THE GENERAL - MONSTERS - Official Discussion Thread. NO LINKS OR ASKING FOR LINKS

[Blackstar]

Just now, Rindmelon said:

You mean the rumour about them being a year old mix from a studio? Could be i guess, that would at least fit with them not being taken from a vinyl rip (which i don't think they are)

I don't know if that's a rumour or just a theory (because we all know how easily a random theory someone posts on a forum can turn into a "rumour" and then the rumour can turn into a "fact", lol). But that's a theory that has crossed my mind, too, though it applies only if the leaks are not final mixes. If they are rough or older mixes, they could be more than a year old, maybe two years. And the source could be someone who worked with the band then.

If the leaks are the final mixes, they're definitely not a year old, since Axl and Slash went to that studio to listen to them this past summer. In this case, it could be, for example, from someone who recorded them from the studio soundboard for themselves (with no intention to trade or leak), but when the delay was announced they decided to leak them.

 

[Blackstar]

24 minutes ago, Gordon Comstock said:

Atlas/Monsters is what MSL has been claiming for a while now.

I think the full narrative of this claim was that The General and Monsters were one long song, but then GN'R decided to make it two songs so they could have two b-sides (which, of course, is not correct). I guess someone gave them wrong information, lol.

[Gordon Comstock]

46 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

I think the full narrative of this claim was that The General and Monsters were one long song, but then GN'R decided to make it two songs so they could have two b-sides (which, of course, is not correct). I guess someone gave them wrong information, lol.

 

Yea, I don't put much stock into his opinions, but they seem to be the theories that gain traction which is why I mentioned him.

[WhazUp]

3 hours ago, Blackstar said:

This seems very unlikely to me. Slash and Duff most likely added their parts some time between 2019-2021. If the two tracks had been out there and traded etc. since then, there surely would have been word on the street that the phone recording was not The General. Moreover, if the leaks are from that time, it means that they're not the final mixes, because the final mixes seem to have been done this past spring or summer (when Axl and Slash went to that studio to listen to them).

So if the leak turns out to be the final mix, probably someone who had access to the final mixes (not necessarily through the vinyl pressing) gave/sold them to someone else to leak them when the delay was announced. And either the original source (more likely) or the leaker messed with the quality of the mp3.

If the leak is not the final mix, my theory is that it didn't come from the hoarding circles (for the reasons I mentioned) but the source is someone from "inside" (e.g. someone who worked with them at that time) who gave the songs to someone to leak them.

That all can definitely be possible as well, which to me whoever was the person who hit "upload" and sent those files to GNRevo where it first got posted, was an absolute GOAT for GNR fans lol they definitely breathed so much more life in these forums with leaking these and they definitely massaged the reaction TB would have gotten much more due to the delay of the vinyl

[colonizedmind]

22 minutes ago, Gordon Comstock said:

 

Yea, I don't put much stock into his opinions, but they seem to be the theories that gain traction which is why I mentioned him.

I thought he was underground these days? He still peddling? 

[Ninjapie24]

That’s extremely disappointing since Monsters was the best song of these singles so far. The General was average and IMO the second worst of the singles only losing to Absurd. It wasn’t bad but just wasn’t that special. I was hoping monsters would be there but oh well, gotta drip feed these songs and milk it as long as possible I guess 

[El Guapo]

It's all pretty lame and shitty if we're honest. All of these Chinese leftovers are smellling, smelling like shit, old shit. It's just shit. Fucking hell.

[Sweersa]

15 minutes ago, El Guapo said:

It's all pretty lame and shitty if we're honest. All of these Chinese leftovers are smellling, smelling like shit, old shit. It's just shit. Fucking hell.

NITL lineup doesn't do them much justice, mainly Slash. 

I bet the 2008 (or whatever) mixes, which are largely still Robin and Buckethead, with Bumble and a touch of Frank, are vastly superior. 

Such a missed opportunity they didn't get CD2 out before the reunion. 2008-2015, plenty of time. It would have forced NITL to actually record some new music, though I believe they had newer things recorded in addition to CD2 as well by 2016. 

[Rindmelon]

4 hours ago, Blackstar said:

I don't know if that's a rumour or just a theory (because we all know how easily a random theory someone posts on a forum can turn into a "rumour" and then the rumour can turn into a "fact", lol). But that's a theory that has crossed my mind, too, though it applies only if the leaks are not final mixes. If they are rough or older mixes, they could be more than a year old, maybe two years. And the source could be someone who worked with the band then.

If the leaks are the final mixes, they're definitely not a year old, since Axl and Slash went to that studio to listen to them this past summer. In this case, it could be, for example, from someone who recorded them from the studio soundboard for themselves (with no intention to trade or leak), but when the delay was announced they decided to leak them.

