GunsDK Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 (edited) 19 minutes ago, kiwiguns said: In relation to the cash grab.. Do you work for free or do you get paid so you can pay our bills, feed your famliy, pay your rent or morage... Its their job and its how they make a living.. These guys are just like us. They need to provide for themselfs and there families... In the first half of 2017 alone, the tour grossed $151.5million. Before they reached Asia last year, they had grossed $230 million. So, you know, I think they're ok for money. Their family will not go hungry for a few months at least Edited July 21, 2017 by GunsDK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfierose Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 1 minute ago, Bono said: A hashtag on a billboard the week of the Apollo show to lead people into think that tonight's show would be a special 30th anniversary show. There is no other way about it. That is exactly what those billboards were for. This show, those billboards and the date of it all are not coincidence. It all went hand in hand to mislead people. Just be honest about it and call it what it is. Don't get me wrong, I do get your point. It was clumsy and perhaps a little disingenuous to conflate the two things but the promotion for the show was very clear that it was about NITL. As a fan base we don't help ourselves by over hyping and over analysing every tiny thing. Beta clearly stated yesterday that her hashtags were nothing more than acknowledgement yet many still chose to read more into it. They could have made AFD30 into a really special one off event and I think there's an argument to be had about missed opportunity in that but I don't think we were outright lied to at any point as some seem to think. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goran4 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 4 minutes ago, PatrickS77 said: how can you celebrate that album, maybe even play it in full, exclude Izzy and Steven and keep a straight face? I'm glad they at least had the decency to not do that. They did acknowledge the anniversary in print, but otherwise kept it business as usual. This says it all... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stro Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 They played 8 out of 12 songs from AFD. 1 song was almost never played even during the original tour, 2 have always been sparingly played in all incarnations except the 2002 version, and the other has people bitching about how shitty Axl sounds on it every show. I guess to not play those is totally unethical because it happened to line up with the 30th anniversary of AFD. Axl/Slash/Duff should probably sue themselves for this horrible mistreatment of their fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatrickS77 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 (edited) 7 minutes ago, alfierose said: They could have made AFD30 into a really special one off event and I think there's an argument to be had about missed opportunity in that but I don't think we were outright lied to at any point as some seem to think. And how would you go about doing that without Izzy and Steven? And if they had been willing and agreed to participate, how would you explain their presence for this one off event, but their not being a part of the tour which starts 2 weeks later? A tour they would very much like to participate in, but don't, because they can't deal with Axl/Slash/Duff and can't get them to agree to what they want?? What they could have done, was play an acoustic version of "You're crazy". That would also have been some kind of statement. Edited July 21, 2017 by PatrickS77 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 47 minutes ago, Padme said: In in the end this is just The CD Tour featuring Slash and Duff. All I want them to do is to admit it They should admit that the NITL tour is like the CD tour just featuring Slash and Duff? Isn't it too obvious to have to admit? Have they ever said anything contrary to this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patiencepatience Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 24 minutes ago, Lio said: No idea. I never expected anything outside of nitl for the Sirius show, as soon as I saw the flyer. I thought maybe Steven would possibly guest, but certainly nothing more. Then Beta said Steven and Izzy wouldn't be there and there were still people here thinking they would be, just because she said they wouldn't. Think I'm the realist here, not the naive one. Who knows, maybe we get sth special for afd30, but I'm not holding my breath. I agree with you. If anyone actually listened to Guns N' Roses Radio on Sirius XM, duff recorded actual stuff just to splice between songs. In one of them he literally says "The thirti---wait what? The thirtieth anniversary? That CANT be right" he laughs and says "leave that part in" I might have his dialogue botched to a degree but that's the summation. I don't think anyone was actually expecting a huge turn in events except the die hard 'purists' who've been shitting on this tour from the day it started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfierose Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 3 minutes ago, PatrickS77 said: And how would you go about doing that without Izzy and Steven? And if they had been willing and agreed to participate, how would you explain their presence for this one off event, but their not being a part of the tour which starts 2 weeks later? A tour they would very much like to participate in, but don't, because they can't deal with Axl/Slash/Duff and can't get them to agree to what they want?? What they could have done, was play an acoustic version of "You're crazy". That would also have been some kind of statement. I don't know. Those are valid questions and probably why they chose to acknowledge but not dwell on it too much. Realistically it could have only played out 3 ways, the way it did, a one off show with all 5 classic members or a full celebration with the current line up. All roads lead to criticism of some