THE GENERAL - MONSTERS - Official Discussion Thread. NO LINKS OR ASKING FOR LINKS

[colonizedmind]

13 hours ago, WhazUp said:

Random tin-foil theory, the song is about an abusive relationship between the kid and the parent, maybe the parent acted more like a "General" (dictator) more than a parent, and it was a theme inspired when Axl saw Brain's working title for it?

Ya....and I think he had the theme/lyrics in him already and was just waiting for the music.....a song about abuse was mentioned before Brain even turned in this musical idea, right? So he was looking for suitably deranged and horric mix/vibe to put these lyrics to. That's my feeling....

I'm soo desperate for Dec 8th (or before) to hurry up ...so we get the final/full vision as intended. They obviously have done stuff to it as it would of come out as is fine otherwise, unless they've just lied about the delay (possible but unlikely now they've put that statement out, they would just said nothing otherwise)  

It's a bit of a shame as per recent history, if it had come out as expected, I'm pretty sure they would of been attempting it live on Friday (as Fortus said a month ago he looking forward to getting it in the set?) and certainly by Hollywood Bowl, etc...now that won't happen, it seems...Shame. It would of been an epic way to end these 7 years before what may be a long break and new recordings (maybe) and era..

Halloween would be perfect to release to all their channels...but that would be abondoning their initial vinyl exclusive plan but I think the reasons to do that and the cool surprise (I am bummed not to experience that as was intended, we would of gone crazy to get a bonus track or two parter on vinyl out of nowhere !!) Are now out the window, so may as well adapt and take advantage of being in control of where folk get to hear this, there's still time, it's early days, but leak fatigue will sadly effect our excitement as has always been the case, if we have to wait another 6 weeks and nothing much changes...such a shame! I'll support anyways.

I always wish these things would come out JUST after official but we rarely get official, so...in another world....

Edited October 29, 2023 by colonizedmind

[Sisyphus]

I love it. LOVE IT! Been listening to both songs over and over again. I can't wait for the official release. I want more, more, more. 

[rumandraisin]

Headphone listen for The Gen:

 

Currently digging that talkbox wah thing Slash does at 3.15 on the hip hop breakdown on The General. 

Solo at 4 minutes really sounds Bucketish. Slash has excelled himself on this.

And Duff isn't getting many mentions but the bass is quite funky in The General. 

Those Beltrami sweeps in the intro. So great to have this in context after 27 years of hearing the classic show intro. The screeching high pitched strings in the bridge! 

Brain. What is there to say. The drum rolls at the end of each chorus. Followed by Duffs hip hop bass. 

I hear a sitar sounding keyboard effect in verse two. 

I wonder who we have on the rhythm parts. I really wouldn't be surprised if there's some Robin still here. 

The last solo though ... Dare I say Bucket?

 

[rumandraisin]

Thinking about the old orchestra intro, it really was a mash up of the two. Quite clever really. Starting with the General then the slow parts from the chorus, then the high pitch trills followed by the slow sweeps from Monsters. 

[Voodoochild]

9 hours ago, WhazUp said:

I am fairly certain, at this point in time especially after listening to it on good headphones most of these 2 days and not my phone which is where my first listen occured, that it is Slash on all lead parts save for the second half of the outro solo of Monsters which is Fortus

TG has Slash's signature wah sound and listening closely the runs are very Slash-esque especially when comparing to the Slash-isms I heard live a few weeks ago

I'm pretty sure too. And I love the part Slash plays in Monsters' outro, before Richard takes in. 

Speaking on Richard, check this run at 1:37 and compare with his run in Monsters at 4:21 (it's slower, but the phrasing is similar)

 

[Jw224]

This is exactly the kind of thing I've been waiting on Axl to release. 

[rumandraisin]

Monsters. 

Opening, those low vocals. Remember the story about the Jan 2007 recording section, Axl jumping from song to song adding little bits on each? I always imagine the "it was a long time" parts in TWAT were one if those things but I like to imagine the "monsters in the..." being one of these too. 

Duff. What is he doing on that intro, it's like evil Funkadelic shit. Real deep and funky. 

Chorus is oddly catchy. 

I love those guitar chords after the chorus, real sleaze. 

I can't believe the effort Slash has gone to here. Not just Slash but whoever is playing. 

First solo reminds me a little bit of Civil War. I'm not sure why. 

After the solo back to my favourite strings. Two really cool guitar parts going on each side. You get a reprise of the strings from the General before the Axl vocals start screaming. 