 

I don't see any reason that couldn't be the case at all, could just be a discarded mix.

 

4 hours ago, Blackstar said:

I think the full narrative of this claim was that The General and Monsters were one long song, but then GN'R decided to make it two songs so they could have two b-sides (which, of course, is not correct). I guess someone gave them wrong information, lol.

I think Beltrami said they were considered separate pieces which is good enough for me. 

[22frets]

9 hours ago, Slugworth said:

The low quality of the leak is due to the leaker fucking with it.

As far as General and Monsters on any vinyl,  it's more than obvious by now the songs were not together.

 

I'm not talking about the leak. I'm talking about the vinyl itself which Fernando said was delayed due to poor quality. 

[gavgnr]

10 hours ago, Biff Nroccili said:

AXL is the weak link… again

How so?

Edited November 26, 2023 by gavgnr

[D..]

Haven't written in a while, thanks Blackstar for the summaries and good information.

So someone got the vinyl and no word about the audio quality/mix of The General? We need this information.

I'm not really surprised Monsters isn't on the vinyl, I doubt it ever was. Guns don't release a lot of songs, so having such a strong title as a hidden bonus track on a vinyl would have been weird. Extremely cool & weird but would make no sense financially.

I think TG & Monsters were registered together to save time. Don't know how this really works, but I guess that's what happened.

I have a new theory: I feel there's a strong possibility a hoarder had Monsters, anytime between 2019 and 2023 (because it's Slash, so it can't be much earlier). Back when that hoarder got Monsters, he may have believed he was getting "The General", based on evader's clip.

And so what may have happened is a trade between someone who had The General, and someone else who had Monsters. Both may have believed they had an earlier or latter version of The General and made a deal. Then they saw the registration thing, saw the name "Monsters" and renamed Monsters accurately because of the lyrics. They may even have believed the songs were one or connected because of this registration thing, and clearly thought both would be on the vinyl. So one of the two hoarders leaked both, thinking that's what was going to feature on the vinyl solely based on this registration thing, and thinking the value of both songs would be gone shortly.

And there are only two people (maybe even a third one) I know of who could have done this. But I'm pretty sure I know who it is. He's had a habit of lowering quality/interfering on tracks to maintain a bit of value, that's why I'm curious about the final audio quality on the vinyl.

I'm thinking of a deal because of where it was leaked, the nickname that was used, and the fact the registration thing clearly influenced the leak. I doubt the leak would have happened this way without the registration. We may just have gotten The General. And the person who did this isn't a hardcore hoarder, his aim is for everyone to enjoy most tracks, but still keeping things in case he can get more things to leak using a valuable track. There are many types of hoarders, he isn't someone who keeps everything forever.

Of course it could be simpler, and someone having access to the soundboard & recordings, but it doesn't make sense he would choose that specific board and choice of nickname. And I doubt anyone working for Guns would compromise their place just because a vinyl was delayed. It did cross my mind but it doesn't make sense.

The great news about Monsters not being on the Perhaps vinyl is that there's more coming. Probably Atlas as rumored. More songs and more vinyls, I'm all for it.

[JimiRose]

13 hours ago, Blackstar said:

In this case, it could be, for example, from someone who recorded them from the studio soundboard for themselves (with no intention to trade or leak), but when the delay was announced they decided to leak them.

 

The thing i question about this theory is why would they care? Why would a random studio tech be so annoyed that gnr didnt release them when they said they would they anonymously leak them? unless they were someone coincidentally on the forum who was a gnr nut, but the odds of that? i'm playing devils advocate, obviously im not suggesting it was TB that is absolute trash, zero chance it was them. 

[JimiRose]

15 hours ago, Rindmelon said:

No lol, that EP shit came from that YT channel i think. My guess would be that we do get an Atlas single with Monsters as a b side in the 3rd quarter of TWENTY TWENTY FIVE 

 

corrected it for ya. Axl will only be 63 then....

[JimiRose]

20 hours ago, ZoSoRose said:

It says without Monsters

It's a shame. Monsters is by far the best of of the 5 we have heard re done by the band. yet it'll be 2024 more likely 2025 till it actually gets a release despite it being recorded in early 00s, and redone with slash and duff in 2019-2020. another half a decade. Absolutely mental how pathetically shockingly shit this band is in every possible way to do with releasing music. 

[JimiRose]

15 hours ago, ZoSoRose said:

I think it’s good news that Monsters isn’t on this. It means there is the intent to release more Chinese takeout songs

Yes but i would still live to be alive for when this happens. Plus consuming them 1 at a time, and 2 every two years is a dreadful listening experience. If they'd have just released 10 together you could listen to the in sequence, like ones first then later, then get a full experience. They are so THROWAWAY, being released this way. You hear it non stop for a week because it's the only one, then you just move on and wait for the next. what the fuck is the point. 

[JimiRose]

13 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said:

 

Atlas/Monsters is what MSL has been claiming for a while now. Idk, both will likely come out, but almost everyone here would've guessed Atlas would be released before The General... who knows when any of this stuff will actually e released. Now that the Slash/Duff version has leaked I would think a Nightrain release or expanded Perhaps EP is our best bet for getting Monsters. It would be ridiculous if they waited another year or two to release it, but this is GNR so... I'm just glad to have it now.

since when? since after the leak? because that is just an obvious assumption to make. if he was claiming this before mid october then id give him some credit. If not, then he knows as much as my dog. 

[oneway23]

Christ...They'll milk two further years of touring out of two more songs now...what a farce.

[allwaystired]

So Monsters is definitely not on the vinyl? 

 

[oneway23]

32 minutes ago, allwaystired said:

So Monsters is definitely not on the vinyl? 

 

Nope...But they were registered together!  LOL

Best reunion song so far was never gonna be a "hidden surprise."

What would the benefit have been in that, when they can milk out this Frankenstein necromancy for another few years?

By the way, this means that they had vinyl quality control issues beyond putting too much music on one side...All of those "arguments" for naught!  Extra LOL

Edited November 26, 2023 by oneway23

[Illusion1987]

28 minutes ago, oneway23 said:

Christ...They'll milk two further years of touring out of two more songs now...what a farce.

Why can't they just release a damn album like Metallica, the Stones, RHCP, etc 

They have the songs!

This drip feed approach is torture...for both the fans and the band...WTF?

[Blackstar]

1 hour ago, JimiRose said:

The thing i question about this theory is why would they care? Why would a random studio tech be so annoyed that gnr didnt release them when they said they would they anonymously leak them? unless they were someone coincidentally on the forum who was a gnr nut, but the odds of that? i'm playing devils advocate, obviously im not suggesting it was TB that is absolute trash, zero chance it was them. 

I'm not saying that whoever had them was the one who directly leaked them. It probably sounds far-fetched (and of course it's speculation), but there may be fans, not "insiders", but just people who casually talk to various people associated/working with the band currently or previously. So it could be through this kind of contact.

[oneway23]

14 minutes ago, Illusion1987 said:

Why can't they just release a damn album like Metallica, the Stones, RHCP, etc 

They have the songs!

This drip feed approach is torture...for both the fans and the band...WTF?

It's a bit of a joke, tbh.  RHCP put two albums in one year out, and the Stones already have 50% of a follow-up finished.

I think you have to want to have the passion for creating in the moment, constantly striving, always looking for the next great golden nugget of a song, knowing the best song you've ever written could be just around the corner..  95% of the audience won't care about new material, but most musicians have to want to do it for themselves,  if only out of a need to write & create.   "We make records because we're a band and that's what we do" kind of thing, ya know?

Guns just lack that fire.  They don't need it.  They're more like a Motley Crue, ironically, at this point.  Put out a song for the purpose of a tour.  It happens.

Edited November 26, 2023 by oneway23

[allwaystired]

50 minutes ago, oneway23 said:

Nope...But they were registered together!  LOL

Best reunion song so far was never gonna be a "hidden surprise."

What would the benefit have been in that, when they can milk out this Frankenstein necromancy for another few years?

By the way, this means that they had vinyl quality control issues beyond putting too much music on one side...All of those "arguments" for naught!  Extra LOL

Is that totally official though? I mean, I'm not surprised in the slightest if it is the case. It did certainly look like the intention was for Monsters to be on there originally, hence the registration thing. 

In my view it's as I said before - they tried to stuff too much on to a 7" vinyl, it was abysmal quality as a result, and now it's just The General.

Who's have thought it hey?! If only there was some information out there about how much music you can stuff on a vinyl without it sounding garbage....like, say, on the website of the company printing your vinyl? In my opinion this is possibly the most amateur hour yet, if that is what happened. 

Glad we got Monsters though anyway. I can't see it getting a release any time soon, unless it's bunged on the Japanese CD version. 

 

[allwaystired]

52 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

I'm not saying that whoever had them was the one who directly leaked them. It probably sounds far-fetched (and of course it's speculation), but there may be fans, not "insiders", but just people who casually talk to various people associated/working with the band currently or previously. So it could be through this kind of contact.

It could easily be someone who works at the printing plant too. If test pressings were made the original files will have gone through quite a lot of hands, and it could even be someone from the pressing plant that just took a test pressing for themselves. So many ways this could have leaked at this stage.