The James Bond Thread: RIP Robbie Coltrane

[Nosaj Thing]

The film has a 77 fresh rating over at Rotten Tomatoes.

Now 66%.

[Black Sabbath]

Too much hype.

[Dan H.]

It's getting a very lukewarm reception. Seems like the consensus is that the film is well made and flashy, and better than Quantum, but with much less substance than Skyfall or Casino.

A lot of critics are saying that it seems like it's uneven and tries too hard to reference back to old Bond, which if true is a super bizarre move this deep into the reboot, although I suppose you could see it coming more and more with the addition of Q, a male M, wackier gadgets, the classic Bond car, etc etc.

Real shame, I would have loved for the best of the Craig series to have had Christoph Waltz as the nemesis, although strangely there's not much praise for him in the reviews. Perhaps he isn't in the film as much? Seems like there may be another primary antagonist

[RichardNixon]

People like to focus on the negative, but most reviews and audience ratings have been fairly positive.

[ZoSoRose]

God damn, this should have been knocked outta the park

[sturginho]

It's getting a very lukewarm reception. Seems like the consensus is that the film is well made and flashy, and better than Quantum, but with much less substance than Skyfall or Casino.

A lot of critics are saying that it seems like it's uneven and tries too hard to reference back to old Bond, which if true is a super bizarre move this deep into the reboot, although I suppose you could see it coming more and more with the addition of Q, a male M, wackier gadgets, the classic Bond car, etc etc.

Real shame, I would have loved for the best of the Craig series to have had Christoph Waltz as the nemesis, although strangely there's not much praise for him in the reviews. Perhaps he isn't in the film as much? Seems like there may be another primary antagonist

I don't get the hype for Christoph Waltz?

[RichardNixon]

If Bond 25 is a direct sequel to SPECTRE, expect Waltz to be back.

[AtariLegend]

If Bond 25 is a direct sequel to SPECTRE, expect Waltz to be back.

I expect him back too. Really curious if they'll introduce other versions of some classic SPECTRE members from the Connery films.

Had this been a TV series and you were going to introduce Blofeld that early, it might have made more sense (even if it was silly) to have most of the board table in shadow.

Will the next film open with the end of On Her Majesty's Secret Service? No way Craig's Bond is ridding off into the sunset happily ever after unless they're rebooting again, which isn't going to happen.

Edited November 4, 2015 by AtariLegend

[dalsh327]

Never heard this cover until today

[Crazyman]

Tonight's the night. If it's what everyone has said (critics included), Craig needs to come back and do one more because his even-numbered movies (QoS, Spectre) are not as good as his odd ones (CR, Skyfall)

Anyway I'm fucking excited either way

Edited November 5, 2015 by Crazyman

[Powerage5]

Fuck all y'all - this is my new favorite Bond film.

I had really high expectations, but I was still really blown away by it. I think it tries to please everyone and that might be what is turning some people off - it has the Craig/Dalton elements, but it also has a good dose of earlier Bond-esque humor (Luckily it never comes anywhere near the cheesefest that was the Moore era). It is heavy on plot, but also heavy on action; neither really dominates the film. Personally I'm not bothered by it straddling those lines - I think everything comes off very natural, but it could be off-putting if you want one very decisive film which plays to a particular school of thought on Bond.

I think they hit it out of the park on this one personally. The casting across the board is fantastic. The plot is good - at first I thought SPECTRE's plan may have been a little thin, but when I thought more about it, it certainly isn't compared to some of the older SPECTRE films. The cinematography is stunning. The action is heart-pounding (Though, I think the Rome car chase may have been very slightly over-hyped). I do still think the Sam Smith song is garbage, but I did like the title sequence visuals.

Some more specific points:

- The pre-title sequence - incredible. Easily one of the best of the series. And I totally want to go to Mexico City for Day of the Dead sometime, it looks like so much fun.

- Right off the bat, I'm loving Fiennes' M, Harris' Moneypenny, and Whishaw's Q. Really cool seeing them in more interactive roles instead of just a quick briefing scene like...pretty much every Bond film before Skyfall.

- Monia Belluci is hot as fuck.

- Waltz's "Welcome James. It's been a long time. But finally...here we are" bit at the meeting in Rome was a different take than the one in the first trailer. The one in the trailer was much better.

- The scene with Bond and Mr. White was great - probably one of my favorite dialogues in any Bond film. So great to see them finally talking to each other one-on-one after Casino Royale and QOS.

- Lea Seydoux is a great Bond girl - one of the things really missing from QOS and Skyfall.

- The scene where Denbigh said to M "Now I know what M stands for - moronic", and M replied with "And now I know what C stands for" everyone in the theater got a huge laugh out of that; clearly I'm not the only one who was thinking it was "cunt"

And some mega spoiler-y stuff:

- Blofeld! Bloefeld! Blofeld!