The breakdown. Guitar sleaze. 

Then Axl starts screaming. The Christmas card of pure venom! Holy moly. 

There's so many guitar layers by now in the last chorus, I can hear at least 4. I'm fairly sure Bucket is in here. 

Last solo does seem to change half way. There's a second solo on the left channel too. I'm hearing Slash on the last solo though, not Fortus. 

Then it ends. 

These are two of the best Guns tracks. Hands down. Game over. The peak of the CD era and Axls true vision. 

[Grayfox]

At the start of the bridge in The General is it just me or does it sound like the “cricket” effect from the intro of Mustache is there?

[Freightrain]

On 10/27/2023 at 5:35 PM, GNR 1991 said:

I was there for you

It’s all I could dooooo

Oh, but it’s over now!

On repeat in my head since the first listen

[chester]

3 minutes ago, Grayfox said:

At the start of the bridge in The General is it just me or does it sound like the “cricket” effect from the intro of Mustache is there?

It’s there. 

[kitstuai]

9 hours ago, WhazUp said:

I am fairly certain, at this point in time especially after listening to it on good headphones most of these 2 days and not my phone which is where my first listen occured, that it is Slash on all lead parts save for the second half of the outro solo of Monsters which is Fortus

TG has Slash's signature wah sound and listening closely the runs are very Slash-esque especially when comparing to the Slash-isms I heard live a few weeks ago

Yeah Oklahoma has slash's signature wah sound too

[Asdiz]

As someone raising two little kids and not able to keep up w gnr to the degree that I’d like - I cannot follow this thread. When is the general and monsters coming out to streaming? I don’t care to go find leaks, I want to hear the official version. 

[jamillos]

Sorry if already asked, but can the whole thing fit on the vinyl, or do we think they're gonna put there just the first part? I hope not.

[MJRoses23]

10 minutes ago, rumandraisin said:

. 

These are two of the best Guns tracks. Hands down. Game over. The peak of the CD era and Axls true vision. 

Nailed it. These are right up there with the best GNR song. Axl at his absolute best. 

[Jw224]

2 minutes ago, jamillos said:

Sorry if already asked, but can the whole thing fit on the vinyl, or do we think they're gonna put there just the first part? I hope not.

I think they can usually fit up to 8 mins, but that's really pushing it and it usually isn't done. November Rain was released on a 7 inch but I'm not sure how that actually sounded. 

[Freightrain]

27 minutes ago, rumandraisin said:

Headphone listen for The Gen:

 

Currently digging that talkbox wah thing Slash does at 3.15 on the hip hop breakdown on The General. 

Solo at 4 minutes really sounds Bucketish. Slash has excelled himself on this.

And Duff isn't getting many mentions but the bass is quite funky in The General. 

Those Beltrami sweeps in the intro. So great to have this in context after 27 years of hearing the classic show intro. The screeching high pitched strings in the bridge! 

Brain. What is there to say. The drum rolls at the end of each chorus. Followed by Duffs hip hop bass. 

I hear a sitar sounding keyboard effect in verse two. 

I wonder who we have on the rhythm parts. I really wouldn't be surprised if there's some Robin still here. 

The last solo though ... Dare I say Bucket?

 

I was thinking maybe Richard? 

I really hope that's slash tho... It would make his best work since... Well... UYI.... 

[tony adler]

You would be correct sir, that Buckethead zip and precision, there is no other 🤘

[BreakDown2014]

A little summary I made of what we expected vs what we got:

- The orchestral intro: It seems like the orchestral intro is a blend from Beltrami's work on both songs, since they share a similar motif. Most of it is from The General, though. It also isn't an intro like some people expected, but an orchestral arrangement that can be heard throughout the song.

- The cellphone clip: unfortunately I only have on my computer a brief extract of the cellphone recording, but it's 100% Monsters. Would be cool to know if both songs were played back to back on the  Viena party.

- Instrumental: The General isn't an instrumental track like some speculated.

- They're both reworked songs with Slash and Duff: Both songs definitely have Slash and Duff all over it it. Maybe we will never know if there's any guitar work from Robin, Paul or Bucket left on the final versions (like Robin's famous bend on Perhaps).

- Evader's version: IMO he was damn close on the screaming Axl vocals part. The rest of his version suffered from the confusion of thinking the cellphone clip was The General instead of Monsters but was a very cool guess. One of my first reactions after hearing both songs was "Evader got pretty damn close".

