Floyd Discussion

[SAU3R]

Ouch…

[username]

25 minutes ago, SAU3R said:

Ouch…

     

Shots. Fired. 

[Cosmo]

I’m with Roger Waters on this one. 

[ZoSoRose]

The Polly and David twitter stuff is lame but I can’t  fault them for wanting to make their stance on Roger clear since he will always be associated with the PF brand.

Roger has lost his mind over the years. He’s a real loon

David and Nick should do a final PF tour with the Ukraine song in the set to spite him 

Edited February 7, 2023 by ZoSoRose

[Gordon Comstock]

Roger Waters: Why I’ve re-recorded The Dark Side of the Moon – without Pink Floyd

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/music/artists/roger-waters-pink-floyd-dark-side-moon-gilmour-putin-ukraine/

A recent reissue of Pink Floyd’s 1977 album Animals was delayed for four long years – and that was just due to a squabble over liner notes. Now Waters is planning to release a rival version of Pink Floyd’s most famous record, without Pink Floyd’s permission. I’m no copyright expert, but might there be some obstacles to that? Waters smiles: “I have no idea.”

After we speak, his rep phones up to say the album – originally set for March – has been pushed back to May, as Waters still hasn’t quite finished tinkering with the recordings. A big concert that was meant to launch it in March has also been postponed, probably to May, and moved to a different venue. It all sounds a bit shambolic, but they assure me the release is definitely happening.1

-----

Eventually, finally, at long last, I get to listen to the album. It turns out to be a curate’s egg; parts are very good indeed. Time, that young man’s lament for mortality, sounds terrific with his old man’s timbre. Breathe is wonderfully reimagined as a slow, acoustic groove. A country-tinged Money could be a late Johnny Cash cut, with Waters growling charismatically at the very bottom of his register.

But, surprisingly, Waters seems to have decided that what was wrong with the original album’s beautiful instrumental tracks was that they didn’t have Waters talking all over them. Now they do.

After a bad dream one night, he splurged down a description of it on his laptop, and recites the whole dreadful prose poem over On The Run unedited: “It was a revelation, almost Patmosian whatever that means… a fight with evil, in this case an apparently all-powerful hooded and cloaked figure… it brooked no rebuttal.”

This somehow ties in to his grand idea about following “the voice of reason” – in this dream, a bonfire with the voice of Atticus Finch – a phrase he uses constantly in our conversation, and which he says is the theme of the album. It was the message of the 1973 Dark Side, too, he says. So why has he remade it? “Because not enough people recognised what it’s about, what it was I was saying then.” This new version, he hopes, will hammer the point home.

Always following The Voice of Reason is good advice, or would be, if so many of history’s most unreasonable voices hadn’t presented themselves as precisely that.

Others on the album include Waters’s multi-instrumentalist collaborator Gus Seyffert, and Seyffert’s girlfriend, Azniv Korkejian (a brilliant Syria-born singer who performs as Bedouine), plus a Baptist minister on Hammond organ. Waters sings throughout, but only actually plays an instrument on one track, a terrific bass solo on Us and Them, which made me wish he’d played across the whole thing; it seems such a missed opportunity.

Many Floyd fans will enjoy the new Dark Side. It won’t replace the original; nor will it ruin Waters’s reputation. His comments in the press are more likely to do that. But he’s unlikely to stop making music – or provocative statements – any time soon. He says he’s already working on another album, The Bar. The title track is about an allegorical pub, a symbol for any place that welcomes open debate. The album is about the importance of talking to people you disagree with, even if some of their views appal you – rebutting them perhaps, but listening, rather than retreating into a corner of the internet that will only reinforce your existing beliefs. It’s a promising, well-intentioned concept. But after four hours in Waters’s allegorical bar, I leave in serious need of a drink.

 

Wow.