- Seriously, I can't think of someone better to play Blofeld than Christoph Waltz - he was absolutely perfect. I loved his monologue about the meteor, it was a great counterpart to Blofeld's monologue about the fighting fish in FRWL.

- The moment when Bond woke up and saw the cat - I don't remember ever being that excited in a film ever. That moment, you finally knew that Waltz was indeed playing Blofeld. Then he finally says his name a few minutes later - I had the biggest shit-eating grin on my face. You know it's coming, but it still feels so good.

- Contrary to most people's opinions, I love Bond's connection to Blofeld. The way Blofeld talks about how he was always jealous of how well Bond and his own father got along was great - it was the first time we really learn any of Blofeld's motivations, and I think it plays out wonderfully. Combine that and getting to see how Blofeld gets the scar, I loved it.

- They didn't kill off Blofeld - can we have Waltz back for Bond 25 please?!?

- I will admit that if this is indeed Craig's last Bond, it is a good finish line for him. However, I sort of don't like the idea of Craig having a happy, riding off into the sunset ending given how tormented his Bond is.

[Powerage5]

They better show Q branch rebuilding the DB5 or I'll be pissed.

Holy fuck, you called that one a long time ago.

[Crazyman]

Fuck all y'all - this is my new favorite Bond film.

I hate to do this P5, but what?!

After seeing this film, I would agree with what I posted earlier in this thread - it's the 3rd best Craig film, and it's not even close to CR/Skyfall. I cannot fathom anyone sincerely believing this is better than either of those movies, especially on review.

I could go on a full page tangent on why this movie didn't live up to the hype. I enjoyed it (the people I went with - big Bond fans, fell asleep during it...literally..we went to the 11:30 showing)

I'm not disappointed or anything (especially considering what I knew heading in - no leaks but non-spoiler reviews), but I was wishing for more than I saw. They clearly could've done a lot better with the time they were given.

With that said, I hope (and believe) DC will come back for his last film.

Honestly I can't get over how stupid

that bridge scene is. Seriously? You had 2 years to come up with a final scene...and that was it?!

Edit: my non-spoiler review? They tried to do too much. They introduced a ton of characters but never really introduced them properly. Definitely felt more like QoS than CR/Skyfall

Edit 2: this rando at reddit literally sums up everything I've thought about the movie (at least all the negatives; also it's 4 in the morning...it's a 2 and a half hour film and I went to the last showing of the night)...btw this is gonna be a wall of text

Problems: -Hentai Opening Credits -Quantum is a part of SPECTRE? lame -Why does M want Bond to investigate that guy? Why did she have to wait until she was dead to tell him? -SPECTRE sends an assassin to kill Mr. White .... but apparently they already poisoned him via cell phone -why does Mr. White lead Bond to his daughter when he could just tell him about the hotel himself -Bond sleeping with the daughter of the man who killed Vesper seems like a stretch -Bond shoots one gas tank thingy at the SPECTRE lair and the entire fucking thing blows up. Like what the fuck. Reminded me of Star Wars and the death star -Bond is tortured and supposed to lose his sense of balance and ability to remember people but after his torture he wreaks havoc on the facility as if he is on top of his game. The escape just seemed super easy -Blofeld/Oberhauser is Bond's step brother? really? and his entire motivation is that his dad was fond of his step-brother? -His romance with Swan felt forced -Bond walking off into the sunset with a girl after she was all like "I don't want to be a part of this anymore". I guess her almost getting blown to kingdom come was what she needed to convince her to stay -trying to tie the previous films about Quantum into SPECTRE didn't work. -thought the music was off, though that might just be me -The boat/helicopter chase could have been more exciting than Bond shooting an engine with his PPK (which seems a little implausible). Also less of a criticism than a note for improvement. I felt that right as Bond is driving the boat out of the building that is literally falling apart around him, beautiful bond girl that he just rescued by his side, and Blofeld in his sights would have been the perfect time for the theme song to play. But it didn't. tl;dr I realllllly wanted to love this film but there is too much that brought me out of it, which is a shame because it had so much potential. There is plenty that was great and it was still a good movie but as far as Bond goes I'll give it a 6/10

Edited November 6, 2015 by Crazyman

[Crazyman]

My honest tl;dr (non spoiler) review of Spectre?

The first 15 minutes are the best, like DAD-es,, except it doesnt fail as hard as DAD afterwards. Not sure why so many critics brought up the Moore era - yes, there's some #lulz parts of the movie, but not to the extreme that the reviews have made it seem. Overall, so very many questions not answered (or even explained to the premise), but an enjoyable film.

If I had to rate it at the moment it's probably 15-20-ish. Very similar to QoS in the sense that it tries to ask a ton of but answers very few by the films end (and at 2 and a half hours you'd hope for some answers...)

