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Would this 1 disc Illusions tracklist have been as good as Appetite?


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To be honest, I think it would've surpassed it. No tacky cover versions or b-grade material like Back Off Bitch or Garden of Eden. Just straight up killer rocknroll.

I had to omit Estranged as you can't have four 8+min epics on one album.

 

1. Right Next Door To Hell
2. Dust N Bones
3. Civil War
4. Bad Obsession 
5. Don't Cry
6. Locomotive
7. Breakdown
8. Double Talkin Jive
9. November Rain
10. The Garden
11. You Could Be Mine
12. Bad Apples
13. Coma

Edited by Towelie
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So basically, you would have wanted even less material from GN'R.  No, it was a big project - including the tour - and I like it the way it was done. 

I've never been able to figure a way to get UYI down to 1 album that I'd be happy with. I like too many cuts on both, so it wouldn't fit on one CD. 

Love the twins. Illusions are my favorite records (any artist). Just the fact no one can seem to ever agree on what the mythical 12-14 “combined album” tracks should be- suggests to me they did the ri

27 minutes ago, Towelie said:

To be honest, I think it would've surpassed it. No tacky cover versions or b-grade material like Back Off Bitch or Garden of Eden. Just straight up killer rocknroll.

I had to omit Estranged as you can't have four 8+min epics on one album.

 

1. Right Next Door To Hell
2. Dust N Bones
3. Civil War
4. Bad Obsession 
5. Don't Cry
6. Locomotive
7. Breakdown
8. Double Talkin Jive
9. November Rain
10. The Garden
11. You Could Be Mine
12. Bad Apples
13. Coma

I love the Illusion albums! But your list there wouldn't work for me. So I'll go with:

  1. You Could Be Mine
  2. Live & Let Die
  3. Civil War
  4. 14 Years
  5. Locomotive
  6. Don't Damn Me
  7. Pretty Tied Up
  8. Estranged
  9. Don't Cry
  10. The Garden
  11. Coma

This is an age old question (or rather since 1991) that will never go away... Should the Illusions have been 1 album instead of 2!?

Edited by 19AT5
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The difficulty with these sorts of things (similar to combining Metallica's Load and Reload) is getting a good flow once you've picked the tracks. I don't know whether it'd be better to have two albums and just cut a couple of tracks off each in these instances. That said, I do find it easier to do a combined tracklist for GN'R than Metallica. I'd probably have something like the below (although not entirely set on the order, and could drop in one or two more songs), but then when I look at the B-sides, there's some top songs in there, and enough quality I think to spread the material across two albums.

  1. Right Next Door to Hell
  2. Dust N' Bones
  3. Yesterdays
  4. Perfect Crime
  5. Double Talkin' Jive
  6. November Rain
  7. Pretty Tied Up
  8. Locomotive
  9. You Could Be Mine
  10. Estranged
  11. Dead Horse
  12. Don't Cry

B-sides - Live and Let Die, Bad Obsession, Back Off Bitch, The Garden, Don't Damn Me, Garden of Eden, Bad Apples, Coma, Civil War, 14 Years, Breakdown

Bin off - You Ain't the First, So Fine, My World, Shotgun Blues, Get in the Ring, Don't Cry (alt), Knockin' on Heaven's Door

Edited by drbunnig
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1 hour ago, jamillos said:

So basically, you would have wanted even less material from GN'R. 

No, it was a big project - including the tour - and I like it the way it was done. 

Nah, it's just a bit of hypothetical fun. I absolutely would want the rest of the tracks, either as b-sides or an album of outtakes. 

It's just a question of whether the material they had was strong enough to compete as a single album next to Appetite. I think it was. 

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Just now, Towelie said:

Nah, it's just a bit of hypothetical fun. I absolutely would want the rest of the tracks, either as b-sides or an album of outtakes. 

It's just a question of whether the material they had was strong enough to compete as a single album next to Appetite. I think it was. 

Oh. I believe so too. But then, the band was already different, and so was the sound and the era. So idk where the comparisons would lead. 

