Something I’ve Been Thinking About a Lot..

[Underhardy]

It’s an absolute shame that we never got to witness a 2002 performance of There Was A Time. Seeing Finck and more importantly Buckethead hit their solos. And I believe that in 2002 Axl was best equipped to nail those screams. We’ve all seen his Live and Let Die scream from 2002, he had the power, stamina and rasp to absolutely nail it. It would’ve been a definitive performance from that era. Not sure why but this thought has kept coming to my head lately and I figured some of you guys would relate. 

[Spoon87]

14 minutes ago, Underhardy said:

It’s an absolute shame that we never got to witness a 2002 performance of There Was A Time. Seeing Finck and more importantly Buckethead hit their solos. And I believe that in 2002 Axl was best equipped to nail those screams. We’ve all seen his Live and Let Die scream from 2002, he had the power, stamina and rasp to absolutely nail it. It would’ve been a definitive performance from that era. Not sure why but this thought has kept coming to my head lately and I figured some of you guys would relate. 

True.

That 2002 line up was the most interesting line up of NuGuns. It's a shame that it never was let loose.

 

[username]

Thinking about what could (and probably should) have happened is a GnR fan's #1 mistake. Never do that. It's too sad. 

[Voodoochild]

1 hour ago, Underhardy said:

It’s an absolute shame that we never got to witness a 2002 performance of There Was A Time. Seeing Finck and more importantly Buckethead hit their solos. And I believe that in 2002 Axl was best equipped to nail those screams. We’ve all seen his Live and Let Die scream from 2002, he had the power, stamina and rasp to absolutely nail it. It would’ve been a definitive performance from that era. Not sure why but this thought has kept coming to my head lately and I figured some of you guys would relate. 

Maybe in 2002 we still didn't have Bucket's TWAT outro solo. And he would probably improvise it anyways.

[El Guapo]

1 hour ago, Spoon87 said:

True.

That 2002 line up was the most interesting line up of NuGuns. It's a shame that it never was let loose.

 

Yeah, not something anybody should be "thinking about alot" since it's completely pointless. :/

[Underhardy]

1 hour ago, Voodoochild said:

Maybe in 2002 we still didn't have Bucket's TWAT outro solo. And he would probably improvise it anyways.

How much studio time do we think Bucket gave the band in 2003/2004? I always assumed not much since that’s when things really got chaotic and stagnant for the band, and he was made a scapegoat for certain cancellations. 

[Karice]

1 hour ago, Underhardy said:

How much studio time do we think Bucket gave the band in 2003/2004? I always assumed not much since that’s when things really got chaotic and stagnant for the band, and he was made a scapegoat for certain cancellations. 

Why was BUCKETHEAD made a scapegoat for certain cancellations? 😵‍💫🤨😐🤔 Buckethead is a GUITARIST, not the Lead or even Co.lead Singer. Usually SINGERS are the scapegoats for cancellations, not GUITARISTS..🤔😐🤨😵‍💫

[Gunner Gilby]

4 hours ago, Underhardy said:

How much studio time do we think Bucket gave the band in 2003/2004? I always assumed not much since that’s when things really got chaotic and stagnant for the band, and he was made a scapegoat for certain cancellations. 

Well he's on several tracks on Chinese Democracy.

[ShadowOfTheWave]

Look up the word projection in the encyclopedia and you'll find this Axl quote: "During his tenure with the band, Buckethead has been inconsistent and erratic in both his behavior and commitment — despite being under contract — creating uncertainty and confusion and making it virtually impossible to move forward with recording, rehearsals and live plans with confidence. His transient lifestyle has made it impossible for even his closest friends to have nearly any form of communication with him whatsoever." LOL

[Gordon Comstock]

9 minutes ago, Gunner Gilby said:

Well he's on several tracks on Chinese Democracy.

 

Obviously, but it's long been rumoured his recordings were all done by 2002... seems like after that tour ended he was avoiding the band. Brain has talked about nobody being able to reach him, him being paranoid about GNR stuff, etc. We know from the Village leaks that plenty of his recordings were done before they'd ever played a show. It also seems like he quit well before the Rio 2004 cancellation that they blamed on him...

[Gunner Gilby]

24 minutes ago, Gordon Comstock said:

 

Obviously, but it's long been rumoured his recordings were all done by 2002... seems like after that tour ended he was avoiding the band. Brain has talked about nobody being able to reach him, him being paranoid about GNR stuff, etc. We know from the Village leaks that plenty of his recordings were done before they'd ever played a show. It also seems like he quit well before the Rio 2004 cancellation that they blamed on him...

