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23 minutes ago, Fourteenbeers said:

I have to ask, what is the point of this post? You invite Fernando to a thread where people are complaining and blaming him/management for things that are happening and then telling him to do something. You think it will help? 

I don't think it will help, but as Russ said previously, a statement from the management could clear things up, although of course I don't expect it to happen 

It was more of a joke than anything else, I mean we've had open letters and everything at this point, I don't know what could help at this point apart from personally talking to them

 

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Del James and Beta, Del excessively so, have both had public tantrums about bootlegging. Del couldn't even summon up a modicum of sympathy for the people who have had threats, because of their history of putting stuff online. It took a heck of a lot of explaining to him for him to even begin, putting away his hatred for online bootlegging, to comprehend the main issue of personal threats of violence. We have to assume then that this is a prevalent opinion at HQ, given the close rapport between those characters and Rose. And there is absolutely no reason on earth why TB couldn't have answered that letter with a base rebuttal (at a minimum). They could have even said, ''we disagree with online bootlegs'' whilst denying their involvement! 

The evidence almost certainly points to endorsement by management. 

You are granting this Alfred person a heck of a lot of power here by assuming otherwise. If it turns out that lyrics are being pulled down well, just how much power are you willing to grant him? He can pull lyrics from (non-social media) online mainstream websites now? He is the most powerful person on the internet!! Ridiculous. 

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Im sure this has already been discussed in some thread but I just got to wondering, is Alfred a very unique internet person or are there all sorts of Alfreds out there? Anyone know of similar situations in other fandoms?

It kinda reminds me of the YT Adpocalypse 2 thing in some ways.

Or better yet, our girl 'Female Axl' on adpocalypse 2

 

Edited by soon
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47 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Del James and Beta, Del excessively so, have both had public tantrums about bootlegging. Del couldn't even summon up a modicum of sympathy for the people who have had threats, because of their history of putting stuff online. It took a heck of a lot of explaining to him for him to even begin, putting away his hatred for online bootlegging, to comprehend the main issue of personal threats of violence. We have to assume then that this is a prevalent opinion at HQ, given the close rapport between those characters and Rose. And there is absolutely no reason on earth why TB couldn't have answered that letter with a base rebuttal (at a minimum). They could have even said, ''we disagree with online bootlegs'' whilst denying their involvement! 

The evidence almost certainly points to endorsement by management. 

You are granting this Alfred person a heck of a lot of power here by assuming otherwise. If it turns out that lyrics are being pulled down well, just how much power are you willing to grant him? He can pull lyrics from (non-social media) online mainstream websites now? He is the most powerful person on the internet!! Ridiculous. 

Make up your mind, did Del not understand there were death threats or did he not care? If I am not entirely mistaken here, he didn't understand it at first, when he did he was sympathetic and talked privately to the one's in question (?).

And no, Del's opinions is not automatically shared by the band/management. 

And yes, it really is very easy to take down YT videos that feature music that obviously belongs to someone else. As for the lyrics, I guess some lyrics sites will have a similar police as YT in regards to copyrighted material and would again err on the side of caution rather than risk any infringement stuff.

And to repeat myself, I am not saying TB isn't involved, just that any certainty in any direction is jumping to conclusions, likely due to existing antipathy.

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1 minute ago, SoulMonster said:

Make up your mind, did Del not understand there were death threats or did he not care? If I am not entirely mistaken here, he didn't understand it at first, when he did he was sympathetic and talked privately to the one's in question (?).

He completely ignored the threats to a large extent, preoccupying his time with a colossal meltdown about bootlegging. 

2 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

And no, Del's opinions is not automatically shared by the band/management. 

We know it is shared by Beta. Do you recall that comment about how online leaks (quoting from memory) ''ruined everything''. 

The evidence stacks up against them. I know some of you don't want to believe that Rose, or people working for Rose, are involved but this is just burying your head in the sand!

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Leaks would be something else than taking down a fanmade concert video (hahaha) or lyrics (hahahahahahaha). That one really boggles the mind. I remember we used to have magazines back in the day and they would have a few song lyrics in there, so we could sing along even if we didn't have the inlay. Will GNR release a lyric book? Will they lose revenue if we can read the lyrics without paying? Next thing they'll be fining you when you're singing along to a song. Or even humming. I really really don't get the lyric thing.

