Jw224 Posted August 5, 2017 Author Share Posted August 5, 2017 It's one of my favourite albums. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussTCB Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 10 minutes ago, Jw224 said: It's one of my favourite albums. Same here. It's my favorite GNR album by a long shot. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstar Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 (edited) According to metacritic.com, it received 12 positive reviews, 14 mixed and 2 negative: http://www.metacritic.com/music/chinese-democracy/guns-n-roses The criteria for an album to be included in Wikipedia's worst list is if it has been characterized as such by at least one critic or outlet. Edited August 5, 2017 by Blackstar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
default_ Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 (edited) Im a rock n roll and classic gnr fan but I think CD is really insteresting, theres nothing like it around and even if its not what everyone wanted for a GNR record, it is still a really interesting and not bad at all record. But it was clearly a mistake by Axl part for not considering what the original band was and only following his own agenda, he got nuts, lost important years of his career and in the end had to reunited with Slash to get peace. Had he just took a time from GNR and released CD as a solo album, I think things would be different and it would have turned into a cult classic instead of that "weird gnr album". Edited August 5, 2017 by default_ 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jw224 Posted August 5, 2017 Author Share Posted August 5, 2017 15 minutes ago, default_ said: Im a rock n roll and classic gnr fan but I think CD is really insteresting, theres nothing like it around and even if its not what everyone wanted for a GNR record, it is still a really interesting and not bad at all record. But it was clearly a mistake by Axl part for not considering what the original band was and only following his own agenda, he got nuts, lost important years of his career and in the end had to reunited with Slash to get peace. Had he just took a time from GNR and released CD as a solo album, I think things would be different and it would have turned into a cult classic instead of that "weird gnr album". I definitely agree, it was mistake to continue with the Gnr name for that venture. It would be much more appreciated if he had presented it as his own solo effort instead of trying to associate it with the old GNR. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sosso Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Jw224 said: I definitely agree, it was mistake to continue with the Gnr name for that venture. It would be much more appreciated if he had presented it as his own solo effort instead of trying to associate it with the old GNR. I disagree. It wasn't the band name that was responsable for the bad critics. I would rather say that the overproduction and the long delays are the main factors Edited August 5, 2017 by Sosso Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AXL_N_DIZZY Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 My guess is that Axl likes Chinese fine- but would have preferred to keep working on it- particularly now that he's heard Slash's & Duff's takes on some of the tracks. Whatever the case- love it/hate it/indifferent- at minimum it's a "frame of reference"-type album (in terms of time, cost, radical line-up change to a legendary band, etc.) that has its niche place in rock history secured. Overall the music is perhaps not that well-known- but the album title and concept is IMHO. Could be worse... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarlaHooch Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 As a huge fan of the album/era I wonder this myself a lot, but I gave up trying to get inside Axl's head a long time ago. I just know that I will be a first day buyer of his memoir if it ever comes out, and I'll likely put my life on hold to read it cover to cover as quickly as possible. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenMichaels Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 I for one believe that there are 9 or 10 good, some great, songs lost in the layers of over-produced shit that is Chinese Democracy. And then I think songs like If The World, Riad and Scraped are simply some of the worst songs of all time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
default_ Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 1 hour ago, Sosso said: I disagree. It wasn't the band name that was responsable for the bad critics. I would rather say that the overproduction and the long delays are the main factors It was the band name, the dalays, the overproduction, the lack of original members and most important: the direction change. Had it been release over Axl rose name it wouldnt have suffered from any of that tho, its undeniable. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jw224 Posted October 5, 2017 Author Share Posted October 5, 2017 Coming back to the fact that he has said the CD songs are his favourite to perform live now, do we think that is directly related to how he handles his vocals/his general vocal ability? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papashaun Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 (edited) Just my 2 cents worth: A lot of casual people view the album as a "failure" so to speak, just due to the amount of money/time spent on the album before it's release, with underselling numbers....that does play a huge factor, considering quite a few songs on the album had already been played live/were leaked years before the album even dropped. But....Axl has to know deep down that it is his fault in a sense that the album under-sold. For one....I'm sure management was ready to go full throttle with promotion: including videos, maybe using a song for a commercial, TV Night Show Appearances, Hyped Tour, pushed merchandise.......but Axl apparently didn't want any of that.....I remember a quote from him just after it's release, basically stating, "It's just an album." In additon....the album was a Best Buy exclusive....had it been available at all stores/music stores at that time, I'm sure sales would have picked up....Myself....I live 1-1/2 hours away from the nearest Best Buy, and actually bought the album new for about $3.00 more than the retail price, from a record store that had purchased about 10 copies from Best Buy to sale locally. Myself, I do like the album overall......and I feel if Axl had chosen to push the album promotion, many more people would have been exposed to the music, and would have found a better appreciation of the work. Edited October 11, 2017 by papashaun Grammar errors. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Axl refused to promote it as far as I recall. He had a vision for its promotion but label said no, just this. So he didnt participate. It was hip for music snobs to hate it. They hated it before they heard it. And this despite the fact that many music snobs like Replacements, Buckethead (and his projects with Brain), Primus, NIN, Tool, Vandals, etc. On the day of its release I walked into the local record store, beaming ear to ear, walked up to the counter as new big albums were usually kept in box right at checkout. I proudly requested my copy. The owner looked at me with disgust and sneered "we've been selling it for weeks, I dont know where it is now." He later relented and huffed as he dug a copy out from a pile of boxes. I took it home and loved it ever since. Also a friend of mine who wore a team Axl shirt to a NITL tour - who hates Steven just because Axl does - didnt know CD songs. Id say its just because the general vibe among music fans told her to hate it so she did? I think Axl knows he's not hip in music snob circles and I think theres evidence that this hurts his feelings. But I hope he can separate that from how he feels about the album. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sosso Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 I think that he is still very positive about it. He wouldn't perform some of the songs live, would he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chunder Monkey Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 I'd assume he still likes the songs. Logically he had every chance and reason to bury the CD songs with the reunion, but instead the reunion era has embraced them - so you'd assume he still likes them - and he has said he enjoys performing them. Perhaps he still feels they were never finished completely though - when you consider it seems prior to NITLT the band was working on DJ and Bumble re-dos of the songs, and we know there's alternative Brain remixes of others. I'd assume he has mixed feeling about the struggle. It seems the post-slash era was a lot harder for him at times than we realise, and you'd assume a part of him wishes it could have been simpler and easier and not taken the time it has. But musically - i still think his vocals on it are amongst his best stuff and I get the impression they are still proud of it too or the songs wouldn't be on the setlist during a reunion. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axls5thMetatarsel Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 On 8/5/2017 at 10:50 AM, RussTCB said: Fair enough. I mean, it's the internet so of course there's going to be people putting lists like this together. The album still got many great reviews when it was released though and a lot of people enjoy it. So there's plenty of people on both sides of the fence. Years ago Estranged was on a VH1 (or MTV? Pretty sure VH1) worst songs of all time list... so yeah.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gackt Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 On 8/5/2017 at 10:00 AM, SevenMichaels said: https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_music_considered_the_worst&ved=0ahUKEwjngdXQrMDVAhVhL8AKHSK1DCoQFggiMAA&usg=AFQjCNHJbMHjR2l-bLRHSyvcuJhG8pLLhw https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://loudwire.com/worst-albums-legendary-bands/&ved=0ahUKEwjngdXQrMDVAhVhL8AKHSK1DCoQFghCMAI&usg=AFQjCNGp3I4ZRDEi94VkZdZ06TW3DYLtxA Just a couple of prime examples. Any "worst album" list that doesn't contain Corey Feldman or Kid Cudi is trash. ChiDem is a classic, it just needs a proper release. The Best Buy exclusive schtick didn't do the album any favors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janrichmond Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 26 minutes ago, Axls5thMetatarsel said: Years ago Estranged was on a VH1 (or MTV? Pretty sure VH1) worst songs of all time list... so yeah.... Pretty sure that was worst videos not songs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 3 minutes ago, janrichmond said: Pretty sure that was worst videos not songs That was a terrible video. Although not as nearly as bad as the video for Since I Don't Have You. Sorry, off topic. lol I'm pretty sure Axl still loves CD and so he should. It's a great album. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom-Ass Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 Terrible album.. There were a few songs with potential but the final product sucked.. It is not cohesive at all... Too many musicians... Axl's voice sounded terrible on a good portion of it. Too many layers and terrible drum loops.. The songs still suck with Slash playing on them... Would have had a lot more respect for Axl if he had released it as a solo album... Aside from Axl's voice (at times) this sounded nothing like Guns N Roses. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
appetite4illusions Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 Even the best artists look back on their art and want to change things, so I'm sure that he has regrets about not only the final product, but the road it took to get there. I'm willing to bet that Axl used to listen to the CD material every day, fifteen years ago. He romanticized it. I would be very surprised if he listened to his own work for pleasure, at this point. He's at an age when he can put that in his rear view mirror. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom-Ass Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 On 8/5/2017 at 11:50 AM, RussTCB said: Fair enough. I mean, it's the internet so of course there's going to be people putting lists like this together. The album still got many great reviews when it was released though and a lot of people enjoy it. So there's plenty of people on both sides of the fence. Same can be said about the positive reviews though.. I have a lot of family, friends and acquaintances that are big music, Gn'R, or rock fans in general. I can literally only think of one person that liked it and another that said he liked it when it came out but doesn't like it any more. I am talking about people I know, not on the internet. I remember the big local hard rock radio station playing the whole thing from front to back when it came out and people just ripped the shit out of it. They never played another song from it after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 10 minutes ago, Tom-Ass said: Terrible album.. There were a few songs with potential but the final product sucked.. It is not cohesive at all... Too many musicians... Axl's voice sounded terrible on a good portion of it. Too many layers and terrible drum loops.. The songs still suck with Slash playing on them... Would have had a lot more respect for Axl if he had released it as a solo album... Aside from Axl's voice (at times) this sounded nothing like Guns N Roses. Yeah, the electronic drum beats are terrible! I like the album, minus If the World, but the electronic drums are so very bad. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janrichmond Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 2 minutes ago, Tom-Ass said: Terrible album.. There were a few songs with potential but the final product sucked.. It is not cohesive at all... Too many musicians... Axl's voice sounded terrible on a good portion of it. Too many layers and terrible drum loops.. The songs still suck with Slash playing on them... Would have had a lot more respect for Axl if he had released it as a solo album... Aside from Axl's voice (at times) this sounded nothing like Guns N Roses. I am trying to like it but it's so hard, I think it sounds too busy, like there's too much going on. I guess that's what others call over produced? I dunno I'm not well versed on that era and only listened to it when i joined the forum. I have also heard some of the demos and they are better. I feel Axl has to play some CD tracks to justify to himself (and the odd fan) that CD wasn't a failure. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussTCB Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 13 minutes ago, Tom-Ass said: Same can be said about the positive reviews though.. I have a lot of family, friends and acquaintances that are big music, Gn'R, or rock fans in general. I can literally only think of one person that liked it and another that said he liked it when it came out but doesn't like it any more. I am talking about people I know, not on the internet. I remember the big local hard rock radio station playing the whole thing from front to back when it came out and people just ripped the shit out of it. They never played another song from it after that. No, I know. I mean, it is what it is. Some people love it, some people hate it. Due to the breadth of the internet and opinions, someone could make a case either way about what the "general opinion" is. The only thing that's fact is that it's divisive, that's for sure. 6 minutes ago, janrichmond said: I am trying to like it but it's so hard... IMO, you shouldn't have to try to like it. There's no rule that says you have to like it because it says Guns N' Roses on the cover, ya know? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts