Lies They Tell Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 (edited) This is the shit that is ridiculous about some GNR fans. Can't you just be happy that YOU like the album? Accept that most people don't care. Accept that most people will never care. Accept that most people will never consider CD an important album of any kind. Accept that that's OK and that people aren't wrong or "underrating" the album just because you like it. Just be thankful you have music you enjoy. Get the fuck over it, people.It's not that I don't accept that many people don't like it. Frankly I don't even care. BUT despite all of that, I do believe that CD is underrated and in the future a whole lotta more people will love it and admit that they love it. I do believe the album will get way more recognition in the future, even though I don't really care what other people think of it.It's a different thing to believe in something and to care about something. You get the point?I get the distinction you're making, I just think you're lying to yourself. I think you like the album and are trying to justify how highly you esteem it by making up a story about how it's underappreciated by the masses. We all do shit like this, but it's better to be self aware and realize it's probably just your own biases speaking.Nah, like I said I don't give a crap about what other people think about the album so why would I lie to myself about it? It's like watching sport when I don't care one bit who wins, but the other person seems to be the better player so I believe that person's going to win the game. I don't care but I believe in a certain result anyway. Just like with CD. I'm not trying to convert anyone into liking the album and I'm not trying to justify my personal taste in music by saying it's underrated. I'm just looking at the facts and I believe the album will be much more appreciated in the future. Only time will tell if I'm right. Edited December 10, 2013 by Lies They Tell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunnari Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 Every stylistic crutch Axl used in CD has been developed, used and executed better by other bands.I'm thinking of Muse particularly.Axl's vocal lines and sense of melody are still stellar but he CD songs themselves sound like old UYI tunes that someone from Radiohead tried to glue modern effects onto after a shit load of beer. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aranrod Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 This is the shit that is ridiculous about some GNR fans. Can't you just be happy that YOU like the album? Accept that most people don't care. Accept that most people will never care. Accept that most people will never consider CD an important album of any kind. Accept that that's OK and that people aren't wrong or "underrating" the album just because you like it. Just be thankful you have music you enjoy. Get the fuck over it, people.I couldn't agree more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rustycage Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 This is the shit that is ridiculous about some GNR fans. Can't you just be happy that YOU like the album? Accept that most people don't care. Accept that most people will never care. Accept that most people will never consider CD an important album of any kind. Accept that that's OK and that people aren't wrong or "underrating" the album just because you like it. Just be thankful you have music you enjoy. Get the fuck over it, people.Some people are wanting to blame the people that didn't know about the album for there not being any new music yet."If they would have got off of their lazy asses and went to Best Buy, the album would have sold better and Axl would be wanting to release new material! Thanks a lot assholes!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Facekicker Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 One of the more unforgivable things about CD is the awful vocals. I don't know what the fuck Axl was thinking, but for the most part what he is doing offends my ears. "AH AAAAAH AHH AHHHH EUUURRRHHHH AHHHH UUUGGHHHHHH AAAAAAAAA" "ASK YOUSEEEELLLLWHAT I WOULD CHOOO,TO PROSITUUUUMYSEELLLL"Did he forgot to wear his false teeth that day or something? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoke Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 Quit fucking up the lyrics on purpose....It's "TO PRAH-DI-DOO MYSELLLL" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Facekicker Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 Quit fucking up the lyrics on purpose....It's "TO PRAH-DI-DOO MYSELLLL" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoke Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 I will never get tired of that gif. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 I think the vocals are the worst thing about the album. Production is a close second, but Axl really fucked himself singing so poorly and/or not getting himself in the studio enough to get a proper take. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nosaj Thing Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 One of the more unforgivable things about CD is the awful vocals. I don't know what the fuck Axl was thinking, but for the most part what he is doing offends my ears."AH AAAAAH AHH AHHHH EUUURRRHHHH AHHHH UUUGGHHHHHH AAAAAAAAA""ASK YOUSEEEELLLLWHAT I WOULD CHOOO,TO PROSITUUUUMYSEELLLL"Did he forgot to wear his false teeth that day or something? :rofl-lol: :rofl-lol:Yeah, incredibly awful vocals on that record. Buckethead and Finck sounded fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millions Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 There is about half of a great album in Chinese Democracy.Some songs should never even have been released to the public, ie - Chinese Democracy, Its The World, Scraped, Rhiad. Some are just...... okay - Sorry, Madagascar, Catcher, IRS, Prostitute.Some songs are up there with the best things the band has ever done - Shacklers, Better, The Blues, TWAT, This I Love.I still believe Madagascar could have (and should have) been a classic, but the album version was a castrated version of some of the live renditions we'd had previously (with a much more beautiful solo dropped for some ridiculous reason). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saber_ Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 Chinese Democracy would've been more successful if GnR had released all 30 tracks instead of just 14. Is it an underrated record? I think so. Most underrated album in history? No. I think it would have achieved that status if it wasn't overproduced. I think the riffs, melodies, lyrics, creativity are all in place, but it suffers from "too many cooks in the kitchen" syndrome. Many established artists have this issue. I think it could have very well been the most underrated album in history if it weren't so overwrought in terms of its production and mixing. It needs a little more 'edge' to it. It needs a little more bite. It sounds too, well, mathematically constructed.. or something like that. All that being said, I still think there are some choice cuts on there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 There is about half of a great album in Chinese Democracy.Some songs should never even have been released to the public, ie - Chinese Democracy, Its The World, Scraped, Rhiad. Some are just...... okay - Sorry, Madagascar, Catcher, IRS, Prostitute.Some songs are up there with the best things the band has ever done - Shacklers, Better, The Blues, TWAT, This I Love.That's almost exactly how I feel about those songs. Except I'd move Catcher to the best list. And switch around Rhiad and Sorry. To me, it seems like Blues, Catcher and Twat could have been straight off the Illusions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasted Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 It just has alternative production. Well, Beavan, Baker, Costanzo but mixed by Andy Wallace (Nirvana). I would say each track is not over produced, but there are different production leanings per song. Scraped and Sorry sound like off a different album. It holds together for the most part though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasted Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 (edited) To me the real Axl songs really sound like GNR. SOD Madagascar TWAT Catcher TIL Prostitute And stuff like Chi dem, Shacklers, Riad, Sorry, IRS, Better arent far off. Sorry is like Dont Cry 2. Better is so reminescient of SCOM. The lack of a true Hard Rock rocker like YCBM is whats missing maybe with no Izzy Stones vibe. Although a bit of that on Chi, Shack and Catch. I love IT W but not everyone likes latter day Zepp I guess but is it really a shock that GNR went there. Edited December 11, 2013 by wasted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flayer Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 Thoughts from the other threadQuality of the songs is subjective and up for debate. To say they are shit is disingenuous; each one was obviously a labor of love, they weren't throwaway songs, and they're not just generic rock that sounds like everything else out there. Calling them dislikable, not catchy, overproduced is perfectly legitimate; calling them garbage or shit is idiotic and incorrect.Anyway, whether the record is "good" or "bad" is irrelevant to whether it was successful or not, when we're measuring success by how much it sold and by how widely it caught on and was accepted by the fanbase and by the public at large. Shit sells; we know that; there's a big market for schlock out there, for disposable, generic, throwaway songs. You can't explain the poor reception of the album just by saying it was shit in terms of quality; people will embrace all kinds of shitty music, shitty movies, shitty books, shitty politicians...It's whether it was the record that people wanted to hear that determined how successful it was. Whether it was a masterpiece, a piece of shit, good but not great, mediocre, whatever, all of which have been argued endlessly back and forth on here, its irrelevant. What is relevant is what most of the fanbase and most of the public wanted to hear - the easy answer that comes to mind is a Slash reunion album, but that ain't really it.There were two things people wanted the album to be: badass, or insane. They wanted some straightforward badass rock n' roll music, or they wanted something insanely ambitious and huge, something that would be big enough to match that fifteen year wait. An album of You Could Be Mines, or an album of Comas - YCBMs for the general public that had never paid much attention to GnR since the breakup and just wants some good ol' hard rock from what they see as an old rock band, and Comas for the fans who'd actually been agonizing for over a decade.Chinese Democracy, good, bad, whatever you think, was neither of those things. Most of the songs aren't badass hard rock, and they're not insane, mindblowing epics. Axl wasn't in touch with what the public wanted to hear from GNR; he was doing his own thing, following his own muse, just recording the kind of songs he felt like recording and experimenting with the kind of sound that interested him personally. I'm sure he was expecting a better reception for it, after all he'd put into it - and I'm sure the label saw it coming, that he was basically doing his own thing and that what he was making was not the record that the public was expecting from him, hence the endless tinkering and rerecording.Axl wasn't trying to alienate everybody with Chinese Democracy, he wasn't expecting people to hate it - he was hoping it would succeed, but that it would suceed on his own terms. He wasn't aiming to do that by making the album everyone was expecting, he was aiming to win everyone over to his own personal