sort. Anyway on a lighter note I'm looking forward to some reviews coming in from those who attended. It seems more fans got in than originally expected so that is positive thing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RONIN Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 (edited) 52 minutes ago, kiwiguns said: Thats not what i saw at the show i was at. Have you been to any live shows? I saw slash and axl making eye contact and smile a number of times I also saw Duff, Axl and Richard stand back and watch from the corner of the stage and admire Slash while he was playing a solo. I went to a show last year and paid a tidy sum for my ticket. It was a good show and the band was in fine form. I got my moneys worth. Slash in particular gave it his all. I didn't see any interaction but I could barely see the stage from where I was sitting in that stadium. Axl barely talked to the audience. Very professional and to the point. On one hand, they are honoring their commitments and delivering what was promised. On the other hand, it feels soulless a bit to have Axl come out there and say hardly anything to the audience. Like they're simply there to just play the songs and go home. But point taken - I got full value for what I paid. The intention behind my post was that the band "appears" to be operating like a corporate/legacy act...even moreso than other big bands like U2 and Metallica. Atleast Bono and James interact with the crowds and do interviews. Axl and co can't be arsed to do that. Quote In relation to the cash grab.. Do you work for free or do you get paid so you can pay our bills, feed your famliy, pay your rent or morage... Its their job and its how they make a living.. These guys are just like us. They need to provide for themselfs and there families... Oh come on....they are making a fortune on this tour. I'm sure they can feed their families just fine and toss a few bones to Izzy and Steven. They didn't want to do that. Plan and simple. So what conclusions are we left to draw when they're earning hundreds of millions of dollars on this tour? That they're greedy sellout corporate rockers. Exactly what Kurt Cobain called them in 1992. Quote How does Axl and Slash, and the reasons behind them being in Guns n Roses, the money they make, how they act on stage etc affect your life? This is just a ridiculous question to ask on a fan forum. It doesn't affect my life other than deprive me of enjoyment for my favorite band. No more, no less. Axl and Slash don't owe me or any fan - but their antics and lack of regard for fans have dwindled the base from the glory days. This is basically why fans did not show up for Axl's failed 2002 tour or subsequent tours afterwards. If they want to continue touring stadiums and selling out arenas in NA, they'll need to atleast put in some meager token attempts at fan service. As you can see from the way the tickets are selling for the current NA shows, casual fans are ebbing away slowly but surely. Who is going to pay the kind of prices they're asking to see these old farts trot out the same 30 year old songs they've beaten to death? The hardcore fans. Right now - I don't think they're getting much good will from that group of people except for your usual Axl kisasses who thought his braids and oversized jerseys were a good idea. As Jason Newstead recently said, GnR look down on their fans and it has never been more obvious than it is now. Just my 2 cents. Edited July 21, 2017 by RONIN 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 24 minutes ago, kiwiguns said: Thats not what i saw at the show i was at. Have you been to any live shows? I saw slash and axl making eye contact and smile a number of times I also saw Duff, Axl and Richard stand back and watch from the corner of the stage and admire Slash while he was playing a solo. In relation to the cash grab.. Do you work for free or do you get paid so you can pay our bills, feed your famliy, pay your rent or morage... Its their job and its how they make a living.. These guys are just like us. They need to provide for themselfs and there families... How does Axl and Slash, and the reasons behind them being in Guns n Roses, the money they make, how they act on stage etc affect your life? Ah, ok well, this is good to know. I realise that those three 'interacting' isn't the be all and end all, but it'd be nice if there was some semblance of camaraderie among them, even as 'work colleagues' if not genuine friendship. I'd hate to think it's all a sham, or that we're being sold a lie, which is something that has crossed my mind, I'll admit. As to why any of this affects people? Well, I guess we take these things personally because music is deeply personal - like it or not. Music soundtracks our lives. It gets us through tough times. We make long lasting connections with the music and, by extension, the artists who created it. It's natural to feel emotional about how that music is presented and represented. I'm not angry. What they do or don't do has no bearing on my actual life. It's just...there are so few bands in the modern era that have produced an album (never mind a debut) that's had the musical and cultural impact of AFD and I'm just really fucking disappointed more wasn't done to celebrate or even acknowledge that on the anniversary itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RONIN Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 25 minutes ago, ironmt said: How many people are leaving the shows feeling as If they were ripped off? I think the fact that many people have attended more than one show as well as a second show being added to certain Cities pretty much tells the story. Many more people are leaving satisfied as opposed to feeling they didn't get what was advertised or the show they desired. This forum Is a grain of sand on a beach In terms of concert attendance. After the first Las Vegas show people were aware of who was In the band. They were also aware of the fact that Axl was Injured and Immobilized and the second night still sold out along with the stadium shows. Fair point. I certainly got a great show when I saw