What Is Harassment?

[alfierose]

Don't worry Mysteron, womens sport won't exist in its own right for much longer, many of the titles and lucrative prizes are being steadily being taken by women born men using their special gifts of height, strength and speed.

http://www.cagepotato.com/after-being-tkod-by-fallon-fox-tamikka-brents-says-transgender-fighters-in-mma-just-isnt-fair/

http://abcnews.go.com/News/california-transgender-woman-plays-college-basketball/blogEntry?id=18037759&ref=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.co.uk%2Furl%3Fsa%3Dt%26source%3Dweb%26cd%3D2%26ved%3D0CCAQFjAB%26url%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fabcnews.go.com%252Fblogs%252Fheadlines%252F2012%252F12%252Fcalifornia-transgender-woman-plays-college-basketball%252F%26rct%3Dj%26q%3Dtransgender%2520college%2520basketball%2520player%26ei%3D4qZcVLeQJuSr7Aat2oHQBQ%26usg%3DAFQjCNEE23WwdJa0WcFk-_zf8tKa7jdMsQ%26bvm%3Dbv.79184187%2Cd.ZGU

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1354617/Transsexual-golfer-Mianne-Bagger-blasts-Lana-Lawless-female-birth-rules.html

[Patience 4 Axl]

You guys react like we hate or feel threatened by ALL men constantly. We don't and never said that.

But some people in this thread effectively have said that. It's them that most of the arguments are directed at.

Because people aren't allowed to feel a certain way? Who is anyone to decide whether someone else should feel threatened, intruded upon, embarrassed, by any given situation. No, no one has said they hate men. I do happen to dislike the attention they feel compelled to give on the street however. My argument from the beginning has been in reference to the initial video posted. She wasn't waiting on line at a Starbucks or for an elevator, she was walking the street minding her own business. Different scenarios, different comfort zones, different level of vulnerability, different social situations completely. That's why I've said, if you're walking in the street and someone says hello, because we all know sometimes it's just a hello, why not say it to everyone walking by. If it's just a friendly hello, why single one person out. There has to be some thought process behind it and I've yet to hear what it is. I've asked several questions and haven't received a response. Instead it's been twisted into perhaps not having a grasp of the English language, flattering oneself, and someone hates all men. None of which could be farther from the truth. I can twist it right back and say some men here obviously lack compassion and apparently hate women if they can't show empathy and would rather argue with one about her personal feelings no less, as opposed to acknowledging them. However, others in this thread seem to have absolutely no problem comprehending that women can feel harassed and not appreciate unwanted attention, they have a true respect for women and their opinions. These are real gentlemen. To quote nags, my faith in humanity has been restored.

[magisme]

I say hi to pretty girls because they're pretty. And because there's a 75% chance I'm going to rape them.

I also say hi to people with cute kids/pets, old people (especially women, only 10% rape there), and people wearing clothing featuring my favorite band/team/whatever. I could probably think of more, but the discussion is retarded since we're trying to tell men they can't say hello to a woman they don't know in public.

[Damn_Smooth]

I don't ever say hi to women. I look them right in the eye, punch them right in their cocksucker then drag them back to my cave. That's how it worked in the beginning and dammit, I'm taking it back.

Edited November 7, 2014 by Damn_Smooth

[Len Cnut]

I say hi to pretty girls because they're pretty. And because there's a 75% chance I'm going to rape them.

What happened to the other 25%?

[magisme]

I say hi to pretty girls because they're pretty. And because there's a 75% chance I'm going to rape them.

What happened to the other 25%?

They escape.

[netcat]

I don't ever say hi to women. I look them right in the eye, punch them right in their cocksucker then drag them back to my cave. That's how it worked in the beginning and dammit, I'm taking it back.

finally a normal guy among pro-feminist ubersexuals

[Facekicker]

I like how a certain poster in this thread has stated that it is impossible for a man to understand or know what it is like to be a woman and yet that very poster has the audacity to then claim to understand and know what men are thinking.

Typical.