[AtariLegend]

I watched QOS recently before SPECTRE. There's no comparison at all. QOS is at least 70% set pieces, it's not anyway in comparable to any of the 3 Craig films.

As for bridge the scene, bare in mind that in the original script

Bond just straight up kills Blofeld and the entire concept of bringing back SPECTRE is wasted after a few scenes.

This is an improvement.

[Crazyman]

I watched QOS recently before SPECTRE. There's no comparison at all. QOS is at least 70% set pieces, it's not anyway in comparable to any of the 3 Craig films.

As for bridge the scene, bare in mind that in the original script

Bond just straight up kills Blofeld and the entire concept of bringing back SPECTRE is wasted after a few scenes.

This is an improvement.

I didn't read the leaks, but regardless that's a stupid, stupid idea. I'd actually rather prefer that ending, tbh. At least it would save us from what we got.

Spectre is a 7/10 film at best. It's fine to leave questions (regarding a Bond film in the DC era), but Spectre leaves way too many questions unanswered, not to mention the many potential questions about the film plot itself.

[Powerage5]

I watched QOS recently before SPECTRE. There's no comparison at all. QOS is at least 70% set pieces, it's not anyway in comparable to any of the 3 Craig films.

As for bridge the scene, bare in mind that in the original script

Bond just straight up kills Blofeld and the entire concept of bringing back SPECTRE is wasted after a few scenes.

This is an improvement.

Which leads me to a question I haven't found an answer to yet - just how different was the leaked script? Any chance you could share it? (I'm guessing that's okay to ask now that the film is out).

[AtariLegend]

This should go over the some of the big changes at the time. Skim throughout it, you can see they changed several things from the leaks.

http://defamer.gawker.com/new-bond-script-leaks-execs-scrambling-to-fix-awful-en-1670479885

[sturginho]

This should go over the some of the big changes at the time. Skim throughout it, you can see they changed several things from the leaks.

http://defamer.gawker.com/new-bond-script-leaks-execs-scrambling-to-fix-awful-en-1670479885

Just reading that, I don't see how any of Minghella's concerns which she expressed in her email were addressed at all?

[Nosaj Thing]

63%

[Powerage5]

This should go over the some of the big changes at the time. Skim throughout it, you can see they changed several things from the leaks.

http://defamer.gawker.com/new-bond-script-leaks-execs-scrambling-to-fix-awful-en-1670479885

So it seems like the third act almost completely changed, other than Bond meeting Oberhauser in his lair in Morocco, and both ending up back in London? I'd still be interested to actually read that script if anyone has a copy of it - some of the examples they give of the humorous side of the film are literally exact quotes from the final version.

[Chris1989]

Austin Powers: Spectre.

A brother? WHat a load of bullshit. We all called it bullshit when we saw the leaks, and I thought they might fix it. Crikey what a load of shit. I haven't actually seen the film, but this one thing is enough for me to not want to see it. I'm supposed to believe that the head of a terrorist organisation is conveniently the foster brother to the best spy in the world? Bollocks to that.

Fuck you MGM, Sam Smith.

[Powerage5]

Austin Powers: Spectre.

A brother? WHat a load of bullshit. We all called it bullshit when we saw the leaks, and I thought they might fix it. Crikey what a load of shit. I haven't actually seen the film, but this one thing is enough for me to not want to see it. I'm supposed to believe that the head of a terrorist organisation is conveniently the foster brother to the best spy in the world? Bollocks to that.

Fuck you MGM, Sam Smith.

Who thought they might change Blofeld being Bond's foster brother? They announced Waltz's characher's name as Franz Oberhauser - that name is straight out of Fleming, where he was indeed Bond's foster brother. Granted, in Fleming Blofeld wasn't Oberhauser, but thats beside the point. We knew Waltz would at the very least be playing a villain, if not Blofeld - there was no changing the fact that one of the primary villains of this film would be related to Bond.

All of that is common knowledge if you knew the casting and you know Fleming. It wasn't even a big reveal or twist - they more or less spell it out in the first trailer when they show the legal guardian documents for Hannes Oberhauser (Franz's father) in the first SPECTRE trailer.

[downzy]

How did this scene fit into the overall movie?

[Crazyman]

This should go over the some of the big changes at the time. Skim throughout it, you can see they changed several things from the leaks.

http://defamer.gawker.com/new-bond-script-leaks-execs-scrambling-to-fix-awful-en-1670479885

"Our read is that it's about as good as the last couple Bond movies, which is to say: Not very."

Fuck off, Gawker I mean they weren't wrong about Spectre being pretty bad, but the last few have been fucking great.

Also, even after sleeping on it I have no idea why Roger Moore's name has come up in several reviews. Moore doesn't have a monopoly over some funny scenes in a Bond movie...

Edited November 6, 2015 by Crazyman