[ZoSoRose]

Absolute megalomaniac. Love the guy's art, but man, his antics have been so disappointing and damaging to the band imo

[username]

6 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said:

Roger Waters: Why I’ve re-recorded The Dark Side of the Moon – without Pink Floyd

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/music/artists/roger-waters-pink-floyd-dark-side-moon-gilmour-putin-ukraine/

A recent reissue of Pink Floyd’s 1977 album Animals was delayed for four long years – and that was just due to a squabble over liner notes. Now Waters is planning to release a rival version of Pink Floyd’s most famous record, without Pink Floyd’s permission. I’m no copyright expert, but might there be some obstacles to that? Waters smiles: “I have no idea.”

After we speak, his rep phones up to say the album – originally set for March – has been pushed back to May, as Waters still hasn’t quite finished tinkering with the recordings. A big concert that was meant to launch it in March has also been postponed, probably to May, and moved to a different venue. It all sounds a bit shambolic, but they assure me the release is definitely happening.1

-----

Eventually, finally, at long last, I get to listen to the album. It turns out to be a curate’s egg; parts are very good indeed. Time, that young man’s lament for mortality, sounds terrific with his old man’s timbre. Breathe is wonderfully reimagined as a slow, acoustic groove. A country-tinged Money could be a late Johnny Cash cut, with Waters growling charismatically at the very bottom of his register.

But, surprisingly, Waters seems to have decided that what was wrong with the original album’s beautiful instrumental tracks was that they didn’t have Waters talking all over them. Now they do.

After a bad dream one night, he splurged down a description of it on his laptop, and recites the whole dreadful prose poem over On The Run unedited: “It was a revelation, almost Patmosian whatever that means… a fight with evil, in this case an apparently all-powerful hooded and cloaked figure… it brooked no rebuttal.”

This somehow ties in to his grand idea about following “the voice of reason” – in this dream, a bonfire with the voice of Atticus Finch – a phrase he uses constantly in our conversation, and which he says is the theme of the album. It was the message of the 1973 Dark Side, too, he says. So why has he remade it? “Because not enough people recognised what it’s about, what it was I was saying then.” This new version, he hopes, will hammer the point home.

Always following The Voice of Reason is good advice, or would be, if so many of history’s most unreasonable voices hadn’t presented themselves as precisely that.

Others on the album include Waters’s multi-instrumentalist collaborator Gus Seyffert, and Seyffert’s girlfriend, Azniv Korkejian (a brilliant Syria-born singer who performs as Bedouine), plus a Baptist minister on Hammond organ. Waters sings throughout, but only actually plays an instrument on one track, a terrific bass solo on Us and Them, which made me wish he’d played across the whole thing; it seems such a missed opportunity.

Many Floyd fans will enjoy the new Dark Side. It won’t replace the original; nor will it ruin Waters’s reputation. His comments in the press are more likely to do that. But he’s unlikely to stop making music – or provocative statements – any time soon. He says he’s already working on another album, The Bar. The title track is about an allegorical pub, a symbol for any place that welcomes open debate. The album is about the importance of talking to people you disagree with, even if some of their views appal you – rebutting them perhaps, but listening, rather than retreating into a corner of the internet that will only reinforce your existing beliefs. It’s a promising, well-intentioned concept. But after four hours in Waters’s allegorical bar, I leave in serious need of a drink.

 

Wow.

Rog definitely completely lost it! 

[username]

This just can't be real.... can it....? 

[Cosmo]

7 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said:

Roger Waters: Why I’ve re-recorded The Dark Side of the Moon – without Pink Floyd

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/music/artists/roger-waters-pink-floyd-dark-side-moon-gilmour-putin-ukraine/

A recent reissue of Pink Floyd’s 1977 album Animals was delayed for four long years – and that was just due to a squabble over liner notes. Now Waters is planning to release a rival version of Pink Floyd’s most famous record, without Pink Floyd’s permission. I’m no copyright expert, but might there be some obstacles to that? Waters smiles: “I have no idea.”

After we speak, his rep phones up to say the album – originally set for March – has been pushed back to May, as Waters still hasn’t quite finished tinkering with the recordings. A big concert that was meant to launch it in March has also been postponed, probably to May, and moved to a different venue. It all sounds a bit shambolic, but they assure me the release is definitely happening.1

-----

Eventually, finally, at long last, I get to listen to the album. It turns out to be a curate’s egg; parts are very good indeed. Time, that young man’s lament for mortality, sounds terrific with his old man’s timbre. Breathe is wonderfully reimagined as a slow, acoustic groove. A country-tinged Money could be a late Johnny Cash cut, with Waters growling charismatically at the very bottom of his register.

