Axl is on Budweiser advertising

[ThinkAboutYou]

I have no problem with Axl in the ad

My main problem is the rapping version of paradise city it's terrible

[Crash Diet]

I have no problem with Axl advertising bottles of piss drinks (and Nightrain actually refers to their wild days so it's not a big deal. That is a song, this is a beer commercial)

Yeah, this rap SCOM is the main "problem" for me... How is this allowed when Ax usually against these type of things?
But as someone mentiones earlier the big problem is: Slash and Axl are BOTH sellouts. The difference is: Slash NEVER claimed to NOT love money. He is a moneywhore in some point of view. Fact
Axl claimed that he is/was against the commercial shits. Now he became a sellout.
But the bigger sellout thing is playing MOSTLY GH tours for so many years...
Anyway either Axl or Slash do what the fuck they ewant with their rights. It's up to them, not us
Still find it a bit hilarious that this thread go on 30 page long, though (which where i'm participating also )

[alfierose]

http://www.mygnrforum.com/index.php?/topic/175508-axl-predicted-slash-would-do-car-commercial/page-6

As I wasn't here before 2012 I did a search on threads about Slash's commercial. I found the above thread, it reached a mighty 6 pages and to be honest doesn't contain the level of Slash bashing that you might imagine reading this thread. Most of the posters are long gone and the rest are warchild. I appreciate there were probably other threads but they don't seem to be available to view any longer.

Anyway my point being is that apart from maybe 4-5 posters at the most the majority here seem fairly capable of being balanced and seeing the grey areas in the Axl/Slash thing. The whole taking sides idea is blown way out of proportion.

[Mendez]

So just because Axl has never been pictured drinking a Budweiser means he doesn't drink it?

I don't know what you're talking about. That's airtight logic.

He seems to be in a good mood in the commercial, so that's nice.

Also less bloated Edited June 13, 2014 by Mendez

[Padme]

No, the point is: Slash has been called many bad names for doing advertising or simply being into more commercial stuff than Axl. The Axl fanatics loooove to call Slash a sell out and media whore. Also, "$la$h" shows up a lot when they want to show how Mr. Hudson prostituted himself for money and shame and you know it. Now that Axl is doing the same thing, the fanatics are trying to do two things: Prove that Slash is an even bigger sell out or that Axl appearing for some seconds in a Bud ad is no big deal. Well, it is. He's in the ad, feautring a rap version of PC that must have had been approved by Axl/TB beforehand. That IS selling out. Doing a Vegas residency using the Apettite name to promote it IS selling out. Axl AND Slash are both money whores. That's the point. Axl fans will have to accept that him and the devil, the cancer, are essentially the same. Axl is in it for the money, not the music, not the art like the army of fanatics likes to believe.

So what, because the "fanatics" have assumed he was opposed to this stuff, when it turns out he's not, he's a sellout? That makes no sense.

I've argued Slash's case to those same people many times too (he's an astute businessman and there's nothing wrong with it), I'm not really sure what your point is?

Fans haven´t assumed anything. They were lead to believe in Axl´s integrity by Axl himself. Sure you can say those fans were naive. Or they just believed what they wanted to believe. You know, we hear Axl talking about integrity in the song Prostitute. Now we see that what he says there is bullshit.

[supercool]

Fans haven´t assumed anything. They were lead to believe in Axl´s integrity by Axl himself. Sure you can say those fans were naive. Or they just believed what they wanted to believe. You know, we hear Axl talking about integrity in the song Prostitute. Now we see that what he says there is bullshit.

exactly

[SoulMonster]

No, the point is: Slash has been called many bad names for doing advertising or simply being into more commercial stuff than Axl. The Axl fanatics loooove to call Slash a sell out and media whore. Also, "$la$h" shows up a lot when they want to show how Mr. Hudson prostituted himself for money and shame and you know it. Now that Axl is doing the same thing, the fanatics are trying to do two things: Prove that Slash is an even bigger sell out or that Axl appearing for some seconds in a Bud ad is no big deal. Well, it is. He's in the ad, feautring a rap version of PC that must have had been approved by Axl/TB beforehand. That IS selling out. Doing a Vegas residency using the Apettite name to promote it IS selling out. Axl AND Slash are both money whores. That's the point. Axl fans will have to accept that him and the devil, the cancer, are essentially the same. Axl is in it for the money, not the music, not the art like the army of fanatics likes to believe.