Absolutely. Paul Tobias quit in 01 and he's on many tracks too.

[Gordon Comstock]

9 minutes ago, Gunner Gilby said:

Absolutely. Paul Tobias quit in 01 and he's on many tracks too.

 

Of course, but @Underhardy's question was about 2003-04. It's been a while since I really dug into that era but from what I remember, Bucket quit sometime in 2003, briefly came back, and quit again. They basically booked the Rio gig to try to get him back, which obviously didn't work, then blamed him for cancelling it.

edit: I'm pretty sure Axl mentioned Paul was still a 'studio guy' after he'd stopped touring, at least for a little while. He had a big role in compiling all the credits for the album. My point was I don't think Bucket spent much studio-time with GNR after 2002.

Edited May 8 by Gordon Comstock

[Karice]

6 minutes ago, Gordon Comstock said:

 

Of course, but @Underhardy's question was about 2003-04. It's been a while since I really dug into that era but from what I remember, Bucket quit sometime in 2003, briefly came back, and quit again. They basically booked the Rio gig to try to get him back, which obviously didn't work, then blamed him for cancelling it.

edit: I'm pretty sure Axl mentioned Paul was still a 'studio guy' after he'd stopped touring, at least for a little while. He had a big role in compiling all the credits for the album. My point was I don't think Bucket spent much studio-time with GNR after 2002.

Shame what happened with Buckethead. 😞 His guitar work on Chinese Democracy album is some of the best guitar work I have ever heard! 😀

Edited May 8 by Karice

[Gordon Comstock]

2 minutes ago, Karice said:

Shame what happened with Buckethead. 😞 His guitar work on Chinese Democracy album is some of the best guitar work I have ever heard! 😀

 

Have you listened to any of his solo music?

 

 

[Jakey Styley]

13 minutes ago, Gordon Comstock said:

 

Have you listened to any of his solo music?

 

Whew, this song always pops into my head and I couldn't remember the name of it. Thanks!

[El Guapo]

3 hours ago, Jakey Styley said:

Whew, this song always pops into my head and I couldn't remember the name of it. Thanks!

Albino Slug is pretty great, I'm getting into that album right now.

 

[Voodoochild]

15 hours ago, Underhardy said:

How much studio time do we think Bucket gave the band in 2003/2004? I always assumed not much since that’s when things really got chaotic and stagnant for the band, and he was made a scapegoat for certain cancellations. 

We don't know for sure. I assume they were still doing a lot of recordings in 2002 and 2003 just based on how the songs were presented live and how they were still evolving from the European tour to the US/Canada tour in 2002 (The Blues got an outro solo by Richard, Chinese got a second solo by Bucket). 

11 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said:

 

Obviously, but it's long been rumoured his recordings were all done by 2002... seems like after that tour ended he was avoiding the band. Brain has talked about nobody being able to reach him, him being paranoid about GNR stuff, etc. We know from the Village leaks that plenty of his recordings were done before they'd ever played a show. It also seems like he quit well before the Rio 2004 cancellation that they blamed on him...

My main reason to think that Bucket was still recording in late 2002 and 2003 is how some of the final album versions differs to the 2001/02 arrangements. The Blues had not only Bucket replacing Richard's outro solo, but also adding an acoustic guitar for most of the first half of the song. Chinese Democracy not only got that second solo, but also a lot of leads throughout the whole track. Riad's outro is also very different than the 2000 demo and the 2002 performances. 

Of course, it could be just that those were all recorded in 2002 but still not rehearsed or properly incorporated in the arrangement, but I think it's likely that they still had plenty of studio time booked for 2003. Obviously, there are also some of Bucket's work that were just comped from several different takes, and that includes the possibility that Axl and Caram used even takes from different songs to comp together a solo or a song like Scraped. 

[themadcaplaughs]

17 hours ago, Underhardy said:

How much studio time do we think Bucket gave the band in 2003/2004? I always assumed not much since that’s when things really got chaotic and stagnant for the band, and he was made a scapegoat for certain cancellations. 