But, surprisingly, Waters seems to have decided that what was wrong with the original album’s beautiful instrumental tracks was that they didn’t have Waters talking all over them. Now they do.

After a bad dream one night, he splurged down a description of it on his laptop, and recites the whole dreadful prose poem over On The Run unedited: “It was a revelation, almost Patmosian whatever that means… a fight with evil, in this case an apparently all-powerful hooded and cloaked figure… it brooked no rebuttal.”

This somehow ties in to his grand idea about following “the voice of reason” – in this dream, a bonfire with the voice of Atticus Finch – a phrase he uses constantly in our conversation, and which he says is the theme of the album. It was the message of the 1973 Dark Side, too, he says. So why has he remade it? “Because not enough people recognised what it’s about, what it was I was saying then.” This new version, he hopes, will hammer the point home.

Always following The Voice of Reason is good advice, or would be, if so many of history’s most unreasonable voices hadn’t presented themselves as precisely that.

Others on the album include Waters’s multi-instrumentalist collaborator Gus Seyffert, and Seyffert’s girlfriend, Azniv Korkejian (a brilliant Syria-born singer who performs as Bedouine), plus a Baptist minister on Hammond organ. Waters sings throughout, but only actually plays an instrument on one track, a terrific bass solo on Us and Them, which made me wish he’d played across the whole thing; it seems such a missed opportunity.

Many Floyd fans will enjoy the new Dark Side. It won’t replace the original; nor will it ruin Waters’s reputation. His comments in the press are more likely to do that. But he’s unlikely to stop making music – or provocative statements – any time soon. He says he’s already working on another album, The Bar. The title track is about an allegorical pub, a symbol for any place that welcomes open debate. The album is about the importance of talking to people you disagree with, even if some of their views appal you – rebutting them perhaps, but listening, rather than retreating into a corner of the internet that will only reinforce your existing beliefs. It’s a promising, well-intentioned concept. But after four hours in Waters’s allegorical bar, I leave in serious need of a drink.

 

Wow.

This is just brilliantly wrong in so many levels 

[BucketEgg]

https://archive.is/HoL2Z

now he's saying this stuff about Rick...

 

Quote

Waters’s problem with the rest of Floyd, he says, was that they “can’t write”. “Well, Nick never pretended. But Gilmour and Rick [Wright, the keyboardist]? They can’t write songs, they’ve nothing to say. They are not artists!” He shouts the last two words. “They have no ideas, not a single one between them. They never have had, and that drives them crazy.” It’s oddly poignant, hearing him berate Wright (who died in 2008) in the present tense. It’s as if keeping the petty rivalry alive is a way of keeping Wright alive. Wright’s final solo album, he says, is “not as vacuous as Drake, but it’s pretty vacuous”.

 

 

 

[username]

4 hours ago, BucketEgg said:

https://archive.is/HoL2Z

now he's saying this stuff about Rick...

Wow. That's exceptionally bitter, even for Waters. 

We all know that Floyd was *so* ridiculously great because of the sum of the parts. You can tell when you look at their (Rog and Dave) solo material, that it has their personal strengths but lacks the other person's. 

[username]

Apparently he got to speak to the UN too. Roger has truly lost it. Megalomaniac. 

Quote

On Wednesday Feb 8th, I briefed the Security Council of the United Nations: 

https://media.un.org/en/asset/k1e/k1e98hhxei

Madame President, Excellencies, distinguished members of The Security Council, Ladies and Gentlemen.

I feel profoundly honoured to be afforded this singular opportunity to brief your excellencies today. With your forbearance, I shall endeavor to express what I believe to be the feelings of countless of our brothers and sisters all over the world, both here in NY and across the seas. I shall invite them into these hallowed halls to have their say. 