So what, because the "fanatics" have assumed he was opposed to this stuff, when it turns out he's not, he's a sellout? That makes no sense.

I've argued Slash's case to those same people many times too (he's an astute businessman and there's nothing wrong with it), I'm not really sure what your point is?

Fans haven´t assumed anything. They were lead to believe in Axl´s integrity by Axl himself. Sure you can say those fans were naive. Or they just believed what they wanted to believe. You know, we hear Axl talking about integrity in the song Prostitute. Now we see that what he says there is bullshit.

The only way you can lose integrity be appearing in a commercial is if you have recently claimed that doing so would go against your values. Everyone who claims that Axl loses integrity from this must provide some evidence for how this is compromising his values; and if you can't do that then perhaps it is your assumptions about Axl that were compromised and not Axl's integrity.

Edited June 13, 2014 by SoulMonster

[highvoltage]

No, the point is: Slash has been called many bad names for doing advertising or simply being into more commercial stuff than Axl. The Axl fanatics loooove to call Slash a sell out and media whore. Also, "$la$h" shows up a lot when they want to show how Mr. Hudson prostituted himself for money and shame and you know it. Now that Axl is doing the same thing, the fanatics are trying to do two things: Prove that Slash is an even bigger sell out or that Axl appearing for some seconds in a Bud ad is no big deal. Well, it is. He's in the ad, feautring a rap version of PC that must have had been approved by Axl/TB beforehand. That IS selling out. Doing a Vegas residency using the Apettite name to promote it IS selling out. Axl AND Slash are both money whores. That's the point. Axl fans will have to accept that him and the devil, the cancer, are essentially the same. Axl is in it for the money, not the music, not the art like the army of fanatics likes to believe.

So what, because the "fanatics" have assumed he was opposed to this stuff, when it turns out he's not, he's a sellout? That makes no sense.

I've argued Slash's case to those same people many times too (he's an astute businessman and there's nothing wrong with it), I'm not really sure what your point is?

Fans haven´t assumed anything. They were lead to believe in Axl´s integrity by Axl himself. Sure you can say those fans were naive. Or they just believed what they wanted to believe. You know, we hear Axl talking about integrity in the song Prostitute. Now we see that what he says there is bullshit.

What, you only see that this fantasy was incorrect now?

Did you guys miss the can of Monster sitting on Axl's piano? Or the giant billboards for MAC cosmetics that have been displayed before shows in recent years?

The endorsements were already there, I honestly don't understand why so many worlds are only just now being crushed by it. How have things suddenly changed because it's a spot on TV instead of a spot at a concert?

[Gunzen]

he is just trying to get paid, who cares?

[Lio]

Axl has been notoriously media-shy for the longest time. You never see him in music magazines plugging a microphone etc. Then all of a sudden he does this. Integrity comes into this because he never used to do this shit and now he does because he needs the money. That is selling out. He is now whoring his image for the dollars.

Yeah, but he only spoke out about that stuff back in the 90's. The whole landscape has changed since then. Back then if you were doing endorsements, the motivations were dubious because musicians could comfortably make money selling albums. Now, you have touring, merchandising and endorsements making up that gap.

If they're going to stop touring and plan on recording some new material, they need funding from somewhere and Axl's recording process isn't cheap. If he was out there on record post-2006 speaking out about endorsements, then fair enough... but holding him to his views expressed 20+ years ago isn't fair. He's obviously been comfortable with endorsements for some time now, and this ad doesn't really signify anything different from what they've been doing. They already used SCOM in a commerial last year, and WTTJ was in the gatorade ad this year.