the band last year. I think you're underestimating fan support and word of mouth - especially in North America. Guns is not worshiped here like they are in other parts of the world. Casual fans are more than likely not going to pay to see this band more than once or twice, especially at these ticket prices. With the reunion novelty wearing off, they need hardcore fan support to keep the machine rolling. That just won't happen at this level forever unless something fundamentally changes with the way they do fan outreach. If bands like Metallica have to do fan service, GnR is not immune to this. Ultimately, it will catch up to them and hurt their bottomline. Remember, Axl played to half empty arenas in 2002, despite a much hyped comeback and good press from the media initially. He had burned so much fan goodwill, there wasn't much support from either the casual or hardcore fans. Both had deserted him. Not saying that's entirely the case here, but as you can see from the NA shows - there is already attrition amongst the ticket buyers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironmt Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 8 minutes ago, RONIN said: Fair point. I certainly got a great show when I saw the band last year. I think you're underestimating fan support and word of mouth - especially in North America. Guns is not worshiped here like they are in other parts of the world. Casual fans are more than likely not going to pay to see this band more than once or twice, especially at these ticket prices. With the reunion novelty wearing off, they need hardcore fan support to keep the machine rolling. That just won't happen at this level forever unless something fundamentally changes with the way they do fan outreach. If bands like Metallica have to do fan service, GnR is not immune to this. Ultimately, it will catch up to them and hurt their bottomline. Remember, Axl played to half empty arenas in 2002, despite a much hyped comeback and good press from the media initially. He had burned so much fan goodwill, there wasn't much support from either the casual or hardcore fans. Both had deserted him. Not saying that's entirely the case here, but as you can see from the NA shows - there is already attrition amongst the ticket buyers. All valid points, but I have to wonder how much the guy with the bucket on his head, along with Axl's reputation and continued lateness affected the crowd turn out for the band In 2002? He seemed to regroup and had a much better run from 2006 on. At any rate, I agree, they are going to have to work on ticket prices. A casual fan Is not going to dump $250-275 for a ticket and a little more fan Interaction certainly Isn't going to hurt. It Is a little disappointing that they are not willing to duplicate Metallica's recipe for success when It comes to fan Interaction. Truthfully, they have made so much money over the past 2 years that maybe they just don't care at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldek Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 So, any full reviews out there yet? (I mean on the concert not on Axl's voice only) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bono Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, ironmt said: How many people are leaving the shows feeling as If they were ripped off? I think the fact that many people have attended more than one show as well as a second show being added to certain Cities pretty much tells the story. Many more people are leaving satisfied as opposed to feeling they didn't get what was advertised or the show they desired. This forum Is a grain of sand on a beach In terms of concert attendance. After the first Las Vegas show people were aware of who was In the band. They were also aware of the fact that Axl was Injured and Immobilized and the second night still sold out, along with the stadium shows. You have absolutely no grasp on what it is people are even talking about or why they feel "ripped off" or misled. And the way people like you twist shit is hilarious. The second night in Vegas was sold out LONG before anyone knew Axl had a broken foot but nice try trying to say people knew all about it and still wanted to buy tickets after seeing Night 1. Regardless it was their first real shows with Slash in 23 years so people were gonna buy tickets anyways even if they were all in wheel chairs. It wasn't some grand achievement. It amazes me how some of you manage to get through day to day life being so incredibly clueless to what's going on around you. Edited July 21, 2017 by Bono Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RONIN Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 6 minutes ago, ironmt said: All valid points, but I have to wonder how much the guy with the bucket on his head, along with Axl's reputation and continued lateness affected the crowd turn out for the band In 2002? He seemed to regroup and had a much better run from 2006 on. At any rate, I agree, they are going to have to work on ticket prices. A casual fan Is not going to dump $250-275 for a ticket and a little more fan Interaction certainly Isn't going to hurt. It Is a little disappointing that they are not willing to duplicate Metallica's recipe for success when It comes to fan Interaction. Truthfully, they have made so much money over the past 2 years that maybe they just don't care at this point. Pretty much what I think basically. If this is a short term run, then their playbook for this tour seems to be relatively on point. It doesn't seem promising for any longevity though post-NITL. I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens at the end of the year. I think if Axl can maintain his vocals, they'd be absolutely crazy not to do another leg of stadium/festival touring in Europe and Asia. Easily another potential 100 million + to be made over there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfierose Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 19 minutes ago, baldek said: So, any full reviews out there yet? (I mean on the concert not on Axl's voice only) Not seen any as yet but it's probably too early given the time in NY. I expect some will start rolling in later today, we had maybe 5/6 forum members attending I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristmasFnatic Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Oh well. Im still hopeful for the future. Though if this is all we get, Im atleast thankful for a partial reunion. Thank God Im also an Aerosmith and Bon Jovi fan. Steven Tyler's voice hardly declined, and as much as people mock Bon Jovi, atleast theres new music every 2-3 years. Though fuck you traitor Sambora! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nalbi Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 (edited) Just spent two hours reading everything that has been posted since I went back to sleep. I have really mixed feeling about this, as I do get both sides who came up with very legitimate arguments. In the end, the only thing that really bothers me is the misleading advertisement that many people here have reported. I've been to 5 NITL shows all over the world and I'd be more than happy to add a 6th one by the end of the new NA leg, but I just believe last night wasn't the time nor place for a regular set. The date, the iconic place, the national live broadcast, all conditions were met to make this night unforgettable, so I'd be lying if I said I'm not disappointed with what I heard. Solid and enjoyable performance of my favorite band? Definitely. Worth getting up at 3:30am and feeling like a zombie at work today? Nope. Edited July 21, 2017 by Nalbi 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfierose Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 2 hours ago, Pishy said: Tickets were free for Apollo. There were a lot of pluses: it was loud, you could see everything, guitars on fire. I liked the small venue. Yesterdays, Patience and My Michelle were not all played at a lot of the shows. Axl did a lot more dancing I think. And last but not least, Fortus is extremely hot. Did you get to attend? I remember you were driving by yesterday but wasn't clear if you had a ticket or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShadowOfTheWave Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 It was clear to me when the reunion happened that Axl had given up on being an artist. The Axl we knew from the 80s to 2010 is almost an unrecognizable individual to the one that resurfaced in Rio 2011. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfierose Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 Not sure if this was posted yet. Apologies if it has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristmasFnatic Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 3 minutes ago, ShadowOfTheWave said: It was clear to me when the reunion happened that Axl had given up on being an artist. The Axl we knew from the 80s to 2010 is almost an unrecognizable individual to the one that resurfaced in Rio 2011. You know, I always think of this. Even the change in his appearance is so drastic, its almost like a different person. Esp with how fast it happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xBrownstonex Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 (edited) It's so sweet to see so many people butthurt. It's like the band insulted them personally. Get a fucking life if things like that upset you so much. It's not healthy. oh an besides: show me where the BAND promoted it as a appetite celebration. If you can do so, i will voluntarily listen to some u2 and vomit after. Of course everyone would've loved to see at least steven. But it's our own fault to expect this cause nothing really indicated it. Plus, it's not the end of the fucking world. Linkin Park fans would love to be in our shoes right now. Get some fucking perspective in life. Edited July 21, 2017 by xBrownstonex 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tadsy Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 (edited) Reading through the different comments on this thread, how anyone can blame the fans for getting their hopes up is beyond me?? Seriously WTF dont get me wrong, I'm in the camp of not buying into shit when it comes to this band. I don't get my hopes up easily and I am fully aware of the history of the band generally underwhelming it's fans in terms of what other bands do do for their fans. But as others have pointed out, GnR were the ones who alluded to a special event, they were the ones who changed the game up by advertising AFD 30 as sonething that was being seriously celebrated. I've donr marketing at university level and I'll tell you this, any idiot could see they were baiting the waters to get a bite for this, so to dish up precisely nothing should come with a backlash! This whole idea that it is the fans fault for getting excited it utter bullshit, yes some of us (me included) generally don't fall for it, and yes they never said anything precisely was going to happen, but it was implied. And there lies the problem, they threw this shit out there to generate the interest, and they've blown it. i don't expect them to give a shit, no doubt they all made millions again last night, and some of you will applaud them for that and say how good the show was but quite frankly it's missing the point. This whole shit show is deceiving. And if any of gnr's management had a half a back bone they'd come on here and answer some questions! You can't tell me their people aren't browzing this board! We know for a fact that slash was on here on the second afternoon of the Sydney shows, they KNOW what we are saying and yet nothing changes! Its actually mind blowing how fucking ignorant and arrogant they are to their own fan base! I love the music, I love the band, but I don't have to love the way they operate. It's disgusting when you break it down! Edited July 21, 2017 by Tadsy 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikosgnr Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 92 fckn' pages... I left it in 24.. Damn. Anyone with a "TL;DR" thing? Nice show last night? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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