[DR DOOM]

Fifty pages yo.

Also, "right in the cocksucker"

[magisme]

Only reason I started the thread was so I could launch the biggest and best "let's all be friends" campaign in forum history.

[Orsys]

I like how a certain poster in this thread has stated that it is impossible for a man to understand or know what it is like to be a woman and yet that very poster has the audacity to then claim to understand and know what men are thinking.

Typical.

Well, I can say in all honesty, I have no idea what you guys are thinking.

That's why I've said, if you're walking in the street and someone says hello, because we all know sometimes it's just a hello, why not say it to everyone walking by. If it's just a friendly hello, why single one person out. There has to be some thought process behind it and I've yet to hear what it is.

Pretty sure it's been mentioned a few dozen times in this thread already, but I'll say again what the thought process is: The person saying hello is attracted to the person to whom he/she is speaking. Trying to start conversation with someone you find attractive has never and will never be harassment, as long as it's done respectfully and as long as the speaker backs off if they are told "Not interested" or if they get no response at all.

Seriously, people ... 50 pages of this?

The fact that it has been mentioned a few dozen times, and then you mentioned again, is how it got to 50 pages.

[Facekicker]

Nobody can know that's the reason why we've developed this thing called communication.

[Len Cnut]

Well, I can say in all honesty, I have no idea what you guys are thinking.

Boobies

Arsenal FC

Football

Boxing

Weed

Good music

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand thans Len pretty much covered, it's pretty much always one of the above.

[DirtyDeeds]

So today I've got another story to share. It was raining today. I'm walking to the door of my building and a guy in front of me steps aside to hold the door open. I'm trying to close my umbrella and it's not working. Random guy is still standing there waiting. In the rain! I look up and say 'oh, that's ok, I'm trying to get this thing closed'. He reaches out and says 'let me try'. I'm still frantically pushing the button and it finally collapses. We walk into the lobby and ride up the elevator together, making small talk about the weather, how it's going to get colder, how we're not looking forward to the winter, blah blah blah.

For clarification are you citing this as an incident of harassment or a positive experience?

I didn't see the rest of her original post, but at least taken out of the context of that, that sure seems like a gentleman.

[SoulMonster]

That's why I've said, if you're walking in the street and someone says hello, because we all know sometimes it's just a hello, why not say it to everyone walking by. If it's just a friendly hello, why single one person out. There has to be some thought process behind it and I've yet to hear what it is.

Pretty sure it's been mentioned a few dozen times in this thread already, but I'll say again what the thought process is: The person saying hello is attracted to the person to whom he/she is speaking. Trying to start conversation with someone you find attractive has never and will never be harassment, as long as it's done respectfully and as long as the speaker backs off if they are told "Not interested" or if they get no response at all.

Seriously, people ... 50 pages of this?

And I think it is has been mentioned quite many times, too, that if you have numerous such encounters, even respectful ones, the sheer amount of them, the very fact that a woman can't just go do her business wthout having to respond to many such contacts, is often bothersome, annoying, and even could be felt as harassment (again, depending upon context and numbers), EVEN if each one was respectful enough and with absolutely no ill-intent. It's like telephone marketing. They might be as respectful as possible but I still don't appreciate the contact and if I have many such a day, especially a work day when I have better things to do (= on my way down the street to meet with someone, go somewhere, do something), then I might feel very annoyed, bothered, and even, to a certain extent, harassed by such completely unsolicited, uninvited and undesired contact (especially considered my number is now unlisted in business directories). They might try and succeed at charming me if they have done some research on me or my company, but it is still a distracting annoyance in a busy work day. Some men don't understand that if they MASK their contact with a compliment then magically the woman will appreciate it! [i know that for many men THE ONLY objective is to give a well-meant compliment and that there is NO masking involved. Okay, Dazey?] And yeah, that might work, a compliment well played will be accepted as a compliment. But I also understand it can get a bit too much at the receiving end, especislly when the compliments aren't well-played but comes across as insincere or automatic, something we men might be engineered NOT to understand, because, after all, for some of us there lies some self-preservation in being oblivious to not understand that our chatting up is flawed or unwelcome since it makes us try again and again untill we actually succeed. Edited November 7, 2014 by SoulMonster

[alfierose]

As long as no one is taking advice from this 'female attraction expert ' we might all learn to live side by side a little better.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/nov/05/julien-blanc-the-female-attraction-expert-glorifies-sexual-violence-the-less-seminars-he-holds-the-better

Is a platform for this better or worse than the nutty feminists Facekicker?