You guys think I'm missing the point, but you're missing the point. The comments you're relying on are outdated, and they don't hold weight in 2014 - he couldn't have known what was going to happen to the music industry back then.

No, the point is: Slash has been called many bad names for doing advertising or simply being into more commercial stuff than Axl. The Axl fanatics loooove to call Slash a sell out and media whore. Also, "$la$h" shows up a lot when they want to show how Mr. Hudson prostituted himself for money and shame and you know it. Now that Axl is doing the same thing, the fanatics are trying to do two things: Prove that Slash is an even bigger sell out or that Axl appearing for some seconds in a Bud ad is no big deal. Well, it is. He's in the ad, feautring a rap version of PC that must have had been approved by Axl/TB beforehand. That IS selling out. Doing a Vegas residency using the Apettite name to promote it IS selling out. Axl AND Slash are both money whores. That's the point. Axl fans will have to accept that him and the devil, the cancer, are essentially the same. Axl is in it for the money, not the music, not the art like the army of fanatics likes to believe.

I liked the ad, it's cool to see so many famous faces. Like those Adidas and Nike ads. It's really cool. The big surprise is that it's 2014 and we don't have a trilogy of complex, art-rock from NuGNR. Instead, we have Axl playing GH tours and now, appearing on TV ads featuring a rap version of one of his songs. Let's not even talking about that wedding show

Not even in my craziest imagined scenarios, I'd have guessed that.

"U IS OVEREACKTING COME ON LIGHTEN UP ITSZ JUST AN AD HUEHUEHUE"

You want overreaction? Check the "What's his name" thread

I think you'll find that the people spelling $la$h have been banned or just don't post anymore. I haven't seen them around in months

[highvoltage]

No, the point is: Slash has been called many bad names for doing advertising or simply being into more commercial stuff than Axl. The Axl fanatics loooove to call Slash a sell out and media whore. Also, "$la$h" shows up a lot when they want to show how Mr. Hudson prostituted himself for money and shame and you know it. Now that Axl is doing the same thing, the fanatics are trying to do two things: Prove that Slash is an even bigger sell out or that Axl appearing for some seconds in a Bud ad is no big deal. Well, it is. He's in the ad, feautring a rap version of PC that must have had been approved by Axl/TB beforehand. That IS selling out. Doing a Vegas residency using the Apettite name to promote it IS selling out. Axl AND Slash are both money whores. That's the point. Axl fans will have to accept that him and the devil, the cancer, are essentially the same. Axl is in it for the money, not the music, not the art like the army of fanatics likes to believe.

So what, because the "fanatics" have assumed he was opposed to this stuff, when it turns out he's not, he's a sellout? That makes no sense.

I've argued Slash's case to those same people many times too (he's an astute businessman and there's nothing wrong with it), I'm not really sure what your point is?

Fans haven´t assumed anything. They were lead to believe in Axl´s integrity by Axl himself. Sure you can say those fans were naive. Or they just believed what they wanted to believe. You know, we hear Axl talking about integrity in the song Prostitute. Now we see that what he says there is bullshit.

What, you only see that this fantasy was incorrect now?

Did you guys miss the can of Monster sitting on Axl's piano? Or the giant billboards for MAC cosmetics that have been displayed before shows in recent years?

The endorsements were already there, I honestly don't understand why so many worlds are only just now being crushed by it. How have things suddenly changed because it's a spot on TV instead of a spot at a concert?

From 2013:

[Gunzen]

WTF is wrong with you people? Dude is out there, he looks cool as fuck, and he is getting paid. There is nothing wrong with this, good for him. I wonder how many of you would turn down a shit ton of money for 30 secs. Bunch of jealous haters.