The most powerful person on the internet? Maybe one of the people who has nothing better to do and is absolutely powerless in real life and gets a kick out of saying he works for/with TB? Wouldn't call it powerful if it is that easy to have videos removed. Thankfully, most of us have better things to do than doing that all day!

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1 hour ago, DieselDaisy said:

He completely ignored the threats to a large extent, preoccupying his time with a colossal meltdown about bootlegging. 

We know it is shared by Beta. Do you recall that comment about how online leaks (quoting from memory) ''ruined everything''. 

The evidence stacks up against them. I know some of you don't want to believe that Rose, or people working for Rose, are involved but this is just burying your head in the sand!

Oh the hyperbole! :lol:

And you are not comparing leaks with concert videos on Youtube, are you? Just about every band is against leaks, for good reasons. Being against leaks does not mean you are against unauthorized concert videos.

There really isn't that much evidence. Not enough that I am comfortable with any accusations, at least, but we are all different in that regard.

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Just now, SoulMonster said:

Oh the hyperbole! :lol:

And you are not comparing leaks with concert videos on Youtube, are you? Just about every band is against leaks, for good reasons. Being against leaks does not mean you are against unauthorized concert videos.

There really isn't that much evidence. Not enough that I am comfortable with any accusations, at least, but we are all different in that regard.

Taken collectively it indicates a censorial disposition held by Rose and his management, and I refuse to believe one lone nerd can effectively obliterate Guns N' Roses's online presence from the internet without some top level endorsement.

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In noticed that the list of GnR lyrics in Metrolyrics includes "Every Rose Has Its Thorn," "Cats in the Cradle" and other irrelevant songs (these are not taken down :lol:). It looks like Metrolyrics isn't very well monitored by its contributing community. 

I wonder if this has anything to do with the takedown of the GnR lyrics only from this particular site. Of course, if that's the case, they could have just asked the site to remove the fake lyrics instead of the real ones. 

 

Edited by Blackstar
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Just now, DieselDaisy said:

Taken collectively it indicates a censorial disposition held by Rose and his management, and I refuse to believe one lone nerd can effectively obliterate Guns N' Roses's online presence from the internet without some top level endorsement.

Being against leaks indicates a censorial disposition? Do you hear yourself? :lol:

And again the hyperbole! No lone nerd has been able to "obliterate GN'R's online presence from the internet." Just a large portion of unauthorized videos. And again, having such videos taken down is remarkably easy. I have been the victim of it myself.

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Just now, SoulMonster said:

Being against leaks indicates a censorial disposition? Do you hear yourself? :lol:

And again the hyperbole! No lone nerd has been able to "obliterate GN'R's online presence from the internet." Just a large portion of unauthorized videos. And again, having such videos taken down is remarkably easy. I have been the victim of it myself.

I don't believe you have been following this thing sufficiently? There have been literally hundreds of concerts taken down. You could at one time stick any show into the search engine, Ritz etc, and pull it up.

 

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1 minute ago, DieselDaisy said:

I don't believe you have been following this thing sufficiently? There have been literally hundreds of concerts taken down. You could at one time stick any show into the search engine, Ritz etc, and pull it up.

I don't believe you understand what "GN'R's online presence from the internet" means, which is odd considering it was you who wrote it :). It would take a lone nerd with some serious skillz to also take down Night Rain, gunsnroses.com and all official videos and make your hyperbole come true.

And if the system allows you to take down one video then the only thing that is stopping you from taking down 1000 videos is time, which apparently the loser has enough of. So no, I don't follow your logic.

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3 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

It would take a lone nerd with some serious skillz to also take down Night Rain, gunsnroses.com and all official videos and make your hyperbole come true.

Haha. 

- I wish someone would actually.

Edited by DieselDaisy

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10 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Haha. 

- I wish someone would actually.

Why would you want the official music videos to be removed from the internet? Not much of a fan, are you? Just here to voice your displeasure, right?

