Endless Touring

[Axl_morris]

msl how about you start proving all the material you claimed to have had last year?? I remember it being a big thread but the Feb 5th came and everything else you said was going to happen, never did, so thought you were going to leak all these documents and tracks?????

[Voodoochild]

I did not take your quote out of context.

Yes, you did. And frankly, I don't give a damn anymore. Act like an autist as much as you want.

08.24.02 - Pukkelpop Festival, Pukkelpop Field, Hasselt-Kiewit, Belgium

set: Welcome To The Jungle, It's So Easy, Mr. Brownstone, Live And Let Die, Think About You, You Could Be Mine, Sweet Child O' Mine, Knockin' On Heaven's Door, Out Ta Get Me, Madagascar, Rhiad And The Bedouins, Guitar Solo [buckethead], Chinese Democracy, Piano Solo, November Rain, The Blues, Patience, Rocket Queen, Guitar Solo [buckethead], My Michelle, Nightrain

encore: Guitar Solo [Robin], Paradise City

02.10.2012 - Roseland Ballroom New York

set:Welcome to the Jungle, It's So Easy, Mr. Brownstone, Estranged, Rocket Queen, This I Love, Richard Fortus Guitar Solo, Live and Let Die, Sorry, You Could Be Mine, Better, DJ Ashba Guitar Solo, Sweet Child O' Mine, Instrumental Jam (Another Brick In The Wall: Part 2), November Rain, Bumblefoot Guitar Solo, Whole Lotta Rosie, Civil War, Knockin' On Heaven's Door, Nightrain

encore: Instrumental Jam, Madagascar, Don't Cry, Motivation, Instrumental Jam, Patience, Instrumental Jam, Paradise City

Exact the same? No, only for about 75-80%. Just a couple more coversongs, a solo here and there and a few C.D. songs that weren't performed in 2002.

Thanks, but it won't work. He'll point out how they are playing now Motivation and Dead Flowers while in 2002 they were not.

Edited March 21, 2012 by Voodoochild

[droezle]

droezle -

yes, let's definitely compare the one show that was substantially shorter than the rest from the tour and had several songs cut.

You'll never asked for 1 show in particular to compare so i picked one by myself.

[gunsguy]

Children stop biatching at each other. Stick to the topic and offer valid responses and opinions instead. Take your gang bang to pm system.

[Apollo]

Every discussion doesn't have to turn into a big fight and insult-fest. We are all people with different opinions.

Is GnR touring a good thing? Yes.

Is it better than silence? Yes.

If more touring means a longer delay in between albums, is that a good thing? I say no. You can release an album and then go right back on tour!

Did Axl keep the name GnR just to be a touring band who puts out an album every 10 years? That is his option. It is his band. But he will continue to lose fans and will continue to lose band members if that is the case. If 5 years from now, there is no new album and 3 more years of touring, do you really think that all the current band members will still stick around?

I realize that this is Axl's band and he can do whatever he wants with it. And I realize the Nutters think that Axl does no wrong and they worship the ground he walks on. But my gosh, just as music fans, I don't know why we all can't agree that our favorite band putting out new music every 3-4 years isn't the BEST option on how to run a band? Album, tour for 2-3 years to make money and play for the fans, take a year off to vacation. Spend year recording next album. Repeat cycle. Every other major band in the world can do this, why can't GnR? That's all the "haters" and "internet b*tches" and "cupcakes" want from their favorite band. We aren't trying to be CEOS or dictate what Axl must do. We just would like to hear new music from our favorite band.........which isn't a new crazy thing. It's how ALL OTHER BANDS in the world work. Musicians put out music.

[LA_0013]

But this idea that GNR has been touring Chinese to death for ten years isn't really accurate.

I think you're missing the point.

The band has been touring for a decade, and has relied so heavily on the old material, an Chinese has gradually been added to the setlist over the course of 3 or 4 different tours.

Its not a setlist issue. Its a credibility issue. If this band wants to be respected for its OWN accomplishments, they need to hit the studio, not continually milk the same shit over and over.

LA

[bumblecool]

why da fuck you choose Roseland show? the setlist is shit compared with ritz or hob in LA...

[BS11290]

But this idea that GNR has been touring Chinese to death for ten years isn't really accurate.

I think you're missing the point.

The band has been touring for a decade, and has relied so heavily on the old material, an Chinese has gradually been added to the setlist over the course of 3 or 4 different tours.

Its not a setlist issue. Its a credibility issue. If this band wants to be respected for its OWN accomplishments, they need to hit the studio, not continually milk the same shit over and over.