[Padme]

No, the point is: Slash has been called many bad names for doing advertising or simply being into more commercial stuff than Axl. The Axl fanatics loooove to call Slash a sell out and media whore. Also, "$la$h" shows up a lot when they want to show how Mr. Hudson prostituted himself for money and shame and you know it. Now that Axl is doing the same thing, the fanatics are trying to do two things: Prove that Slash is an even bigger sell out or that Axl appearing for some seconds in a Bud ad is no big deal. Well, it is. He's in the ad, feautring a rap version of PC that must have had been approved by Axl/TB beforehand. That IS selling out. Doing a Vegas residency using the Apettite name to promote it IS selling out. Axl AND Slash are both money whores. That's the point. Axl fans will have to accept that him and the devil, the cancer, are essentially the same. Axl is in it for the money, not the music, not the art like the army of fanatics likes to believe.

So what, because the "fanatics" have assumed he was opposed to this stuff, when it turns out he's not, he's a sellout? That makes no sense.

I've argued Slash's case to those same people many times too (he's an astute businessman and there's nothing wrong with it), I'm not really sure what your point is?

Fans haven´t assumed anything. They were lead to believe in Axl´s integrity by Axl himself. Sure you can say those fans were naive. Or they just believed what they wanted to believe. You know, we hear Axl talking about integrity in the song Prostitute. Now we see that what he says there is bullshit.

What, you only see that this fantasy was incorrect now?

Did you guys miss the can of Monster sitting on Axl's piano? Or the giant billboards for MAC cosmetics that have been displayed before shows in recent years?

The endorsements were already there, I honestly don't understand why so many worlds are only just now being crushed by it. How have things suddenly changed because it's a spot on TV instead of a spot at a concert?

He can make 100 t.v. ads everyday. He can endorse anything he wants. The problem is he has claimed he wasn´t much of a fan of those things specially when it came to using GN´R songs. And some people bought that bullshit

Like here

"The lawsuit also attacks Axl's integrity as Slash and Duff, in a vindictive attempt to aggrandize their own stature, re-write history through false statements, which have been repeated by the media. Their attacks on Axl stand in sharp contrast to Rose's conduct. Axl has at all times worked diligently to maintain the artistic integrity of the band by choosing with great care which properties to license GUNS N' ROSES songs to and refusing to participate in what he believed were potentially embarrassing projects. He has fought to avoid the release of material that does not live up to the highest of standards demanded by the band's history and its followers. Axl chose not to respond through the media while taking the high road in the face of Slash and Duff's attacks. Hudson and McKagan, by contrast, have told ever changing — and false — stories regarding the formation of the band and its history and believe that the band's catalogue should be exploited without careful consideration — for the GUNS N' ROSES brand and their loyal audience — or Axl's input as if it were fast food by anyone willing to pay for it.

Read more at http://www.blabbermo...O6xvsLksmxQs.99

[Gunzen]

[highvoltage]

No, the point is: Slash has been called many bad names for doing advertising or simply being into more commercial stuff than Axl. The Axl fanatics loooove to call Slash a sell out and media whore. Also, "$la$h" shows up a lot when they want to show how Mr. Hudson prostituted himself for money and shame and you know it. Now that Axl is doing the same thing, the fanatics are trying to do two things: Prove that Slash is an even bigger sell out or that Axl appearing for some seconds in a Bud ad is no big deal. Well, it is. He's in the ad, feautring a rap version of PC that must have had been approved by Axl/TB beforehand. That IS selling out. Doing a Vegas residency using the Apettite name to promote it IS selling out. Axl AND Slash are both money whores. That's the point. Axl fans will have to accept that him and the devil, the cancer, are essentially the same. Axl is in it for the money, not the music, not the art like the army of fanatics likes to believe.

So what, because the "fanatics" have assumed he was opposed to this stuff, when it turns out he's not, he's a sellout? That makes no sense.

I've argued Slash's case to those same people many times too (he's an astute businessman and there's nothing wrong with it), I'm not really sure what your point is?

Fans haven´t assumed anything. They were lead to believe in Axl´s integrity by Axl himself. Sure you can say those fans were naive. Or they just believed what they wanted to believe. You know, we hear Axl talking about integrity in the song Prostitute. Now we see that what he says there is bullshit.

What, you only see that this fantasy was incorrect now?