[alfierose]

I like how a certain poster in this thread has stated that it is impossible for a man to understand or know what it is like to be a woman and yet that very poster has the audacity to then claim to understand and know what men are thinking.

Typical.

Well, I can say in all honesty, I have no idea what you guys are thinking.

That's why I've said, if you're walking in the street and someone says hello, because we all know sometimes it's just a hello, why not say it to everyone walking by. If it's just a friendly hello, why single one person out. There has to be some thought process behind it and I've yet to hear what it is.

Pretty sure it's been mentioned a few dozen times in this thread already, but I'll say again what the thought process is: The person saying hello is attracted to the person to whom he/she is speaking. Trying to start conversation with someone you find attractive has never and will never be harassment, as long as it's done respectfully and as long as the speaker backs off if they are told "Not interested" or if they get no response at all.

Seriously, people ... 50 pages of this?

The fact that it has been mentioned a few dozen times, and then you mentioned again, is how it got to 50 pages.

Not true, it was already on Page 50 prior to my post!

But it really seems like some of you want to be able to dictate when a man is "allowed" to speak to you. Then instead of women walking around with the word "JUICY" plastered across their ass, they should have "Do not speak to me unless I speak to you first" written across it.

That will require quite a substantial behind unless we can get some state funding for men's magnifying glasses.

[SoulMonster]

That's why I've said, if you're walking in the street and someone says hello, because we all know sometimes it's just a hello, why not say it to everyone walking by. If it's just a friendly hello, why single one person out. There has to be some thought process behind it and I've yet to hear what it is.

Pretty sure it's been mentioned a few dozen times in this thread already, but I'll say again what the thought process is: The person saying hello is attracted to the person to whom he/she is speaking. Trying to start conversation with someone you find attractive has never and will never be harassment, as long as it's done respectfully and as long as the speaker backs off if they are told "Not interested" or if they get no response at all.

Seriously, people ... 50 pages of this?

And I think it is has been mentioned quite many times, too, that if you have numerous such encounters, even respectful ones, the sheer amount of them, the very fact that a woman can't just go do her business wthout having to respond to many such contacts, is often bothersome, annoying, and even could be felt as harassment (again, depending upon context and numbers), EVEN if each one was respectful enough and with absolutely no ill-intent. It's like telephone marketing. They might be as respectful as possible but I still don't appreciate the contact and if I have many such a day, especially a work day when I have better things to do (= on my way down the street to meet with someone, go somewhere, do something), then I might feel very annoyed, bothered, and even, to a certain extent, harassed by such completely unsolicited, uninvited and undesired contact (especially considered my number is now unlisted in business directories). They might try and succeed at charming me if they have done some research on me or my company, but it is still a distracting annoyance in a busy work day. Some men don't understand that if they MASK their contact with a compliment then magically the woman will appreciate it! [i know that for many men THE ONLY objective is to give a well-meant compliment.] And yeah, that might work, a compliment well played will be accepted as a compliment. But I also understand it can get a bit too much at the receiving end, something we men might be engineered NOT to understand, because, after all, for some of us there lies some self-preservation in being oblivious to not understand that our chatting up is flawed or unwelcome since it makes us try again and again untill we actually succeed.

I understand you may not appreciate the contact, that is certainly your prerogative ... but that comes with the territory of being at least a mildly attractive woman. It's no different than celebs who walk the street and constantly get approached, is that also harassment just because the celeb gets tired of it? Of course not, it comes with the territory. This is just another example of (mostly) women trying to re-define the definition of harassment, it's an accusation that is being misused and overused just as several other words ie: racist, sexist, homophobe, etc.