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The ballads are probably the most polarising (aside from My World) . If you move them to their own EP, which would probably be close to album length anyway, those that love them can still enjoy them and those that hate them can avoid them and not have them messing up what they might find an otherwise great album.

Ditch the pointless covers and then there is probably only a couple of tracks to cull to make a decent album.

ETA - still won’t top Appetite though and IMO Lies either but I understand many wouldn’t agree with the Lies part. I do find Paitence infinitely more interesting, creative and flat out better than any of the UYI ballads.

Edited by Euchre
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4 minutes ago, Euchre said:

The ballads are probably the most polarising (aside from My World) . If you move them to their own EP, which would probably be close to album length anyway, those that love them can still enjoy them and those that hate them can avoid them and not have them messing up what they might find an otherwise great album.

Ditch the pointless covers and then there is probably only a couple of tracks to cull to make a decent album.

ETA - still won’t top Appetite though and IMO Lies either but I understand many wouldn’t agree with the Lies part. I do find Paitence infinitely more interesting, creative and flat out better than any of the UYI ballads.

The covers always bothered me. I never listen to them and they're piss breaks during the concerts (especially the tedious KOHD). It just felt really lazy song choices to use. It's like Axl thought "we need some stadium sing-along tracks, lets do KOHD and LALD". 

Edited by Towelie
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2 minutes ago, Towelie said:

The covers always bothered me. I never listen to them and they're piss breaks during the concerts (especially the tedious KOHD).

I agree with KOHD totally - it is the only song I’ve heard the original band do live which I don’t like and they did it most shows since it was introduced. I just don’t get it.

So many great original GNR songs why waste setlist time with this ? If I wanted to hear KOHD I’d go to a Bob Dylan show.

I think there is an interview with Izzy where he says it was his favourite song to play live as they elevated it through the arrangement or similar - but it is BS they stole the idea of doing it in that style off a band called Heaven who did it  that way in about ‘85ish.

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12 minutes ago, Euchre said:

I agree with KOHD totally - it is the only song I’ve heard the original band do live which I don’t like and they did it most shows since it was introduced. I just don’t get it.

So many great original GNR songs why waste setlist time with this ? If I wanted to hear KOHD I’d go to a Bob Dylan show.

I think there is an interview with Izzy where he says it was his favourite song to play live as they elevated it through the arrangement or similar - but it is BS they stole the idea of doing it in that style off a band called Heaven who did it  that way in about ‘85ish.

Well, I agree that they should either drop it or play it in the UYI version again (I’d prefer the former), but the ultimate fact is, it’s a singalong song, they do it for the crowds, mainly for the “older” folks. Take a look at the Rock am Ring 2006 video – there’s an older lady who’s singing along while barely knowing even the basic lyrics – but she’s evidently happy, and that’s why they do it. Similar with SCOM. Too big of a hit, too much of a signature matter to be dropped. 

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3 minutes ago, jamillos said:

Well, I agree that they should either drop it or play it in the UYI version again (I’d prefer the former), but the ultimate fact is, it’s a singalong song, they do it for the crowds, mainly for the “older” folks. Take a look at the Rock am Ring 2006 video – there’s an older lady who’s singing along while barely knowing even the basic lyrics – but she’s evidently happy, and that’s why they do it. Similar with SCOM. Too big of a hit, too much of a signature matter to be dropped. 

I'm pretty sure I managed to go for a shit, grab a beer, and get back to my seat when I saw GNR is NYC in 2017 during Heaven's Door! It is boring as sin. Goes on for like 14 mins too. Fuck that!

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5 minutes ago, 19AT5 said:

I'm pretty sure I managed to go for a shit, grab a beer, and get back to my seat when I saw GNR is NYC in 2017 during Heaven's Door! It is boring as sin. Goes on for like 14 mins too. Fuck that!

Tell me about it, with my back pains...

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33 minutes ago, jamillos said:

Tell me about it, with my back pains...

I think I actually prefer the Rock in Rio 2001 version! It was less cheese fest. And the guitars were just cooler. This view may surprise some.

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12 minutes ago, 19AT5 said:

I think I actually prefer the Rock in Rio 2001 version! It was less cheese fest. And the guitars were just cooler. This view may surprise some.

