]

On 8/31/2017 at 3:55 PM, killuridols said:

When it comes to music, I don't know how TB could justify anything against Slash.

Amd I don't think Slash gives input about finances and other business things. I don't know.

TB look to me more like an extra arm of Axl but not people who can come up with great ideas or new developments. They basically act like Axl supporters of Axl's ideas and wishes.

Sort of true, but not as well  Slash definitely cares about the financials and his personal management work with TB to keep him happy. Slash isn't personally going to TB and saying 'I want 5% more on merch per show' that would be his manager... and from the little I've heard that manager is fairly on point and knows how to make the $$$

Who has more power? Well, at the end of the day the artist is in charge... management fulfil the wishes of the artist... TB work for GNR... and GNR is essentially Axls band. It's complicated but I can't see Slash and Duff being happy playing 2nd fiddle to TB so in terms of power my guess would be 1. Axl 2. Slash. Duff. 3. TB. 4. Subsequent managers. 5. Rest of the band.

[triad]

3 hours ago, Tonto said:

Some many words and so very little said. I couldn't read it all to be honest, it's basically you having a conversation with yourself.

Get back to me when you have a rebuttal to my earlier points and please try and keep it under 300 words, you're lucky we're giving you any time at all, but don't take the piss, mate, some of us have other things to do. Short, sweet and to the point, that's what we expect from you in the future.

 

Nothing, that's what I'll be reading from you in the future.  Good-bye!   

[Tonto]

2 hours ago, triad said:

Nothing, that's what I'll be reading from you in the future.  Good-bye!   

Where are you sending me? Let me know by PM. Now let's get back topic. The champ wants to spa.

[killuridols]

7 hours ago, Tom2112 said:

Sort of true, but not as well  Slash definitely cares about the financials and his personal management work with TB to keep him happy. Slash isn't personally going to TB and saying 'I want 5% more on merch per show' that would be his manager... and from the little I've heard that manager is fairly on point and knows how to make the $$$

Who has more power? Well, at the end of the day the artist is in charge... management fulfil the wishes of the artist... TB work for GNR... and GNR is essentially Axls band. It's complicated but I can't see Slash and Duff being happy playing 2nd fiddle to TB so in terms of power my guess would be 1. Axl 2. Slash. Duff. 3. TB. 4. Subsequent managers. 5. Rest of the band.

You're right but what I meant is that I don't think (or I don't know) if Slash has a saying with how much the hired guns must be paid, for example. You know, stuff that is about the whole band, not just his own finances. Of course, his own manager fights the best money for him, but did Slash have a manager before the break up?

Thats what I'm trying to say.... Now it feels like they are three different entities and Axl is in charge of "the band".... but I really don't know because things are unclear. 

Another thing.... who decides if there will be a new album? I think that's a key decision and one of the reasons why they broke up. The inability to see eye to eye on the matter and reach an agreement. If they are a band like they were before, then this decision wouldn't be entirely on Axl's hands.

Yeah, I know management fulfills the needs of the artist, but don't they also help the artist get to a better place? Give advice? Show them possibilities of expansion, development, new businesses, new ways to capitalize their talent?

If I had a manager I'd want to get that kind of support from them too. I can't see TB giving that to Axl. They are clueless.

[jamillos]

Axl & Slash, with Duff.
Axl is TB. TB is really Axl’s family, there’s no distinction.

[Modano09]

42 minutes ago, tremolo said:

Point is that whoever has been managing the band for the last 3-4 years has been doing a terrible job.

The manager has wasted an incredible oportunity –probably the biggest in the history of GNR– to put the band out there, to get close to the fans, to get Axl in good vocal shape to deliver outstanding performances, to commemorate the 30th anniversary of AFD... it has been nothing but a disaster in every single department imaginable. Why even bring up the obvious problem regarding new music...

So, no. Fernando doesn't have a natural talent for management and he doesn't have a natural talent for marketing, and he doesn't have a natural talent for PR, brand placement, etc.