Did you guys miss the can of Monster sitting on Axl's piano? Or the giant billboards for MAC cosmetics that have been displayed before shows in recent years?

The endorsements were already there, I honestly don't understand why so many worlds are only just now being crushed by it. How have things suddenly changed because it's a spot on TV instead of a spot at a concert?

He can make 100 t.v. ads everyday. He can endorse anything he wants. The problem is he has claimed he wasn´t much of a fan of those things specially when it came to using GN´R songs. And some people bought that bullshit

Like here

"The lawsuit also attacks Axl's integrity as Slash and Duff, in a vindictive attempt to aggrandize their own stature, re-write history through false statements, which have been repeated by the media. Their attacks on Axl stand in sharp contrast to Rose's conduct. Axl has at all times worked diligently to maintain the artistic integrity of the band by choosing with great care which properties to license GUNS N' ROSES songs to and refusing to participate in what he believed were potentially embarrassing projects. He has fought to avoid the release of material that does not live up to the highest of standards demanded by the band's history and its followers. Axl chose not to respond through the media while taking the high road in the face of Slash and Duff's attacks. Hudson and McKagan, by contrast, have told ever changing — and false — stories regarding the formation of the band and its history and believe that the band's catalogue should be exploited without careful consideration — for the GUNS N' ROSES brand and their loyal audience — or Axl's input as if it were fast food by anyone willing to pay for it.

Read more at http://www.blabbermo...O6xvsLksmxQs.99

Shall I go on? It's nothing new. There is nothing in that statement that says Axl wouldn't license a song to a commercial.

[ThinkAboutYou]

This is not much different to Monster or Mac makeup it's just a shame that paradise is massacred in the process

[highvoltage]

[Intercourse]

Artists had "integrity" when they could fund their lavish lifestyles from record and merch sales alone.

Now they can't.

Hence the new acting and ad gigs.

Some of you must be so young that you don't have to pay child care or a mortgage and have the ill informed luxury of making daft statements about artistry.

GNR went straight into a major label - the commercial piece was front and centre from that day on.

Axl's pimping beer, Slash is pimping everything else.

Axl probably got a big cheque for a few hours of holding a beer bottle; I'm willing to bet he'll be keen to know who else will show up with money for him to hold their shit on camera.

[Crash Diet]

I figure you doesn't get the complainers VALID points...

The main complain: RAP version of the song. Full rap version. Shitty editing, Axl claimed the past he doesn't like these things etc.

You just don't get the point

This is the dumbest commercial i've ever seen

Better totally don't fit to this shit

It's like the game (Goat Simulator)

Edited June 13, 2014 by Crash Diet

[Padme]

No, the point is: Slash has been called many bad names for doing advertising or simply being into more commercial stuff than Axl. The Axl fanatics loooove to call Slash a sell out and media whore. Also, "$la$h" shows up a lot when they want to show how Mr. Hudson prostituted himself for money and shame and you know it. Now that Axl is doing the same thing, the fanatics are trying to do two things: Prove that Slash is an even bigger sell out or that Axl appearing for some seconds in a Bud ad is no big deal. Well, it is. He's in the ad, feautring a rap version of PC that must have had been approved by Axl/TB beforehand. That IS selling out. Doing a Vegas residency using the Apettite name to promote it IS selling out. Axl AND Slash are both money whores. That's the point. Axl fans will have to accept that him and the devil, the cancer, are essentially the same. Axl is in it for the money, not the music, not the art like the army of fanatics likes to believe.

So what, because the "fanatics" have assumed he was opposed to this stuff, when it turns out he's not, he's a sellout? That makes no sense.

I've argued Slash's case to those same people many times too (he's an astute businessman and there's nothing wrong with it), I'm not really sure what your point is?

Fans haven´t assumed anything. They were lead to believe in Axl´s integrity by Axl himself. Sure you can say those fans were naive. Or they just believed what they wanted to believe. You know, we hear Axl talking about integrity in the song Prostitute. Now we see that what he says there is bullshit.

What, you only see that this fantasy was incorrect now?