We are here to consider possibilities for peace in war torn Ukraine, especially in light of the increasing volume of weapons arriving in that unhappy country. Every morning when I sit down at my laptop, I think of our brothers and sisters, in Ukraine and elsewhere, who, through no fault of their own find themselves in dire and often deadly circumstances. Over there, in Ukraine they may be soldiers facing another deadly day at the front, or they may be mothers or fathers facing the awful question how can I feed my child today, or they may be civilians knowing that today the lights will go out, for sure, as they always do in war zones, knowing that there is no fresh water, that there is no fuel for the stove, no blanket, just barbed wire and watch towers and walls and enmity. Or, they may be over here, in a big rich city like NY, here brothers and sisters can still find themselves in dire straights. Maybe, somehow, however hard they worked all their lives, they lost their footing on the slippery tilting deck of the neo liberal capitalist ship we call life in the city and fell overboard to end up drowning.. Maybe they got sick, or maybe they took out a student loan, maybe they missed a payment, the margins are slim, who knows, but now they live on the street in a pile of cardboard, maybe even within sight of this United Nations building. Anyway, wherever they are, all over the world, war zone or not, together they make up a majority, a voiceless majority. Today I shall endeavor to speak for them. 

We the people wish to live. We wish to live in peace in conditions of parity that give us the real opportunity to look after ourselves and our loved ones. We are hard workers and we are ready to work hard. All we need is a fair crack of the whip. Maybe that’s an unfortunate choice of idiom, after five hundred years of imperialism, colonialism and slavery.

Anyway please help us. 

To help us you may have to consider our predicament, and to do so you may have to take your eye off the ball for a moment, to put your own goals momentarily to one side. What are your goals by the way? And here maybe I direct my enquiries more to the five permanent members of this Council. What are your goals? What is in the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow? Bigger profits for war industries? More power globally? A bigger share of the global cake? Is mother earth a cake to be gobbled up? Does not a bigger share of the cake mean less for everyone else? What if today, in this place of safety, we were to look in another direction, to look at our capacity for empathy for instance, to put ourselves in other’s shoes, like, right now, for instance, the shoes of that chap on the other side of this room, or even the shoes of the voiceless majority, if they have any shoes that is.

The Voiceless Majority is concerned that your wars, yes your wars, for these perpetual wars are not of our choosing, that your wars will destroy the planet that is our home, and along with every other living thing we will be sacrificed on the altar of two things, profits from the war to line the pockets of the very, very, few and the hegemonic march of some empire or other towards unipolar world domination. Please reassure us that that is not your vision for there is no good outcome down that road. That road leads only to disaster, everyone on that road has a red button in their briefcase and the further we go down that road the closer the itchy fingers get to that red button and the closer we all get to Armageddon. Look across the room, at this level we’re all wearing the same shoes. 

So back to Ukraine. The invasion of Ukraine by The Russian Federation was illegal. I condemn it in the strongest possible terms. Also, The Russian invasion of Ukraine was not “unprovoked”, so I also condemn the provocateurs in the strongest possible terms. There, that’s got that out of the way. 

When I wrote this speech yesterday, I included an observation that the power of veto in this council only lay in the hands of its permanent members, I was concerned that that was was undemocratic and rendered This Council toothless…. This morning I had a revelation……..TOOTHLESS! maybe toothless is in some ways a good thing……..If this is a toothless chamber……..I can open my big mouth on behalf of the voiceless without getting my head bitten off……. How cool is that.  I read in the paper this morning, some anonymous diplomat quoted as saying, “Roger Waters! To address the Security Council? Whatever next?..... Mr Bean! Hwah! Hwah! Hwah! For those of you who don’t know, Mr Bean is an ineffectual character in an English comedy show on TV. So it’s a penny to a pound the anonymous diplomat is an Englishman, Hwah! hwah! hwah! To you too Sir! Ok, I think it’s time to introduce my mother, Mary Duncan Waters, she was a big influence on me, she was a school teacher, I say was, she’s been dead for fifteen years. My father, Eric Fletcher Waters, was a big influence on me too, he too is dead, he was killed on the 18th of February 1944 at Aprilia near The Anzio Bridgehead in Italy, when I was only five months old, so I know something about war and loss. Anyway back to my Mum. When I was about thirteen I was struggling with some knotty adolescent problem or other trying to decide what to do, it doesn’t matter what it was, I can’t remember anyway, but my mum sat me down and said, “Listen, you’re going to be faced with many knotty problems during your life and when you are here’s my advice, read, read, read find out everything you can about whatever it is, look at it from all sides, all angles, listen to all opinions, especially ones you don’t agree with, research it thoroughly, when you’ve done that you will have done all the heavy lifting and the next bit is easy, “Is it? Ok mum what’s the easy bit?”…….”Oh, the easy bit is, you just do the right thing.“
So speaking of doing the right thing brings me to human rights. 

