Endless Touring

[JAxlMorrison]

I don't care if it makes sense or it doesn't make sense. These shows are the most fun I have ever had. Do you want to go back to the era of silence? Why MUST they release new music to keep touring? Do you own STOCK in the GNR Corporation? Just shut up and enjoy the shows and if we get new music it's a bonus...

[YOUCOULDBEMINE.]

Releasing an album that could easily have been released around 2000-2002.

No offense because I like most of CD, but if they released it around 2001 without adding 10 other musicians it would've been twice the album that it is now.

It would've easily sold twice as much as well.

Back then the world needed CD, in 2008 it was a joke to many people.

So it's time for something new.

It would have sold twice as well only because internet piracy wasn't such a hot issue in 2001 as it is nowadays.

That too.

[maynard]

I don't care if it makes sense or it doesn't make sense. These shows are the most fun I have ever had. Do you want to go back to the era of silence? Why MUST they release new music to keep touring? Do you own STOCK in the GNR Corporation? Just shut up and enjoy the shows and if we get new music it's a bonus...

Not everybody on the planet can go to a concert, you are very selfish.

[trqster]

People, come on...like 90% of the fans out there just wanna go to a "greatest hits" gig - CD/CD2 or whatever new music they decide to release is almost meaningless. GnR is and will always be a nostalgia act for the vast majority of fans out there - the only thing they complain about is that without Slash the nostalgia act ain't so perfect...

A "new album" tour consisting mainly of new music would without a doubt detract most 'fans' from attending the shows - that's a fact for GnR & other nostalgia act bands. The truth is the truth hurts, don't you agree...?

Edited March 21, 2012 by trqster

[maynard]

At that time we all knew what the name was for the forthcoming album.

Yes, we knew the album was going to be called Chinese Democracy, but my point was that you can't really call 2001 a "tour" when it was two shows at the beginning of the year and two shows at the end of the year. That's not a tour.

I don't care if it makes sense or it doesn't make sense. These shows are the most fun I have ever had. Do you want to go back to the era of silence? Why MUST they release new music to keep touring? Do you own STOCK in the GNR Corporation? Just shut up and enjoy the shows and if we get new music it's a bonus...

Not everybody on the planet can go to a concert, you are very selfish.

Not everybody on the planet can go to a concert, but doing a lengthy tour gives more people a chance to go. What is selfish about someone wanting GNR to tour so they can go see them?

Well, I think that saying something like "shut up and enjoy the shows" is a selfish thing to say. And concerts are mostly for the casual fans. Axl is pleasing the wrong crowd.

[Voodoochild]

Who cares if they were touring in 2002 without a release date? Its basically the same fucking setlist. Hell, even in 2006 they were already playing IRS, Better, Chinese, SOD and Madagascar almost every single night. If anything, we got a longer setlist with old songs back as staples, which is fine, but that doesn't mean anything for the album.

Why wouldn't they just change the newer songs then? I mean, play TWAT instead of Sorry, Catcher instead of This I love, Prostitute instead of SOD. Rotate those songs, bring back OMG, Scraped and Riad for a change instead of Shacklers for some gigs. I'm sure the hardcore fanbase wouldnt complain as much even there is no unreleased material there.

People, come on...like 90% of the fans out there just wanna go to a "greatest hits" gig - CD/CD2 or whatever new music they decide to release is almost meaningless. GnR is and will always be a nostalgia act for the vast majority of fans out there - the only thing they complain about is that without Slash the nostalgia act ain't so perfect...

A "new album" tour consisting mainly of new music would without a doubt detract most 'fans' from attending the shows - that's a fact for GnR & other nostalgia act bands. The truth is the truth hurts, don't you agree...?

I agree with you, 90% of the fans couldn't care less about a new album. A new release wouldn't bring more people unless there was a HUGE radio hit, which I think is very unlikely for the reality of this band now.

And well.. Its a fact that not only us, the hardcore fans, want new music. Even the band members want it too. They need to keep releasing music in order to stay relevant. Less tours would also probably gather more sold out shows. By no means I'm talking about inactivity, BTW.

But still, like I said above, if new music is so far fetched, they can still mix things up a little, getting a more unpredictable set. People just freaked out when they knew about Civil War being played again, why not do that more often?

[droezle]

At that time we all knew what the name was for the forthcoming album.

Yes, we knew the album was going to be called Chinese Democracy, but my point was that you can't really call 2001 a "tour" when it was two shows at the beginning of the year and two shows at the end of the year. That's not a tour.

Tour or not, 2001 was the first time that they used the album name to promote the few shows.

[Cosmo]

Voodoo -

same setlist as 2002 you say? hmmmm, well let's look at the last show of the 2002 tour and see if there are any songs from the last show of the 2012 tour that weren't played ten years prior . . .