He does seem to have a decent talent for business. I mean, they are making money no matter how shitty everything related to GNR is at the time. They put out a fashion line of very expensive clothes, and I assume they are selling like hot cakes, otherwise it would be just another failure to the list.

Slash and Duff are back and they're currently in the midst of a two year tour that'll be one of the more lucrative tours of all time. They're doing alright.

[Tom2112]

15 hours ago, killuridols said:

You're right but what I meant is that I don't think (or I don't know) if Slash has a saying with how much the hired guns must be paid, for example. You know, stuff that is about the whole band, not just his own finances. Of course, his own manager fights the best money for him, but did Slash have a manager before the break up?

Thats what I'm trying to say.... Now it feels like they are three different entities and Axl is in charge of "the band".... but I really don't know because things are unclear. 

Another thing.... who decides if there will be a new album? I think that's a key decision and one of the reasons why they broke up. The inability to see eye to eye on the matter and reach an agreement. If they are a band like they were before, then this decision wouldn't be entirely on Axl's hands.

Yeah, I know management fulfills the needs of the artist, but don't they also help the artist get to a better place? Give advice? Show them possibilities of expansion, development, new businesses, new ways to capitalize their talent?

If I had a manager I'd want to get that kind of support from them too. I can't see TB giving that to Axl. They are clueless.

Before the initial break up Slash and the res of the band were all managed by the one manager. Right now, it's like you said three separate entities, Duff has his management, Slash has his and same with Axl & co. Did Slash have a say in the pay of the other members? I'd imagine it was talked about, but end of the day it's Axls job to pay them so it's of no consequence to Slash or Duff what anyone else is payed while they are clearly taking the lions share with Axl. 

Who gets to decide when it's time to make new music... same guy who has always pretty much called the shots in GNR... Axl. Yes, Slash and Duff have sway, but end of the day nothings getting done without Axl because if he's signed off on it, Richard, Dizzy, Frank and Melissa won't be getting their $$ and won't be making themselves available. 

Having said all of that, what do I know  that's just what I'd imagine is most likely. It's very interesting, especially considering where Slash's head was even 10 years ago in regard to not being a hired musician in GNR.

[Tom2112]

11 hours ago, tremolo said:

Point is that whoever has been managing the band for the last 3-4 years has been doing a terrible job.

The manager has wasted an incredible oportunity –probably the biggest in the history of GNR– to put the band out there, to get close to the fans, to get Axl in good vocal shape to deliver outstanding performances, to commemorate the 30th anniversary of AFD... it has been nothing but a disaster in every single department imaginable. Why even bring up the obvious problem regarding new music...

So, no. Fernando doesn't have a natural talent for management and he doesn't have a natural talent for marketing, and he doesn't have a natural talent for PR, brand placement, etc.

He does seem to have a decent talent for business. I mean, they are making money no matter how shitty everything related to GNR is at the time. They put out a fashion line of very expensive clothes, and I assume they are selling like hot cakes, otherwise it would be just another failure to the list.

ya'wha!? while GNR are on the biggest tour of their career it's really difficult to say that anyone in the GNR management team are doing a bad job. 1. they successfully negotiated a reunion 2. EVERY show has went off without any major hitches 3. $$$ and there's LOTS of it! 4. AFD Anniversary only matters to people on forums like this, although I'm obviously not saying that releasing a deluxe remastered version of AFD with outtakes and others extras wouldn't have been a good idea, and may have sold well.. but as for classic line up shows etc. people really don't seem to be that interested because they have 3/5 which ain't bad.

Totally agree, on the Fernando natural talent part. There's a lot left to be desired... BUT maybe his hands are tied? If Axl says "I don't want to do that" then Fernando is not gonna rock the boat.

[bigpoop]

A monkey could have negotiated that reunion. All it took was Axl deciding he was ready to do it. After that it sells itself.