We the people, want universal human rights for all our brothers and sisters all over the world irrespective of their ethnicity, religion or nationality. To be clear, that would include but would not be limited to the right to life and property under the law for, for instance, Ukrainians, and for instance Palestinians. Yup, let that sink in. And obviously for all the rest of us. One of the problems with wars is that in a war zone or anywhere where the people live under military occupation, there is no recourse to the law, there are no human rights. 

Today our brief is the possibility of peace in the Ukraine, with special reference to the arming of the Kiev regime by third parties. 

I’m running out of time so,
What do the Voiceless millions have to say? 
They say
Thank you for hearing us today
We are the many who do not share in the profits of the war industry. 
We do not willingly raise our sons or daughters 
To provide fodder for your cannons.
In our opinion 
The only sensible course of action today  
Is to call for an immediate ceasefire in Ukraine.
No ifs, no buts, no ands. 
Not one more Ukrainian or Russian life is to be spent. 
Not one. 
They are all precious in our eyes.

So, the time has come to speak truth to power. You all remember the story of the Emperor’s new clothes? Of course you do. Well the leaders of your respective Empires stand, in one degree or another, naked before us. We have a message for them. It is a message from all the refugees in all the camps, a message from all the slums and favelas, a message from all the homeless, on all the cold streets, from all the earthquakes and floods, on earth. It is also a message from all the people, not quite starving but wondering how on earth to make the pittance they earn, meet the cost of a roof over their head and food for their families. My mother country England is, thank god, an Empire no more, but in that country now, there is a new catch phrase “Eat or Heat?” you can’t do both. It’s a cry echoing round the whole of Europe.  

Apparently, the only thing the Powers that Be think we can all afford is perpetual war. How crazy is that?

So, from the four billion or so brothers and sisters in this Voiceless Majority who together with the millions in the international anti-war movement represent a huge constituency, enough is enough! We demand change.

President Joe Biden, President Putin, President Zelenski, 

USA, NATO, RUSSIA, THE EU, ALL OF YOU. 
PLEASE CHANGE COURSE NOW, 
AGREE TO A CEASEFIRE IN UKRAINE TODAY.
That, of course, will only be the starting point. But everything extrapolates from that starting point. Imagine the collective global sigh of relief. The outpouring of joy. The international joining of voices in harmony singing an anthem to peace! John Lennon pumping the air with his fist from the grave. We have finally been heard in the corridors of power. The bullies in the schoolyard have agreed to stop playing nuclear chicken. We’re not all going to  die in a nuclear holocaust after all. At least not today. The powers that be have been persuaded to drop the arms race and perpetual war as their accepted modus operandum. We can stop squandering all our precious resources on war. We can feed our children, we can keep them warm. We may even learn to cooperate with all our brothers and sisters and even save  our beautiful planet home from destruction. Wouldn’t that be nice?

Your Excellencies,
I thank you for your forbearance.
Roger Waters

 

Edited February 10, 2023 by username

[SAU3R]

Damn, I truly believe that all he wants is peace on earth and equal rights for everyone, but the way he communicates that is just plain wrong and of course some of his views are bullshit too…especially sad that he also takes a dig at Rick wright now. 
But also weird from Polly (and David) that they go after him now, something must’ve happened behind the scenes for Polly to escalate like that 

[username]

43 minutes ago, SAU3R said:

something must’ve happened behind the scenes for Polly to escalate like that 

That was my first thought too. Maybe it was them hearing he'd re-recorded and intended to release that new DSOTM?

