Unofficial updates on 2020 tour

[PatrickS77]

25 minutes ago, jackparker123 said:

Just had my email from Ticketmaster Germany regarding the cancelled Hamburg gig offering me a voucher 

It states that a cash refund option is only freely available AFTER 31/12/2021, but it does say "An earlier refund is only possible if accepting a voucher would be

unreasonable taking into account your personal circumstances

".

Anyone know what I need to tell them to get my refund?? It's outrageous how they are able to hold onto my money for another 16/17 months.

I always tell them that my personal circumstances makes it unreasonable for me to accept a voucher. One promoter, after some forth and back, did accept that and cashed my voucher. The others told me to go fuck myself. I'm currently in contact with Live Nation. Seeing that I have 2 tickets with them for 400 € maybe they see my point.

[allwaystired]

37 minutes ago, jackparker123 said:

Just had my email from Ticketmaster Germany regarding the cancelled Hamburg gig offering me a voucher 

It states that a cash refund option is only freely available AFTER 31/12/2021, but it does say "An earlier refund is only possible if accepting a voucher would be unreasonable taking into account your personal circumstances".

Anyone know what I need to tell them to get my refund?? It's outrageous how they are able to hold onto my money for another 16/17 months.

I'd honestly go down the route of saying you've been in an accident or something. At this stage, anything to get cash back. 

I'm beyond disgusted that we have to resort to these lengths though. If you choose to cancel a show, then every single penny spent should be back in people's accounts ASAP, without question or hesitation. We paid in good faith for a concert - that didn't happen. 

It's a disgrace really. Essentially our money is being used by Ticketmaster to keep their bank accounts healthy, and we have to resort to battles and lies to get it back. 

It's their fucking problem if they decide not to run these shows - NOT MINE. And let's be honest, it really is their CHOICE not to run them. There's no chance in hell 8 countries didn't have any suitable venues, it was sales. And you know what, if your sales were piss-poor, then move to a smaller damn venue and play the show if you want to keep my money. If you don't want to do that, then give me my fucking money back. 

There's no excuses whatsoever, and if this was, say, a web-store that offered products, then saiud 'oh we're not making that product anymore' and didn't give people their money back instantly, they'd be shut down. 

FUCK TICKETMASTER. This policy will dictate where my gig money is spent from now on in. 

Edited August 7, 2020 by allwaystired

[Blackstar]

Right...

"Live Nation Says Fans Are Keeping Tickets for Missed Shows"

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-08-05/live-nation-says-fans-want-credit-not-refunds-for-missed-shows

[PatrickS77]

22 minutes ago, allwaystired said:

I'd honestly go down the route of saying you've been in an accident or something. At this stage, anything to get cash back. 

I'm beyond disgusted that we have to resort to these lengths though. If you choose to cancel a show, then every single penny spent should be back in people's accounts ASAP, without question or hesitation. We paid in good faith for a concert - that didn't happen. 

It's a disgrace really. Essentially our money is being used by Ticketmaster to keep their bank accounts healthy, and we have to resort to battles and lies to get it back. 

It's their fucking problem if they decide not to run these shows - NOT MINE. And let's be honest, it really is their CHOICE not to run them. There's no chance in hell 8 countries didn't have any suitable venues, it was sales. And you know what, if your sales were piss-poor, then move to a smaller damn venue and play the show if you want to keep my money. If you don't want to do that, then give me my fucking money back. 

There's no excuses whatsoever, and if this was, say, a web-store that offered products, then saiud 'oh we're not making that product anymore' and didn't give people their money back instantly, they'd be shut down. 

FUCK TICKETMASTER. This policy will dictate where my gig money is spent from now on in. 

As much as I love to say FUCK TICKETMASTER. The blame here lies with the concert promoters (Ticketmaster can't refund, when the concert promoter says "No refunds."). It is in their discretion whether they utilize the loopholes which the national governments provided them with or if they show a concience and do the right thing and return money for cancelled shows. For sure it wasn't the governments intent to save concert promoters asses, who scheduled piss poor selling concerts. They are assholes and are using the Corona crisis to get out of crappy situations they have put themselves in. 

Edited August 7, 2020 by PatrickS77

[PatrickS77]

6 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

Right...

"Live Nation Says Fans Are Keeping Tickets for Missed Shows"

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-08-05/live-nation-says-fans-want-credit-not-refunds-for-missed-shows

Stomach that (and I've been saying that all along): The vast majority of customers who bought tickets for shows from No. 1 promoter Live Nation Entertainment Inc. -- about 86% -- are holding onto their tickets in hopes that events canceled because of Covid-19 will be rescheduled, rather than taking refunds.

and yet these concert promoters claim that they will go bankrupt if they return the money to the 14 % who rather have their money back. Nevermind that most shows are still 1 year out. So they get to sit on the money of 86 % for over a year.