LA

Yes, Yes, Yes!!!!!

Exactly what I've been saying for years now. How much longer do things need to be at a standstill in terms of moving forward before it's considered ridiculous?

Edited March 21, 2012 by BS11290

[Axl_morris]

If this was any other band, most fans would complain if they dropped some of their biggest hits from their set.

[LA_0013]

but if 01/02, 06/07 and 09-12 have had noticeable changes in the set, how is it milking the same shit over and over?

do you actually go to the shows? the shows i went to in 2006 and the shows i went to in 2011/2012 were VERY different.

or are you one of those people who just reads the setlists online and then complain when they dont change the set every night?

Oh please. Noticeable changes?

It is essentially the same fuckin show over and over. How many times have they doen South America? Twice? Three times? And they're talking about going back...

At the end of the day, you may be happy going to the shows. But as a long term fan that has given this band the benefit of the doubt and accepted it, going to another show where they fire out Jungle, Its So Easy and Brownstone, add a new song, then play Live and Let Die. I'm over it.

And yes, I was at the London show in 2002, Glasgow show in 2006, and caught the recent tour in the O2 in London. I wont be going to the next show in the O2 later this year to see the same fuckin songs

LA

Edited March 21, 2012 by LA_0013

[JVesper]

He DOESN'T GIVE A DAMN ANYMORE, alright?

That means hello I don't want to talk about this again as I'm wrong, I'm covering my ears, etc...

[Axl_morris]

Lets compare setlists from the same city on several tours, just because a NYC show might be the same as a European show shouldn't matter as it's to a different crowd.

London 2002

set: Welcome To The Jungle, It's So Easy, Mr. Brownstone, Live And Let Die, Think About You, You Could Be Mine, Guitar Solo [Robin], Sweet Child O' Mine, Knockin' On Heaven's Door, Out Ta Get Me, Chinese Democracy, Madagascar, Rhiad And The Bedouins, Guitar Solo [buckethead], Piano Solo, November Rain, The Blues, Acoustic Guitar Solo [buckethead], Rocket Queen, Patience, My Michelle, Nightrain

encore: Guitar Solo [Robin], Paradise City

London 2006

Welcome To The Jungle, It's So Easy, Mr. Brownstone, Live And Let Die, Guitar Solo (God Save The Queen) [Robin], Sweet Child O' Mine, Knockin' On Heaven's Door, Piano Solo [Dizzy], The Blues, Better, Robin & Richard guitar duet (Beautiful), You Could Be Mine, Guitar Solo (Don't Cry) [bumblefoot], Out Ta Get Me, Sway [w/ Izzy], Sailing [w/ Izzy], Back In The U.S.S.R. [w/ Izzy], Think About You [w/ Izzy], My Michelle [w/ Sebastian Bach], Patience [w/ Izzy], November Rain, Rocket Queen, Nightrain [w/ Izzy]

encore: I.R.S., Paradise City [w/ Izzy]

2010

Chinese democracy, Welcome to the jungle,It's so easy,Mr. Brownstone,Sorry,Shackler's revenge,Richard Fortus guitar solo (James Bond theme)Live and let die,Band jam,This I love,Better,Rocket queen,Dizzy Reed piano solo (Ziggy Stardust),Street of dreams,You could be mine (ft. Duff on bass),DJ Ashba guitar solo (The ballad of death),Sweet child o' mine,Band jam (Another brick in the wall pt. 2),Axl Rose piano solo (Goodbye yellow brick road/Someone saved my life tonight)November rain,Bumblefoot guitar solo (Pink Panther theme), I.R.S.,Nice boys (ft. Duff on guitar),Knockin' on heaven's door (ft. Duff on guitar),Nightrain,Don't cry,Madagascar,

Patience (ft. Duff on tambourine),Whole lotta Rosie (AC/DC cover),Band jam (Waiting on a friend),Paradise city

So let say a fan goes to see the band in 2002. He's pleased, then he's so pleased he wants to go back in 2006, I think this show is quite different from his previous one, so he shouldn't complain here. So, he's happy and wants to go again in 2010, now, this show is practically the 2002 with more songs, and a few different band members. Is he happy? Well, for the same price he's nearly getting an extra hour worth of songs with a lot he hasn't heard before, so I think he should be happy.

Edited March 21, 2012 by Axl_morris

[Axl_morris]

what I do feel cheated about as I've paid the same for a 2 hour show as I have for a 3 hour show on the same tour.

[Coma16]

Black Keys tours are about 90 minutes, so 2-hours or 3-hours is pretty fantastic!