SORRY

YOU'RE CRAZY

ESTRANGED

THIS I LOVE

USED TO LOVE HER

DEAD FLOWERS

MOTIVATION

SHACKLER'S REVENGE

DON'T CRY

BETTER

CIVIL WAR

MAMA KIN

WHOLE LOTTA ROSIE

wow, only 13 songs were different? that's it? you're right. the shows are basically identical. good call.

droezle -

have no idea what you're getting at. who is denying the name chinese democracy was used for a long time?

They have really changed the setlist a lot since 2002 but I think it's time they realize they need to rotate the songs. They can't just get a setlist an have the whole tour with the damn setlist. Okay, they added Used To Love Her and You're Crazy during the last tour but they need to rotate more songs. Sorry and This I Love have become permanent staples on the setlist since 2009. It's damn time they replace those songs. I get they're easier for Axl to sing and all but - really... people yawn during This I Love. CD has MUCH better songs. They need to bring IRS back.

[droezle]

Voodoo -

same setlist as 2002 you say? hmmmm, well let's look at the last show of the 2002 tour and see if there are any songs from the last show of the 2012 tour that weren't played ten years prior . . .

SORRY

YOU'RE CRAZY

ESTRANGED

THIS I LOVE

USED TO LOVE HER

DEAD FLOWERS

MOTIVATION

SHACKLER'S REVENGE

DON'T CRY

BETTER

CIVIL WAR

MAMA KIN

WHOLE LOTTA ROSIE

wow, only 13 songs were different? that's it? you're right. the shows are basically identical. good call.

droezle -

have no idea what you're getting at. who is denying the name chinese democracy was used for a long time?

The tour for the record started in 2001 and not in 2009.

I don't really see how the touring could be labeled as endless. The record released at the end of 2008. The tour for the record started at the end of 2009. The first half of the tour lasted a year and ended at the end of 2010. They took a year off and restarted the tour at the end of 2011. It appears if they add South American and US dates that the tour will end at the end of 2012.

Setlist of the first show of the Chinese Democracy tour:

01.01.01 - House Of Blues, Las Vegas, NV

set: Welcome To The Jungle, It's So Easy, Mr. Brownstone, Live And Let Die, Oh My God, My Michelle, Think About You, You Could Be Mine, Sweet Child O' Mine, Knockin' On Heaven's Door, November Rain, Out Ta Get Me, Rocket Queen, Rhiad And The Bedouins, Chinese Democracy, Patience, The Blues, Nightrain

encore: Chicken Binge [buckethead], Silkworms, Paradise City

[Flayer]

And concerts are mostly for the casual fans. Axl is pleasing the wrong crowd.

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[Nick85]

Voodoo -

same setlist as 2002 you say? hmmmm, well let's look at the last show of the 2002 tour and see if there are any songs from the last show of the 2012 tour that weren't played ten years prior . . .

SORRY

YOU'RE CRAZY

ESTRANGED

THIS I LOVE

USED TO LOVE HER

DEAD FLOWERS

MOTIVATION

SHACKLER'S REVENGE

DON'T CRY

BETTER

CIVIL WAR

MAMA KIN

WHOLE LOTTA ROSIE

wow, only 13 songs were different? that's it? you're right. the shows are basically identical. good call.

droezle -

have no idea what you're getting at. who is denying the name chinese democracy was used for a long time?

Listen. We were regularly fed that they were working on MULTIPLE albums worth of tracks over the years, really until Axl seemingly turned pissy about about the idea putting out new music in the Del interview in early '09. You know this.

It's fine and good that Estrange and Civil War are back, and I agree that those being included in the setlists is something to be excited about. The covers, not so much. I think it comes down to the fact that the longer Axl keeps touring without recording, and not even introducing the finished tracks that still have yet to be released, just shows how bleak the prospect of a the fans hearing a new GNR album... ..."soon" is.

[Voodoochild]

Voodoo -

same setlist as 2002 you say?

No, didn't say that.

I will quote myself again because seems like you have a hard time reading other people's post with a small degree of attention:

Its basically the same fucking setlist. Hell, even in 2006 they were already playing IRS, Better, Chinese, SOD and Madagascar almost every single night. If anything, we got a longer setlist with old songs back as staples, which is fine, but that doesn't mean anything for the album.

Where did I say it's the exactly same setlist? And why did you forget to read what I said about the old songs relating to Chinese Democracy? And why didn't you read what I said about rotation of the setlist instead of predictable ones?

hmmmm, well let's look at the last show of the 2002 tour and see if there are any songs from the last show of the 2012 tour that weren't played ten years prior . . .