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1 minute ago, SoulMonster said:

Why would you want the official music videos to be removed from the internet? Not much of a fan, are you? Just here to voice your displeasure, right?

Nightrain and gnr.com - but you already knew that, didn't you?

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Just now, DieselDaisy said:

Nightrain and gnr.com - but you already knew that, didn't you?

Why did you also put "and all official videos" in bold, then? Did your knee-jerk negative and critical personality overtake your sense?

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8 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Why did you also put "and all official videos" in bold, then? Did your knee-jerk negative and critical personality overtake your sense?

Well I couldn't give a monkeys about any of the music videos compared to the live stuff that was taken down. There is Welcome to the Videos after all, but I am not really a music video type of person - never have been. But you yourself by saying ''Night Rain, gunsnroses.com and all official videos'' demonstrate what their ''online presence'' is reduced to, a crap official website/fan club and a bunch of music promos from thirty years ago which are ubiquitous and everyone always owns. That is why I was laughing at your reply.

PS

I mean you're technically right I suppose, but...

Edited by DieselDaisy

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4 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

I think you are all extremely naive on this personally. As I said earlier, it was only a couple of years ago that Rose was trying to get fat pictures removed! 

apples, oranges

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19 minutes ago, downzy said:

But I would caution anyone who believes that because there's a lack of comment or clarification on this matter that it translates into coordination or involvement by GNR in these matters.

Couldn't agree more.  The neither confirm or deny policy is a bitch to live with especially when you would just love to grab somebody's ass and set it straight.  You take a lot of undeserved punches.  It's a good policy though when you work with the public.

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Guns n roses are the biazarr-Pearl Jam. PJ does everything for their fans, they dont care about bootlegs, hell they even at one point, they may even still do it now, sell every soundboard version of their live shows because they wanted their fans to have good quality bootlegs of their shows.   PJ treats their fans great where as GNR treats their fans like shit. PJ plays a different set list every night, gnr plays the same set list for 10 years.  GNR does not deserve the fanbase they have

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20 minutes ago, gnfnr2k said:

Guns n roses are the biazarr-Pearl Jam. PJ does everything for their fans, they dont care about bootlegs, hell they even at one point, they may even still do it now, sell every soundboard version of their live shows because they wanted their fans to have good quality bootlegs of their shows.   PJ treats their fans great where as GNR treats their fans like shit. PJ plays a different set list every night, gnr plays the same set list for 10 years.  GNR does not deserve the fanbase they have

Well, Pearl Jam is kind of the gold standard of artist-fan relations.  I'm not sure any band would do well in a comparison with Pearl Jam (who are in my top five favourite bands of all time).

I'm not sure it's a matter of what's deserving.  GNR are just who they are, and have always been this way (to a certain degree).  

As much as the fans are handicapped at times by how GNR operates, it does speak to the power of their music and performances.  

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22 minutes ago, gnfnr2k said:

Guns n roses are the biazarr-Pearl Jam. PJ does everything for their fans, they dont care about bootlegs, hell they even at one point, they may even still do it now, sell every soundboard version of their live shows because they wanted their fans to have good quality bootlegs of their shows.   PJ treats their fans great where as GNR treats their fans like shit. PJ plays a different set list every night, gnr plays the same set list for 10 years.  GNR does not deserve the fanbase they have

I’d argue that MetallicA are up there too.

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1 hour ago, RageKage said:

apples, oranges

More ''pies'' I'd say if we are discussing his fat pictures. 

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58 minutes ago, gnfnr2k said:

Guns n roses are the biazarr-Pearl Jam. PJ does everything for their fans, they dont care about bootlegs, hell they even at one point, they may even still do it now, sell every soundboard version of their live shows because they wanted their fans to have good quality bootlegs of their shows.   PJ treats their fans great where as GNR treats their fans like shit. PJ plays a different set list every night, gnr plays the same set list for 10 years.  GNR does not deserve the fanbase they have

Well, you know what you're in for being a Guns fan and whatever that does or doesn't entail.  As hard rock icon Bruce Hornsby said "that's just the way it is".

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