I must say that I enjoyed Toronto 2010 more that Hamilton 2011. Knowing pretty much what was coming up next did spoil it (a bit) but the inclusion of Don't Cry and Estranged made up for it. Too bad Civil War wasn't back in by that point...

[LA_0013]

I think our views of 'noticeable' changes differ quite considerably. Lets take U2 as an example. Not that I'm a U2 fan, but if I were......

U2 - Elevation Tour 2002

Elevation / Creep (snippet) / Steppin' Stone (snippet), Beautiful Day, Until The End Of The World, Discothèque / Love To Love You Baby (snippet) / Devil Inside / Staring At The Sun, Stuck In A Moment You Can't Get Out Of, New York, New Year's Day, Sunday Bloody Sunday / Could You Be Loved / Get Up Stand Up, Sweetest Thing, In A Little While / Crazy Love/ Angel Of Harlem, Bad / Ruby Tuesday (snippet) / , Where The Streets Have No Name, Mysterious Ways / Dance To The Music (snippet) / Sexual Healing, The Fly

encores: Bullet The Blue Sky / Whole Lotta Love / Young Americans (snippet), With Or Without You, One / Unchained Melody, Walk On

Vertigo Tour 2006

City Of Blinding Lights, Vertigo, Streets Of Your Town (snippet), Until The End Of The World, New Year's Day, Yahweh, Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own / The Black Hills of Dakota (snippet), Love And Peace Or Else, Sunday Bloody Sunday, Bullet The Blue Sky / When Johnny Comes Marching Home (snippet) / The Hands That Built America (snippet), Miss Sarajevo, Pride (In The Name Of Love)/ All You Need Is Love (snippet), One, Party Girl/Even Better Than The Real Thing

encores: Zoo Station, With Or Without You / Streets Of Your Town (snippet), The Saints Are Coming, Angel Of Harlem / Young Americans (snippet), Wild Honey/Kite

360 Tour - 2011

Breathe, Even Better Than The Real Thing, Out Of Control, Get On Your Boots, Magnificent, Mysterious Ways, Elevation, Until The End Of The World / Strangers In The Night (snippet) / New York, New York (snippet), I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For, Stand By Me, Desire, Stay (Faraway, So Close!), Beautiful Day, Zooropa, City Of Blinding Lights, Vertigo, I'll Go Crazy If I Don't Go Crazy Tonight / Discothèque (snippet) / Mofo (snippet) / Please (snippet), Sunday Bloody Sunday, Scarlet, You'll Never Walk Alone (snippet)/ One

encores: Where The Streets Have No Name, Ultra Violet (Light My Way), With Or Without You, Cant Help Falling in Love, Moment of Surrender

See,... that to me, is noticeable changes to a show. Not continually churning out Appetite, the big guns on the Illusion albums, and gradually adding in new songs. Over the course of 11 years

LA

[One.In.A.Million]

This all comes down to the fact that a large portion of the fanbase want to hear new material, and I don't see anything wrong with that.

Yes, Chinese Democracy was only released in 2008.....which is still 4 years, which is not a short time by any means. But what you also have to take into account is that most of the key material that was on Chinese Democracy, was being played live in the period from 2001-2002, and then a few more CD songs got added to the setlist in 2006-2007.

So fans have been aware of the newer material for years and years, and to some they are not classed as new anymore......and they want something new to get excited about.

Sooner or later, Axl will have to bite the bullet you feel and start preparing the release of the next record. Not because of touring, as fans will always see this band........but because the bands legacy DEMANDS a new record at some point in the future.

Edited March 21, 2012 by One.In.A.Million

[Axl_morris]

I think Axl knows he can't make hits like he did 20-25 years ago. Even if the songs are just as good, they won't hold up into today's music. That could effect ticket sales.

If he's got a show that can sell out, then he will probably do that until it doesn't, and at that point, perhaps we will see new music.

Im not expecting any new songs till summer 2013 at the earliest.

[Voodoochild]

I did not take your quote out of context.

Yes, you did. And frankly, I don't give a damn anymore. Act like an autist as much as you want.

You said the 2012 and 2002 setlists were basically the same. I quoted that and pointed out differences in the 2012 and 2002 setlists.

How was I taking anything out of context?

Feel free to explain what you actually meant (invitation to backpedal).

OK, I'll explain just because English is not my first language and I'm really considering you're being confused.