SORRY

YOU'RE CRAZY

ESTRANGED

THIS I LOVE

USED TO LOVE HER

DEAD FLOWERS

MOTIVATION

SHACKLER'S REVENGE

DON'T CRY

BETTER

CIVIL WAR

MAMA KIN

WHOLE LOTTA ROSIE

wow, only 13 songs were different? that's it? you're right. the shows are basically identical. good call.

Used to Love Her, Better and Don't Cry since 2006.

Besides that, Sorry, TIL and Shacklers from the new album since 2009. And since then, we lost IRS, TWAT and Scraped.

But Motivation, UTLH, You're Crazy, Dead Flowers and Mama Kin were only played in the last few shows. And what those old songs and tons of covers can do for the new album?

And still, you get songs like Live and Let Die, Knockin' On Heaven's Door, Mr. Brownstone, Street of Dreams, Madagascar and some others that I don't think people would care that much if we missed it. When they dropped Out ta Get Me and My Michelle was already a huge improvement IMHO.

And lets not forget one simple thing: we are talking about 10 years. Even if we would talk about only 2009-2012, it would still be a long time enough to promote an album with less and less songs from it.

[GNR123GNR456]

It's better than silence.

But, I would like a new album, or atleast a new single. I think it's a shame for Axl Rose to let all of his talents go to waste to record with today's band. Chinese Democracy was awesome, and I would love to hear what else was recorded by the older nuGN'R band (you know, with Buckethead and Robin Finck.) A brand new album could take years to record, tweak, master, mix, arrange, and anything else Axl wants to do with the music. I say put out the already done material first, then record a brand new album after the European tour this summer. What would be ideal would be to release a new album in either April or May of this year, use the European tour to promote it, then record after the European tour for a 2013-2014 release. You know, start recording like a regular band. Right now, people see this as "Axl's band," but releasing new music with singles and music video's will make people begin to look at this band as a real band, as Guns N' Roses.

[droezle]

droezle -

do you know what tour means? how was 01.01.01 the first show of a tour when there wasn't a tour? it may have been the first show of the chinese era and there have certainly been tours using the chinese moniker, but it's very clear GNR did not intend to release an album during the attempted 2002 tour nor did they intend to release an album during the 2006 tour. the tours may have shared a name with the album, but the tours were not in support of the record.

the recent US arena tour was not called the chinese democracy tour, but was still clearly a tour in support of the record.

the tour for the record started at the end of 2009. previous tours sharing the same name as the record don't change that fact. a small handful of songs were previewed on previous comeback tours, but it wasn't until 2009 that the majority of the album was played.

the 01/02 shows had 2 or 3 times as many appetite songs played as there were chinese songs. looking at the setlists from back then, it's very clear the tour was intended to re-establish the band, not be the proper tour for the forthcoming album.

The tour started in 2001 and is still going on.

[gnr2012]

Right now, people see this as "Axl's band," but releasing new music with singles and music video's will make people begin to look at this band as a real band, as Guns N' Roses.

if axl wanted that kind of stuff, we would have videos and singles 10 years ago

now he is 50, he's not going to change all of a sudden his modus operandi.......

get real

[Towelie]

I don't really see how the touring could be labeled as endless. The record released at the end of 2008. The tour for the record started at the end of 2009. The first half of the tour lasted a year and ended at the end of 2010. They took a year off and restarted the tour at the end of 2011. It appears if they add South American and US dates that the tour will end at the end of 2012.

I don't really see how two years of touring for your new album is "endless" touring. Considering the length of time spent making the album, it would stand to reason that once it was actually released that the band would want to do a proper lengthy tour.

While it may be unusual that the tour started a year after the release of the record and that there appears to have been a one year break in between the beginning and end of the tour, overall I don't see 2 solid years of touring as excessive or "endless."

It is excessive to be still touring an album that is nearly 4 years old, especially one which wasn't even promoted by the band at the time of release. How about a few less gigs and a few more music videos? Some actual promotion?

Are they really promoting Chinese Democracy with this tour?? There's two groups of people going to these shows, hardcore fans who already have the album and casual fans who are only going to see Jungle/PC/SCOM/NR. Without a single or a video or some high profile appearances the album is dead in the water, so why continue touring it??

[Voodoochild]

Oh dear God, here we go again...

Voodoo -

"Who cares if they were touring in 2002 without a release date? Its basically the same fucking setlist."

As I already pointed out, you were dead on with your assessment that it's basically the same fucking setlist as 2002. I barely found any differences at all. Only 13 songs were different. That's ridiculous. I'm boycotting the shows until every song is different every night and at least 80% of the songs are unreleased and have never been heard before.

You can keep ignoring what I said as much as you want. You know, twisting things up and using sarcasm to be a smartass isn't really a new thing on the internet.

[One.In.A.Million]

I think the reason why it seems like GN'R are endlessly touring is simply because of the lack of albums in between. If Guns N' Roses had released 3 albums spaced out over the last 10 years, you wouldn't bat an eyelid at the amount of tours, or shows they've played.