[annabanana]

1 hour ago, bigpoop said:

A monkey could have negotiated that reunion. All it took was Axl deciding he was ready to do it. After that it sells itself.

True. A monkey or anyone could've negotiated the reunion. Axl needing money a rumor that has been around for how many years before the reunion and the divorce of slash is what brought the reunion about. Slash needs to recoup the 50% he lost on the divorce and the fastest and probably only way for him to do that is to reunite with axl. Equal partner or very highly paid employee probably doesn't matter he needs to get that money back. He is desperate to not pay his ex even claiming they were never married. So thank axl being broke and the divorce of slash for the reunion. 

Edited September 4, 2017 by annabanana

[killuridols]

9 hours ago, Tom2112 said:

Who gets to decide when it's time to make new music... same guy who has always pretty much called the shots in GNR... Axl. Yes, Slash and Duff have sway, but end of the day nothings getting done without Axl because if he's signed off on it, Richard, Dizzy, Frank and Melissa won't be getting their $$ and won't be making themselves available. 

I don't think this is the case of AFD or the Illusion albums. They all decided on that and that's why they went great.

Once Axl started deciding alone on when to release music, that's how we arrived to the pathetic waiting of decades to hear something new and we are still stuck on that. Next year will be 10 years since the release of Chinese Democracy.

9 hours ago, Tom2112 said:

ya'wha!? while GNR are on the biggest tour of their career it's really difficult to say that anyone in the GNR management team are doing a bad job. 1. they successfully negotiated a reunion 2. EVERY show has went off without any major hitches 3. $$$ and there's LOTS of it! 4. AFD Anniversary only matters to people on forums like this, although I'm obviously not saying that releasing a deluxe remastered version of AFD with outtakes and others extras wouldn't have been a good idea, and may have sold well.. but as for classic line up shows etc. people really don't seem to be that interested because they have 3/5 which ain't bad.

You should watch the interview of Axl and Duff with Brazilian TV last year. Axl clearly says he told Fernando to go get Slash number.

Does that sound like the idea was born in Fernando's head? Axl also says that Beta asked him if it was a joke, which clearly shows that not even Beta believed it until she saw it.

No one in TB moved a finger for this happening. It is obvious it was Axl's final decision and idea he was cooking in his mind probably from talks he previously had with Duff. Then Slash was invited for dinner and I assume that's when everything started rolling.

The shows are going smoothly because there are very strict contracts behind. Not because TB is disciplining Axl backstage. This is the same Axl and this is the same TB from decades ago, arriving late and being a mess. The only difference now is the millions of dollars that he could lose and the lawsuits he could face if he was going to fuck it up because of tantrums.

AFD anniversary doesn't matter only to people in the forum. That's so silly to say. That album deserved to be acknowledged artistically in some way but it wasn't. All that TB came up with is some lame ass fashion bullshit no fan cares about, only the posers. Something that only a handful of people in Los Angeles could see...... What's the point?

I think that's th biggest proof of TB being fucking useless and Axl being an idiot. It was done in such a strange shitty way that I'm not even sure if that was actually a celebration or what.

[Magnus Cavalerra]

How the fuck TB has anything to say, they basically just assistant/employee, Axl has all the say, they do what Axl tell to do, and they don't do anything what Axl told them not to do. 

 

Axl to Beta is just like Batman to Alfred, there's a lot example of this kind relationship on real life, especially around rich people, how the fuck you y'all micro analyzing this thing and come up with some kind of fanfic thesis is way beyond retard. Blaming someone's else butler it's pretty stupid too because they just do what their boss asked them to. 

[AXL_N_DIZZY]

Musically/performance-wise, Slash. Management/business- TB- though Axl with ultimate override power if he agrees with something Slash (or Duff) has come up with in that arena...

My guess is that it's just more focused on keeping the "Axl machine" rolling though- and whatever environment/management (TB) works for him is fine with Slash and Duff in this day and age. Just keep booking dates and kicking ass...