I said they were basically the same and then said how 2006 it had the same songs plus two or three more, and so on. My point being that they added three new songs as staples (TIL, Sorry and Shacklers) while taking off IRS, If the World and Riad (this one missing since 2002 NA tour). Notice how I'm not talking about casual appearences TWAT, Catcher, Scraped, Prostitute or even Oh My God.

When I said "basically the same" I meant: heavily based on old material and covers, with AFD songs as the core of its setlist. It still is! I even gave some examples. Am really I talking literally about exactly the same setlist here?

Again: how the most recent setlist being so heavily based on old stuff is promoting Chinese Democracy? They just keep adding old songs and covers. And I still refuse to call this band a nostalgia act, but they really need to move foward soon enough because that's exactly what is looking like.

BTW, you can't compare anything to MSG 2002. It wasn't meant to be the last one (which is always a special occasion), they had several others and there was a plan to keep the tour going on for 2003.

He DOESN'T GIVE A DAMN ANYMORE, alright?

That means hello I don't want to talk about this again as I'm wrong, I'm covering my ears, etc...

[Voodoochild]

This all comes down to the fact that a large portion of the fanbase want to hear new material, and I don't see anything wrong with that.

Yes, Chinese Democracy was only released in 2008.....which is still 4 years, which is not a short time by any means. But what you also have to take into account is that most of the key material that was on Chinese Democracy, was being played live in the period from 2001-2002, and then a few more CD songs got added to the setlist in 2006-2007.

So fans have been aware of the newer material for years and years, and to some they are not classed as new anymore......and they want something new to get excited about.

Sooner or later, Axl will have to bite the bullet you feel and start preparing the release of the next record. Not because of touring, as fans will always see this band........but because the bands legacy DEMANDS a new record at some point in the future.

There is another point, but that is far more based on subjective matter: why not play songs like Catcher and TWAT instead of SOD and Madagascar? Or even instead of TIL and Sorry?

Like I said: I can't believe people wouldn't trade six months or so of shows for new recordings and a new album.

[Axl_morris]

Cause catcher and TWAT along with Scraped and prostitute sound shit live.

[CivilWar07]

Ahh 2007 all over again

[Cosmo]

Cause catcher and TWAT along with Scraped and prostitute sound shit live.

Whaat?!?!

Scraped sounds AWESOME live. Better than in the album. TWAT is perfect when Axl's got the voice. See his 2006/2007 (I don't remember which) performance in youtube. Catcher is a good live song. Better than sorry or TIL. Prostitute really does suck live.

[Voodoochild]

Cause catcher and TWAT along with Scraped and prostitute sound shit live.

Not enough proof on that. The 2006 performances of TWAT were all incredible IMO, as was Catcher in Paris 2010. Scraped was alright too and Prostitute was only played two times in 2009, when Axl wasn't at his best.

Take IRS: the first Hammerstein 2006 performances were a mess and Axl was struggling to sing it. But they kept playing it and they all got better. By the end of 2006, it already was one of the highlights for me.

[Towelie]

Towelie -

I've never seen a band before where so many fans act like they're the fucking CEO of the band.

Boo hoo! Too many concerts! Why would I want to see my favorite band live when I could have a music video instead?

LOLWUT

What fan of a band would rather have a music video than get to see the band live?

GNR fans are so perplexing.

I'm sure I'm not the only one who would be more excited to see a proper single release and music video for Better than yet another run of shows performing the same songs at the same venues in the same cities they did just a year and a half ago.

[Flayer]

This all comes down to the fact that a large portion of the MyGNRForum* fanbase want to hear new material, and I don't see anything wrong with that.

*inserted

The majority of the fan base is not sick of the touring and a large portion don't really care whether or not anything new is done. Get some perspective here: fewer than 1% of all GNR fans participate in or even read the forums.

Sooner or later, Axl will have to bite the bullet you feel and start preparing the release of the next record. Not because of touring, as fans will always see this band........but because the bands legacy DEMANDS a new record at some point in the future.

You don't think he realizes this? You don't think he has any plans to develop and release new records despite the fact that he's been recording for years and interviews with the members always talking about intentions to release a new album?

This 'crusade' for a next record is completely unnecessary because the plans already exist independent of any bitching from a few thousand fans. It's the result of people with an overdeveloped sense of self-importance thinking surely THEY know better than Axl Rose, better than all the rest of the band, better than the management, better than the entire industry, what to do for the next album.

There's going to be a new album out in the next two years with near-certainty and in the next year probably. Forum fans should quit bitching about it on a daily basis unless they want to make the next year or two of waiting a grueling, miserable wait.

Edited March 21, 2012 by Flayer