ideas.Could he have done that if it was released back in 2000? Who knows? But what's clear is that by 2008, hardly anybody had the patience to be won over anymore. For 90% of the people who paid any attention at all to the album, the wait was too damn long. They weren't really aching to hear what Axl had up his sleeve anymore - they were just curious enough to give it a one-over; there wasn't really any passion left. When the gave it that one over, when radio stations gave it that one over, they found out it wasn't badass radio rock, or something mindblowingly epic and insane, the former of which might have grabbed people's attention for a while no matter what band it came from, and the matter of which was the only thing that could justify having waited that long. And after finding that it was neither of the things they wanted, people soured on it pretty quickly and forgot about it.I don't think it could honestly be called a terrible album; it just wasn't the one most people wanted to hear, and that's that, really. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 Chinese Democracy would've been more successful if GnR had released all 30 tracks instead of just 14. Is it an underrated record? I think so. Most underrated album in history? No. I think it would have achieved that status if it wasn't overproduced. I think the riffs, melodies, lyrics, creativity are all in place, but it suffers from "too many cooks in the kitchen" syndrome. Many established artists have this issue. I think it could have very well been the most underrated album in history if it weren't so overwrought in terms of its production and mixing. It needs a little more 'edge' to it. It needs a little more bite. It sounds too, well, mathematically constructed.. or something like that. All that being said, I still think there are some choice cuts on there. You honestly think the lyrics are good? And do you think Axl sounds good? Not trying to pick a fight. Honest questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvH Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 Quit fucking up the lyrics on purpose....It's "TO PRAH-DI-DOO MYSELLLL"Top 3 post of the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasted Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 CD was successful enough, not to be embarrassing and fuelled many tours. It was never plain sailing but it was relatively successful and you can see that in Axls relaxed demeanor, he started having more fun. No more ranting about Serpico and bad cops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron MikeyJ Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 I think history will be kind to it, much like Michael Jackson's album HIStory. But thats a different topic.But the most underrated album of all time? No. Just off the top of my head I can think of one album more deserving, Zeppelin's In through the out door. I hear a lot of similiarities between CD and ITTOD. But honestly I like ITTOD better. My reasoning is simple, Fool in the rain is a better song than anything on CD. It just is a more timeless tune. I love that album though, fool in the rain, all my love, in the evening, I'm gonna crawl, and hotdog are all great tracks. My second reasoning for saying ITTOD is more deserving of the title is because it was still a hit, just not to the level of previous albums. I remember reading an article that stated this album single handedly saved the record industry. It was the shot in the arm that was needed. I guess sales were slumping back in 79' and this album really made people go out and buy albums again. But yet by many, it is considered the weakest or 2nd weakest Led Zeppelin album. So History has looked at it as a lesser work. Adding all of these things up, it gets my vote for most underrated album of all time.Chinese Democracy would make my top 5 in this catagory though, maybe even #2. I just have to sit and think about it some more....Actually Van Halen's Fair Warning would be my #2 choice. Great album that is completly underrated. So CD is at best #3 for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewbacca Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 Chinese Democracy would've been more successful if GnR had released all 30 tracks instead of just 14. Is it an underrated record? I think so. Most underrated album in history? No. I think it would have achieved that status if it wasn't overproduced. I think the riffs, melodies, lyrics, creativity are all in place, but it suffers from "too many cooks in the kitchen" syndrome. Many established artists have this issue. I think it could have very well been the most underrated album in history if it weren't so overwrought in terms of its production and mixing. It needs a little more 'edge' to it. It needs a little more bite. It sounds too, well, mathematically constructed.. or something like that. All that being said, I still think there are some choice cuts on there. You honestly think the lyrics are good? And do you think Axl sounds good? Not trying to pick a fight. Honest questions.Well, I think the lyrics were pretty honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMG Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roush Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 The lyrics were too self-defeating. Estranged had that. But that was one song. An album of songs with similar lyrical content subtracts from the album's sincerity. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classicguns4life Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 Chinese Democracy isn't the most underrated anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Dude Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 (edited) Yeah the lyrics and vocals are my favorite part of the record. They're honest, authentic, and passionate. Edited December 11, 2013 by Mr. Dude Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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