I find the idea that pretty women should just endure feeling bothered, annoyed or harassed because they happened to be born beautiful, very insensitive.

[SoulMonster]

And to follow up on that. I don't agree that celebs should endure it either, if they aren't celebs from a conscious career decision. People famours for, say, being born with a third eye in their forehead should also not have to endure uninvited and unwelcome attention. To follow this argument along, people who are ugly should also not having to endure unwelcome attention just because they were born that way. Just as I won't think that a beautiful girl should just accept unwlecome attention I also don't think a boy with Down's should just have to accept it.

[Orsys]

I find the idea that pretty women should just endure feeling bothered, annoyed or harassed because they happened to be born beautiful, very insensitive.

I think I'm okay looking, certainly not ugly. I've been told I am attractive especially when I smile. I agree that I should not have to spend time every morning preparing myself for my birthright of being harassed because I was lucky enough not to be born ugly, whatever that means since it is quite subjective. Again it comes down to my choices. I did not choose my looks, though I suppose I did choose to work with what I have and present myself the best I can. Oh, the burdens.

Now, if you look at me and smile and I smile back, I am consenting and it is a consent to potentially take a next step of saying hello or something. I can accept that and I can accept that this is the dance between men and women. And if it was always limited to that it could be tolerated. But if you catcall and give filthy or aggressive comments, my consent does not enter into it. And that is regardless of whether I look like Cindy Crawford or her pit bull.

If the smiles and hellos are a bloke genuinely interested in meeting a woman, I do find it a most inefficient way to do it, on the streets when they are on their way somewhere. And in the city? Taking a walk at lunch would become singles day on Yonge Street.

[Ace Nova]

It's no different than celebs who walk the street and constantly get approached, is that also harassment just because the celeb gets tired of it? Of course not, it comes with the territory. This is just another example of (mostly) women trying to re-define the definition of harassment, it's an accusation that is being misused and overused just as several other words ie: racist, sexist, homophobe, etc.

I understand your point here, but I think it's a little off. Celebrities are public figures and choose to be that way, therefore yes, that comes with the territory. Beautiful women didn't "choose" to be attractive and have no control over it.

On the other hand, if a beautiful woman chooses to dress in a sexually provocative way, then yes, that would come with the territory.

Edited November 7, 2014 by Kasanova King

[magisme]

I'm going to start a company that mass produces bubbles for people to live in. Seems I'll be rich.

[Len Cnut]

When i was little i saw Last Tango in Paris and it had a profound effect on me and like, there's this scene at the end where Marlon Brando is in this kinda...ballroom type place and he walks up to this bird and goes 'I'm awfully sorry to intrude, but I was so... struck with your beauty that I thought perhaps I could offer you a glass of champagne.' and it's been my lifes mission since then to try that line one day in reality, when i got all the sharp clobber on and i happen to find myself in some posh gaff

The idea that you could be just that inately attractive to women that all you've got to do is be honest. And that was the Brando hook, peircing eyes and just plain honesty. That'd never work in real life though eh? 'Hello....uh, woman. I noticed your robust bosom from across the room there and i thought 'fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuckin' hell boy, I could shag the arse off that!'. So uh, yeah, what'cha reckon love, fancy a tumble?'

Honesty my arse, see where honesty gets ya?

Y'know what i reckon the problem is? I reckon the problem is that I'm not Marlon Brando and Bertolucci isn't directing my life. Took me 31 years to suss that out. Now gimme the spaccers gold medal and fuck off out of my sight

[Ace Nova]

I'm going to start a company that mass produces bubbles for people to live in. Seems I'll be rich.

[The Glow Inc.]

Honesty my arse, see where honesty gets ya?

Honesty actually works for creating attraction....wait for it...if you are able to be honest without expectations and without freaking out.

I mean, just look at how easy it is to attract a girl you are not really interested in by simply being honest and laidback with her.