- ¿Is it an "epic" like we expected from Slash's comments?: This is obviously very subjective but if you take both songs as a whole it definitely fits my definition of "epic".

- Child abuse lyrics on The General: Yes.

- Bach's comments on The General:  The chorus has the slow grinding riff with high piercing vocals but it's impossible to understand how this could be a sequel to Estranged.

- Soul Monster's bridge: The vocals definitely fit the description Axl gave on the 2008 chats.

- ¿A reworked State of Grace?: IMO Monsters and State of Grace share a similar vibe but are definitely not the same song. This means State of Grace could still be released someday and make a great trilogy along with The General and Monsters (eventhough it will probably never get an official release).

- Mysterious soundcheck: the BPM from Frank's beat don's seem to match Monster nor The General my conclusion is that they were definitely not playing any of these 2 songs.

[jacdaniel]

Buckethead is not on these songs at all. That's 100% Slash. 

[Underhardy]

You know… I shit on these songs for Axls lyrics and effects on his vocals… particularly on The General, I still can’t make our half of that songs lyrics. But.. holy shit is the potential there in these songs to be all timers… some of the vocals mixing just bothers me, but aside from that… these are fucking insanely cool/amazing songs 

[Blackstar]

6 minutes ago, BreakDown2014 said:

A little summary I made of what we expected vs what we got:

- The orchestral intro: It seems like the orchestral intro is a blend from Beltrami's work on both songs, since they share a similar motif. Most of it is from The General, though. It also isn't an intro like some people expected, but an orchestral arrangement that can be heard throughout the song.

- The cellphone clip: unfortunately I only have on my computer a brief extract of the cellphone recording, but it's 100% Monsters. Would be cool to know if both songs were played back to back on the  Viena party.

- Instrumental: The General isn't an instrumental track like some speculated.

- They're both reworked songs with Slash and Duff: Both songs definitely have Slash and Duff all over it it. Maybe we will never know if there's any guitar work from Robin, Paul or Bucket left on the final versions (like Robin's famous bend on Perhaps).

- Evader's version: IMO he was damn close on the screaming Axl vocals part. The rest of his version suffered from the confusion of thinking the cellphone clip was The General instead of Monsters but was a very cool guess. One of my first reactions after hearing both songs was "Evader got pretty damn close".

- ¿Is it an "epic" like we expected from Slash's comments?: This is obviously very subjective but if you take both songs as a whole it definitely fits my definition of "epic".

- Child abuse lyrics on The General: Yes.

- Bach's comments on The General:  The chorus has the slow grinding riff with high piercing vocals but it's impossible to understand how this could be a sequel to Estranged.

- Soul Monster's bridge: The vocals definitely fit the description Axl gave on the 2008 chats.

- ¿A reworked State of Grace?: IMO Monsters and State of Grace share a similar vibe but are definitely not the same song. This means State of Grace could still be released someday and make a great trilogy along with The General and Monsters (eventhough it will probably never get an official release).

- Mysterious soundcheck: the BPM from Frank's beat don's seem to match Monster nor The General my conclusion is that they were definitely not playing any of these 2 songs.

Great summary.

Regarding Evader's version, I'm glad that he got the "intro" part ("who would to this to you" etc.) of the phone clip wrong in his otherwise exceptional work.

When the phone recording and his version was all we had as "The General", I was thinking that if the real song was anything like that regarding that part, it would suck. I totally hated it. But the oooh-oooh's melody in Monsters is awesome. It really gives me Bowie vibes and it's one of my favourite parts in the song.

[2020_Intensions]

12 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

Great summary.

Regarding Evader's version, I'm glad that he got the "intro" part ("who would to this to you" etc.) of the phone clip wrong in his otherwise exceptional work.

When the phone recording and his version was all we had as "The General", I was thinking that if the real song was anything like that regarding that part, it would suck. I totally hated it. But the oooh-oooh's melody in Monsters is awesome. It really gives me Bowie vibes and it's one of my favourite parts in the song.

Agreed on the oooh-oooh's - Love it

[Uncle Bob]

Lyrics from the general seem to be an "evolution" of these lyrics Axl wrote when he was younger

[AxlRQ93]

If General is Pt I, Monsters is pt 2 and SOG is part 3 

[colonizedmind]

53 minutes ago, Jw224 said:

I think they can usually fit up to 8 mins, but that's really pushing it and it usually isn't done. November Rain was released on a 7 inch but I'm not sure how that actually sounded. 

Sounded pretty good....