[Cosmo]

3 hours ago, SAU3R said:

Damn, I truly believe that all he wants is peace on earth and equal rights for everyone, but the way he communicates that is just plain wrong and of course some of his views are bullshit too…especially sad that he also takes a dig at Rick wright now. 
But also weird from Polly (and David) that they go after him now, something must’ve happened behind the scenes for Polly to escalate like that 

The only thing that would make Polly flip out like that would be something that affected their pockets. I’m guessing this new DSOTM recording RW’s done could have affected some stuff behind the scenes: royalties, reissues, etc…

[ZoSoRose]

They probably got wind of his clown show at the UN. Combined with his comments on David and Rick (wtf), new Dark Side, they probably just had enough

Im sure Roger does want peace on earth, but to shill for an actual fascist regime and act in the disgusting way he has toward actual Ukrainians is fucked up.

He has lost the plot and is off the rocker

Edited February 11, 2023 by ZoSoRose

[ZoSoRose]

It’s also pretty crazy that they will both definitely take this feud to the grave and they both know it.

They half heartedly tried to make amends in the 2000s but just couldn’t do it. I can’t imagine being that bitter with someone you shared something so world changing and successful with
 

It really is sad

[username]

8 hours ago, ZoSoRose said:

It’s also pretty crazy that they will both definitely take this feud to the grave and they both know it.

They half heartedly tried to make amends in the 2000s but just couldn’t do it. I can’t imagine being that bitter with someone you shared something so world changing and successful with
 

It really is sad

Yeah I mean... there was Live 8 and after that Gilmour guested on one (or a couple) of Roger's The Wall shows. I think those shows were in 2011. And I think they both played a Syd tribute, but I'm not even sure if they were on stage at the same time. Though I think they were. After that they definitely had a falling out over the Animals re-release (the liner notes, of all things) and I'm sure Roger wasn't happy about the The Endless River (2014) and The Later Years and  (2019) releases Floyd did either.

But other than that I'm not sure what they major problems were. I never heard about there being problems over the Immersion releases of DSOTM,  WYWH and The Wall (I think that was in 2011 and 2012). And the same goes for the The Early Years box set (2016). But I'm also not entirely sure how involved they were in that personally. I guess they had to sign off on the final products though, as they both own rights. 

There's also this footage of them meeting by chance at a recording studio or something and they meet up outside and very awkwardly shook hands and exchanged pleasentries. But I'm not entirely sure when that was. I think it was shortly after Live 8 when Dave was rehearsing for On An Island. 

[ZoSoRose]

Apparently there was a fair amount of drama at Live 8 rehearsals but idk the whole story. I do know they did not share the stage at the 2007 Syd concert, but it was due to them not wanting to upstage it being about Syd

[RussTCB]

Here's my thing:

Roger is gonna Roger. He's the same dude he's always been. I don't know why this is suddenly a huge issue just because Gilmours wife called him names on Twitter. 

[username]

4 hours ago, ZoSoRose said:

Apparently there was a fair amount of drama at Live 8 rehearsals but idk the whole story. I do know they did not share the stage at the 2007 Syd concert, but it was due to them not wanting to upstage it being about Syd

That's honestly a fair and good reason. Syd gets too little credit and that's probably one of the few things they agree about. 

[moreblack]

It's like now their true colors are showing and they've hated and resented each other forever.

[RussTCB]

Roger and David were suing each other as far back as 1985 and they hated each other well before that. I'm still not sure how any of this is a surprise to anyone. 

[username]

9 hours ago, RussTCB said:

Roger and David were suing each other as far back as 1985 and they hated each other well before that. I'm still not sure how any of this is a surprise to anyone. 

This part isn't a surprise not should it be a surprise for anybody. Their relationship during Live 8 and after should be described as uneasy at best. They performed to serve a common goal, but it wasn't like anything was ever going to be water under the bridge. The main difference is that they've gotten more public recently. First with the Animals re-release and it's liner notes. Then what David said through Polly. The only thing that surprised me a bit were Roger's words on Rick. 

[username]

Apparently the city of Frankfurt canceled Roger Waters' concerts there over his antisemetic and generally strange world views.