I've referenced in the past, but the word I got from someone who worked on Bucket's crew in the early 2010s was that he quit the band in early 2003. He wanted to quit the band immediately following the cancellation of the tour, but hung around in hopes the fiasco might encourage Axl to finish the record to try and save face. When it became clear that wasn't going to happen, Bucket tendered his resignation. And, I was specifically told it wasn't the story we got at the time that Bucket just stopped showing up; he told management he was leaving. The chances of him ever coming back were close to zero, but those chances got decimated after Axl issued that press release blaming Bucket for the cancellation of the 2004 show. Bucket felt that he had done everything the right way in terms of his departure and was being thrown under the bus. Back in the 2008 chats, Axl kind of sort of apologized to Buckethead and admitted that a lot of things management told him regarding Bucket were not true. 

Edited May 8 by themadcaplaughs

[El Guapo]

1 hour ago, themadcaplaughs said:

I've referenced in the past, but the word I got from someone who worked on Bucket's crew in the early 2010s was that he quit the band in early 2003. He wanted to quit the band immediately following the cancellation of the tour, but hung around in hopes the fiasco might encourage Axl to finish the record to try and save face. When it became clear that wasn't going to happen, Bucket tendered his resignation. And, I was specifically told it wasn't the story we got at the time that Bucket just stopped showing up; he told management he was leaving. The chances of him ever coming back were close to zero, but those chances got decimated after Axl issued that press release blaming Bucket for the cancellation of the 2004 show. Bucket felt that he had done everything the right way in terms of his departure and was being thrown under the bus. Back in the 2008 chats, Axl kind of sort of apologized to Buckethead and admitted that a lot of things management told him regarding Bucket were not true. 

Management...fuckheads.

[Karice]

7 hours ago, themadcaplaughs said:

I've referenced in the past, but the word I got from someone who worked on Bucket's crew in the early 2010s was that he quit the band in early 2003. He wanted to quit the band immediately following the cancellation of the tour, but hung around in hopes the fiasco might encourage Axl to finish the record to try and save face. When it became clear that wasn't going to happen, Bucket tendered his resignation. And, I was specifically told it wasn't the story we got at the time that Bucket just stopped showing up; he told management he was leaving. The chances of him ever coming back were close to zero, but those chances got decimated after Axl issued that press release blaming Bucket for the cancellation of the 2004 show. Bucket felt that he had done everything the right way in terms of his departure and was being thrown under the bus. Back in the 2008 chats, Axl kind of sort of apologized to Buckethead and admitted that a lot of things management told him regarding Bucket were not true. 

Isn't doing the right thing and RESIGNING and still end up being used as a scapegoat, being thrown under the bus, and unfairly looking like the bad guy , and the truth only being revealed about 21 YEARS after the fact a good example of,"No good deed goes unpunished?"🥶😵‍💫 Poor Buckethead. 😞

Edited May 8 by Karice

[Gunner Gilby]

1 hour ago, Karice said:

Isn't doing the right thing and RESIGNING and still end up being used as a scapegoat, being thrown under the bus, and unfairly looking like the bad guy , and the truth only being revealed about 21 YEARS after the fact a good example of,"No good deed goes unpunished?"🥶😵‍💫 Poor Buckethead. 😞

But on the upside being in GN'R for that short time raised Buckets profile. I'm sure after leaving Guns his album sales and attendance and concerts increased. So it's not all bad. 

[Gordon Comstock]

On 5/7/2024 at 6:45 PM, Karice said:

Shame what happened with Buckethead. 😞 His guitar work on Chinese Democracy album is some of the best guitar work I have ever heard! 😀

 

Check this song out, it's from his most recent project with a singer named Madeline Cyrille Miller. The album has some good songs, but this is my favourite.

 

 

[Karice]

Delete.

Edited May 15 by Karice
I mixed up two VERY similar Threads. 😉

[evilfacelessturtle]

On 5/7/2024 at 1:47 PM, Underhardy said:

It’s an absolute shame that we never got to witness a 2002 performance of There Was A Time. Seeing Finck and more importantly Buckethead hit their solos. And I believe that in 2002 Axl was best equipped to nail those screams. We’ve all seen his Live and Let Die scream from 2002, he had the power, stamina and rasp to absolutely nail it. It would’ve been a definitive performance from that era. Not sure why but this thought has kept coming to my head lately and I figured some of you guys would relate. 

The LALD scream just happens to be in the perfect pitch and register for him to belt it out to this day. I don't think you can really use that as a barometer for anything else.

[mikeman5150]

2 hours ago, evilfacelessturtle said:

The LALD scream just happens to be in the perfect pitch and register for him to belt it out to this day. I don't think you can really use that as a barometer for anything else.

But 2002 was different. I’m thinking the NYC and Pittsburgh shows specifically, it was on another level. More intense than it was during his prime.