But the lack of a product over these years, have made fans feel as if they are seeing GN'R tour constantly in support of the same thing a few years ago.....But that's Axl, and he doesn't show signs of releasing anything soon.

[droezle]

droezle -

yea, you're right. the 2012 shows were definitely the same tour as the 2001 shows. it was so great seeing silkworms in a club.

Where did i say that the 2012 shows were the same as the 2001 shows?

[GNR123GNR456]

I think the reason why it seems like GN'R are endlessly touring is simply because of the lack of albums in between. If Guns N' Roses had released 3 albums spaced out over the last 10 years, you wouldn't bat an eyelid at the amount of tours, or shows they've played.

But the lack of a product over these years, have made fans feel as if they are seeing GN'R tour constantly in support of the same thing a few years ago.....But that's Axl, and he doesn't show signs of releasing anything soon.

[Axl_morris]

Are we arguing about a setlist that's not taken place yet and are assuming it's going to be the same as the last tour?

[Tonyp44]

Just as long as they keep OMG and silkworms off the setlist I'm good. Those two songs suck and I never want to hear them again.

On another note I saw GnR twice once in november and another with the UCAP in atlantic city. Both shows were fucking amazing and when your at the show trust me you can give to shits about the setlist because the show is that incredible.

Are people really complaining about GnR touring TOOO much hahaha I think hell froze over

[Voodoochild]

I think the reason why it seems like GN'R are endlessly touring is simply because of the lack of albums in between. If Guns N' Roses had released 3 albums spaced out over the last 10 years, you wouldn't bat an eyelid at the amount of tours, or shows they've played.

But the lack of a product over these years, have made fans feel as if they are seeing GN'R tour constantly in support of the same thing a few years ago.....But that's Axl, and he doesn't show signs of releasing anything soon.

Agree. Its like its ok to just ignore the lack of new material. Its not like "hey, they just released Chinese, let them go". No, they recorded way more than just one album, even Axl said that, and we waited 17 years for a new album with original tracks. I'm sure they had enough time to promote it, but its already time to let it go and focus on new stuff.

Really, its unbelievable how people could honestly not sacrifice a new leg of an endless tour for a new album.

Hey dude, you're the one that said 2012 was basically the same setlist as 2002. If I choose to use sarcasm to point out how silly your statement was, that's my prerogative.

And yet you're just isolating a quote and ignoring all the rest of what I said.

[droezle]

Oh dear God, here we go again...

Voodoo -

"Who cares if they were touring in 2002 without a release date? Its basically the same fucking setlist."

As I already pointed out, you were dead on with your assessment that it's basically the same fucking setlist as 2002. I barely found any differences at all. Only 13 songs were different. That's ridiculous. I'm boycotting the shows until every song is different every night and at least 80% of the songs are unreleased and have never been heard before.

You can keep ignoring what I said as much as you want. You know, twisting things up and using sarcasm to be a smartass isn't really a new thing on the internet.

Hey dude, you're the one that said 2012 was basically the same setlist as 2002. If I choose to use sarcasm to point out how silly your statement was, that's my prerogative.

08.24.02 - Pukkelpop Festival, Pukkelpop Field, Hasselt-Kiewit, Belgium

set: Welcome To The Jungle, It's So Easy, Mr. Brownstone, Live And Let Die, Think About You, You Could Be Mine, Sweet Child O' Mine, Knockin' On Heaven's Door, Out Ta Get Me, Madagascar, Rhiad And The Bedouins, Guitar Solo [buckethead], Chinese Democracy, Piano Solo, November Rain, The Blues, Patience, Rocket Queen, Guitar Solo [buckethead], My Michelle, Nightrain

encore: Guitar Solo [Robin], Paradise City

02.10.2012 - Roseland Ballroom New York

set:Welcome to the Jungle, It's So Easy, Mr. Brownstone, Estranged, Rocket Queen, This I Love, Richard Fortus Guitar Solo, Live and Let Die, Sorry, You Could Be Mine, Better, DJ Ashba Guitar Solo, Sweet Child O' Mine, Instrumental Jam (Another Brick In The Wall: Part 2), November Rain, Bumblefoot Guitar Solo, Whole Lotta Rosie, Civil War, Knockin' On Heaven's Door, Nightrain

encore: Instrumental Jam, Madagascar, Don't Cry, Motivation, Instrumental Jam, Patience, Instrumental Jam, Paradise City

Exact the same? No, only for about 75-80%. Just a couple more coversongs, a solo here and there and a few C.D. songs that weren't performed in 2002.

[WhazUp]

All in all I do feel that there should be more than just a collection of decade old songs on a four year old album to show for all of this touring