I haven’t heard it in a while, but for me, the highlight of KOHD live would always be that Axl’s fourth scream – which he did best in either Osaka or Tokyo 2009 (I think he was mentioning Ted Danson there) and which was missing in those ‘01 gigs. Plus those Slash’s imaginative solos during the UYI tour. On the other hand, I did like the Village acoustic version. It’s great when you listen to it at night while drinking whisky or something. I could imagine more GN’R songs done this way.

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3 hours ago, AXL_N_DIZZY said:

Love the twins. Illusions are my favorite records (any artist). Just the fact no one can seem to ever agree on what the mythical 12-14 “combined album” tracks should be- suggests to me they did the right thing. Also, I think even as early as 1990, the label, mgmt., Axl, etc. already knew the band (at least as then constructed) may not be around in 5 years. Best (both commercially- and from a legacy POV) to clear the decks with all the Illusions material, plus TSI?, etc. to be sure it got out. Glad they did.

 

My thoughts exactly.

I actually think the best way to listen to UYI is ten songs at a time (in the order in which they were presented in) and pretend like it was three albums. I tried it that way once and I thought it really improved the pacing. I know it wouldn’t have been practical for them to do it that way back in the day, but at least now we can digest the albums in whatever way we please.

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On 3/22/2021 at 5:23 AM, Towelie said:

To be honest, I think it would've surpassed it. No tacky cover versions or b-grade material like Back Off Bitch or Garden of Eden. Just straight up killer rocknroll.

I had to omit Estranged as you can't have four 8+min epics on one album.

 

1. Right Next Door To Hell
2. Dust N Bones
3. Civil War
4. Bad Obsession 
5. Don't Cry
6. Locomotive
7. Breakdown
8. Double Talkin Jive
9. November Rain
10. The Garden
11. You Could Be Mine
12. Bad Apples
13. Coma

Breakdown instead of Estranged?

Dust N' Bones instead of Perfect Crime?

Double Talkin Jive instead of Dead Horse?

I don't know, man.

I think the UYI records are a double album anomally that only worked as it is, even with My World and Shotgun Blues or Don't Damm Me.

Edited by Legendador
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7 hours ago, Towelie said:

To be honest, I think it would've surpassed it. No tacky cover versions or b-grade material like Back Off Bitch or Garden of Eden. Just straight up killer rocknroll.

I had to omit Estranged as you can't have four 8+min epics on one album.

 

1. Right Next Door To Hell
2. Dust N Bones
3. Civil War
4. Bad Obsession 
5. Don't Cry
6. Locomotive
7. Breakdown
8. Double Talkin Jive
9. November Rain
10. The Garden
11. You Could Be Mine
12. Bad Apples
13. Coma

Fuck that. You can't have UYI without Estranged. It's good the way it is. Not every song needs to be killer.

7 hours ago, 19AT5 said:

I love the Illusion albums! But your list there wouldn't work for me. So I'll go with:

  1. You Could Be Mine
  2. Live & Let Die
  3. Civil War
  4. 14 Years
  5. Locomotive
  6. Don't Damn Me
  7. Pretty Tied Up
  8. Estranged
  9. Don't Cry
  10. The Garden
  11. Coma

This is an age old question (or rather since 1991) that will never go away... Should the Illusions have been 1 album instead of 2!?

Answer is no.

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1 minute ago, PatrickS77 said:

Fuck that. You can't have UYI without Estranged. It's good the way it is. Not every song needs to be killer.

Answer is no.

Think you missed the point of my thread. I prefer what we got too, I was just merely asking if a single disc UYI would've been as good as AFD...

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2 minutes ago, Towelie said:

Think you missed the point of my thread. I prefer what we got too, I was just merely asking if a single disc UYI would've been as good as AFD...

It omits Estranged, so I say no. ;)

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1 minute ago, PatrickS77 said:

It omits Estranged, so I say no. ;)

Ha, I didn't wanna omit Estranged, but NR and Estranged on one album would just be overkill. And NR is the better of the two.

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