Edited August 7, 2020 by PatrickS77

[Stay.Of.Execution]

I wrote live nation an email saying i cant pay my rent right now because I’m out of work (which is a total lie but fuck them) and that i need the money. Rather their employees get fired than me not getting my fucking money back

Edited August 7, 2020 by StayofExecution2020

[allwaystired]

10 minutes ago, PatrickS77 said:

Stomach that (and I've been saying that all along): The vast majority of customers who bought tickets for shows from No. 1 promoter Live Nation Entertainment Inc. -- about 86% -- are holding onto their tickets in hopes that events canceled because of Covid-19 will be rescheduled, rather than taking refunds.

and yet these concert promoters claim that they will go bankrupt if they return the money to the 14 % who rather have their money back. Nevermind that most shows are still 1 year out. So they get to sit on the money of 86 % for over a year.

I'd argue massively that fans 'want' that. It's certainly not what we're seeing anecdotally. Has one person here said they'd prefer credit to their cash back? Why would you want that over cash? A voucher that expires which you probably won't use? Ummm......cash back please. There are no advantages to having a voucher at all. 

I think most people are probably like us - TRYING to get money back. Or pissed off and don't know how to try. 

 

16 minutes ago, PatrickS77 said:

As much as I love to say FUCK TICKETMASTER. The blame here lies with the concert promoters (Ticketmaster can't refund, when the concert promoter says "No refunds."). It is in their discretion whether they utilize the loopholes which the national governments provided them with or if they show a concience and do the right thing and return money for cancelled shows. For sure it wasn't the governments intent to save concert promoters asses, who scheduled piss poor selling concerts. They are assholes and are using the Corona crisis to get out of crappy situations they have put themselves in. 

I was under the impression Live Nation are the promoters, which makes them the same thing as Ticketmaster? 

[PatrickS77]

3 minutes ago, allwaystired said:

I'd argue massively that fans 'want' that. It's certainly not what we're seeing anecdotally. Has one person here said they'd prefer credit to their cash back? Why would you want that over cash? A voucher that expires which you probably won't use? Ummm......cash back please. There are no advantages to having a voucher at all. 

I think most people are probably like us - TRYING to get money back. Or pissed off and don't know how to try. 

 

I was under the impression Live Nation are the promoters, which makes them the same thing as Ticketmaster? 

The article says that fans are holding on to their TICKETS. I do too. I only want money back for the concerts that have been cancelled or are in countries I will no longer travel to.

No. Live Nation produces and funds the shows. Ticketmaster sells the tickets for them.

[allwaystired]

Just now, PatrickS77 said:

The article says that fans are holding on to their TICKETS. I do too. I only want money back for the concerts that have been cancelled or are in countries I will no longer travel to.

No. Live Nation produces and funds the shows. Ticketmaster sells the tickets for them.

Ha- yeah that's true. I've held on to others. Not that I bought them from Ticketmaster mind. But then they hit me with rescheduled dates pretty rapidly. I'd have held on to GNR tickets too, having said that. 

OK. I was under the impression Live Nation were promoting in most places. Clearly not. 

 

[northernsoul]

1 hour ago, jackparker123 said:

Just had my email from Ticketmaster Germany regarding the cancelled Hamburg gig offering me a voucher 

It states that a cash refund option is only freely available AFTER 31/12/2021, but it does say "An earlier refund is only possible if accepting a voucher would be unreasonable taking into account your personal circumstances".

Anyone know what I need to tell them to get my refund?? It's outrageous how they are able to hold onto my money for another 16/17 months.

That's a joke

If the German government want to prop up multi billion dollar multi nationals then give them a loan, don't expect the fans to effectively loan them the cash to survive!

[jackparker123]

3 minutes ago, northernsoul said:

That's a joke

If the German government want to prop up multi billion dollar multi nationals then give them a loan, don't expect the fans to effectively loan them the cash to survive!

The most annoying thing is I'm a pretty regular gig goer, maybe 3 or 4 gigs a year on average, and have been doing that for getting on 15 years now, and this just happens to be the very first ever gig I've booked outside of the UK.

And I only booked tickets for Hamburg because the London dates conflicted with a stag do!

[JY2016]

I have sort of accepted that the German government has passed law that enables the promotors to give vouchers rather refunds, assuming that it will benefit the many people employed who would otherwise lose their jobs. For me it is okay as I do not need the money immediately and the cash would have been gone by now anyway if the show would have taken place. I can just wait for next year. But of course, appreciate everyone’s opinion if they want their money back. 
 

So aside from whether you want a refund or a voucher, what really frustrates me in this digital age is:

(i) that Eventim wants you to fill in the bar code of your ticket online to generate a PDF that you have to print and send with the original ticket back. I am considering registered mail since I don’t want to have them claim that they never received it back. But that means additional costs. They can send you mails about developments regarding the show, recognise the barcode, but yet you need to send the hard copy??? It’s worthless anyway since the show is fully cancelled (talking about the Aerosmith gig), so it is not that you can resell the ticket.

 

(ii) Ticketmaster has a button online to request your voucher which will be granted in a few weeks, although they have no problem finding you with three e-mails with the same topic within an hour. Why not immediately generating the voucher code?

I had Hamburg but purchased FOS1 for Munich this week (yes, I really did). I would have gladly used one of the vouchers but the above has made it impossible to do that. So now I have paid €175 but have some €375 for vouchers pending to be granted. 
 

And if you do not use the voucher before you Dec 2021, you can get the refund ultimately but only if you apply for that by the end of December (they hope you will forget it? I am sure they will not send reminders that the voucher is about to expire)

 

A voucher system in itself can be defended although again, I appreciate the many people that want their money back. What I find unacceptable is that they give so many hurdles to get the voucher in the first place, that is really outrageous in this digital age. Why can’t this be generated automatically?

 

Is there any institution for consumer representation in Germany where complaints can be filed?

[PatrickS77]

17 minutes ago, JY2016 said:

I have sort of accepted that the German government has passed law that enables the promotors to give vouchers rather refunds, assuming that it will benefit the many people employed who would otherwise lose their jobs. For me it is okay as I do not need the money immediately and the cash would have been gone by now anyway if the show would have taken place. I can just wait for next year. But of course, appreciate everyone’s opinion if they want their money back. 
 

So aside from whether you want a refund or a voucher, what really frustrates me in this digital age is:

(i) that Eventim wants you to fill in the bar code of your ticket online to generate a PDF that you have to print and send with the original ticket back. I am considering registered mail since I don’t want to have them claim that they never received it back. But that means additional costs. They can send you mails about developments regarding the show, recognise the barcode, but yet you need to send the hard copy??? It’s worthless anyway since the show is fully cancelled (talking about the Aerosmith gig), so it is not that you can resell the ticket.

 

(ii) Ticketmaster has a button online to request your voucher which will be granted in a few weeks, although they have no problem finding you with three e-mails with the same topic within an hour. Why not immediately generating the voucher code?

I had Hamburg but purchased FOS1 for Munich this week (yes, I really did). I would have gladly used one of the vouchers but the above has made it impossible to do that. So now I have paid €175 but have some €375 for vouchers pending to be granted. 
 

And if you do not use the voucher before you Dec 2021, you can get the refund ultimately but only if you apply for that by the end of December (they hope you will forget it? I am sure they will not send reminders that the voucher is about to expire)

 

A voucher system in itself can be defended although again, I appreciate the many people that want their money back. What I find unacceptable is that they give so many hurdles to get the voucher in the first place, that is really outrageous in this digital age. Why can’t this be generated automatically?

 

Is there any institution for consumer representation in Germany where complaints can be filed?

Yeah. It's a total shit show and absolutely bollocks, ridiculous and backasswards.

Unfortunately it's not only Germany that has changed it's laws to the detriment of customers. I've posted the link several times before, here you can find some more Information on how the countries handle it and also where you can complain:

https://www.evz.de/en/shopping-internet/coronavirus-cancelled-events.html

[AtariLegend]

London show if it happens is the same day England play (possibly Scotland) at Wembley not that far away in the final game of their group. Might be a bad day for transport.

[allwaystired]

59 minutes ago, jackparker123 said:

The most annoying thing is I'm a pretty regular gig goer, maybe 3 or 4 gigs a year on average, and have been doing that for getting on 15 years now, and this just happens to be the very first ever gig I've booked outside of the UK.

And I only booked tickets for Hamburg because the London dates conflicted with a stag do!

I probably do a minimum of 4/5 gigs every month. Towards the end of last year I did 7 in 7 days (a bit much!) but all this has really, really soured me to ever using Ticketmaster again, or even booking too far in advance from any agency really. 

I think that's what they're not taking into account. You're a business and you treat people like shit.....people will react to that in the future. 

 

[jackparker123]

7 minutes ago, allwaystired said:

I probably do a minimum of 4/5 gigs every month. Towards the end of last year I did 7 in 7 days (a bit much!) but all this has really, really soured me to ever using Ticketmaster again, or even booking too far in advance from any agency really. 

I think that's what they're not taking into account. You're a business and you treat people like shit.....people will react to that in the future. 

 

Wow. You must be a lot richer than me! With ticket prices starting at £50-£60 nowadays I can't afford to go more than once every few months!

In an ideal world I'll never buy another ticket through Live Nation after this fiasco.

[allwaystired]

34 minutes ago, jackparker123 said:

Wow. You must be a lot richer than me! With ticket prices starting at £50-£60 nowadays I can't afford to go more than once every few months!

In an ideal world I'll never buy another ticket through Live Nation after this fiasco.

Oh, no I'm totally broke! I'd imagine I'm way poorer than you! At least I hope, for your sake, I am! haha! A lot of them are very small gigs (so super cheap) or ones I've manged to get a free ticket to. I rarely go to ones that cost £50-£60 for exactly the same reason as you. I simply can't afford it. Probably about 4 or 5 of them a year, same as you. Unemployed now too though....so there will be a lot less! That's one of the reasons I want my money back in my bank account asap rather than sitting in Ticketmaster's. 

Yeah, I don't think I'll be giving Live Nation any money if I can possibly avoid it. It would have to be something I was DESPERATE to see and there were zero other ticket options I think to make me give them my money again. I'm hoping that situation will never arise. 

 

 

[Gavin82]

1 hour ago, AtariLegend said:

London show if it happens is the same day England play (possibly Scotland) at Wembley not that far away in the final game of their group. Might be a bad day for transport.

Which show Fri or Sat

[PatrickS77]

@jackparker123 and other foreigners

Wow. Got a response from Live Nation. They quoted the new law regarding postponed and cancelled shows due to Corona and that customers in these cases do get a coupon, but since I'm not german and live abroad, they will not make use of that and refund me the tickets. I have to mail them to Live Nation and they will instruct Ticketmaster to refund the money. Yay. So, for all of you non german people with tickets for Hamburg, write to Live Nation and ask for that refund.

Edited August 7, 2020 by PatrickS77

[ZoSoRose]

Got my refund very easily. Comerica Park did not utilize Ticketmaster so that explains my ease

[PatrickS77]

15 minutes ago, ZoSoRose said:

Got my refund very easily. Comerica Park did not utilize Ticketmaster so that explains my ease

Again. It's not Ticketmaster. I got all my US and Canada Ticketmaster bought tickets refunded without having to do anything.

[tsinindy]

On 8/7/2020 at 8:41 PM, PatrickS77 said:

Again. It's not Ticketmaster. I got all my US and Canada Ticketmaster bought tickets refunded without having to do anything.

How is that?  you have to do something...other than for cancelled shows they don't just refund tickets, you have to ask for a refund.  So, you either had tix to shows that got cancelled or you did something.

[EricA]

He for sure isn't aware of the "voucher solution" in some EU countries

but anyways, feel free to overflow TBs email, that bigmouth is practically begging for it

 

[allwaystired]

51 minutes ago, EricA said:

He for sure isn't aware of the "voucher solution" in some EU countries

but anyways, feel free to overflow TBs email, that bigmouth is practically begging for it

 

I shall certainly be taking him up on this. 

Edit: It looks like that was targeted at one specific complaint, rather than a general thing. But I think it's good if people bring to his attention the various struggles with refunds, just to make him aware. It's probably something no-one has mentioned to him, so (like most people) he'll rightfully think "show cancelled, ticket holders get refunded". 

Edited August 9, 2020 by allwaystired

[PatrickS77]

10 hours ago, tsinindy said:

How is that?  you have to do something...other than for cancelled shows they don't just refund tickets, you have to ask for a refund.  So, you either had tix to shows that got cancelled or you did something.

All my US and Canada shows got cancelled and I got an e-mail for each, saying that the show was cancelled and the money would be refunded. Obviusly, if the show is postponed, they need to be notified, whether you wanna go to the new date or want your money back. All I said is that you get your refunds with TM USA, Canada and Ireland easily. It's just TM Germany, that was a problem, but that was due to the promoter Live Nation Germany handling things differently. But in the end they were easy to work with and promised to refund my tickets.

Edited August 9, 2020 by PatrickS77