Did you guys miss the can of Monster sitting on Axl's piano? Or the giant billboards for MAC cosmetics that have been displayed before shows in recent years?

The endorsements were already there, I honestly don't understand why so many worlds are only just now being crushed by it. How have things suddenly changed because it's a spot on TV instead of a spot at a concert?

He can make 100 t.v. ads everyday. He can endorse anything he wants. The problem is he has claimed he wasn´t much of a fan of those things specially when it came to using GN´R songs. And some people bought that bullshit

Like here

"The lawsuit also attacks Axl's integrity as Slash and Duff, in a vindictive attempt to aggrandize their own stature, re-write history through false statements, which have been repeated by the media. Their attacks on Axl stand in sharp contrast to Rose's conduct. Axl has at all times worked diligently to maintain the artistic integrity of the band by choosing with great care which properties to license GUNS N' ROSES songs to and refusing to participate in what he believed were potentially embarrassing projects. He has fought to avoid the release of material that does not live up to the highest of standards demanded by the band's history and its followers. Axl chose not to respond through the media while taking the high road in the face of Slash and Duff's attacks. Hudson and McKagan, by contrast, have told ever changing — and false — stories regarding the formation of the band and its history and believe that the band's catalogue should be exploited without careful consideration — for the GUNS N' ROSES brand and their loyal audience — or Axl's input as if it were fast food by anyone willing to pay for it.

Read more at http://www.blabbermo...O6xvsLksmxQs.99

Shall I go on? It's nothing new. There is nothing in that statement that says Axl wouldn't license a song to a commercial.

Fine, but don´t tell me. Tell the people who are bashing Slash for doing that same thing. For them when Axl does is right. But when Slash does it is wrong.

[SoulMonster]

No, the point is: Slash has been called many bad names for doing advertising or simply being into more commercial stuff than Axl. The Axl fanatics loooove to call Slash a sell out and media whore. Also, "$la$h" shows up a lot when they want to show how Mr. Hudson prostituted himself for money and shame and you know it. Now that Axl is doing the same thing, the fanatics are trying to do two things: Prove that Slash is an even bigger sell out or that Axl appearing for some seconds in a Bud ad is no big deal. Well, it is. He's in the ad, feautring a rap version of PC that must have had been approved by Axl/TB beforehand. That IS selling out. Doing a Vegas residency using the Apettite name to promote it IS selling out. Axl AND Slash are both money whores. That's the point. Axl fans will have to accept that him and the devil, the cancer, are essentially the same. Axl is in it for the money, not the music, not the art like the army of fanatics likes to believe.

So what, because the "fanatics" have assumed he was opposed to this stuff, when it turns out he's not, he's a sellout? That makes no sense.

I've argued Slash's case to those same people many times too (he's an astute businessman and there's nothing wrong with it), I'm not really sure what your point is?

Fans haven´t assumed anything. They were lead to believe in Axl´s integrity by Axl himself. Sure you can say those fans were naive. Or they just believed what they wanted to believe. You know, we hear Axl talking about integrity in the song Prostitute. Now we see that what he says there is bullshit.

What, you only see that this fantasy was incorrect now?

Did you guys miss the can of Monster sitting on Axl's piano? Or the giant billboards for MAC cosmetics that have been displayed before shows in recent years?

The endorsements were already there, I honestly don't understand why so many worlds are only just now being crushed by it. How have things suddenly changed because it's a spot on TV instead of a spot at a concert?

He can make 100 t.v. ads everyday. He can endorse anything he wants. The problem is he has claimed he wasn´t much of a fan of those things specially when it came to using GN´R songs. And some people bought that bullshit

But what makes you think he is "much of a fan of those things" now then? It is not like he's appearing in ads all over the place It's ONE commercial.

[bacardimayne]

The main complain: RAP version of the song. Full rap version. Shitty editing, Axl claimed the past he doesn't like these things etc.

Axl doesn't like rap? Then why did he wear NWA hats in the 80s/90s? Why did he rap on Rocket Queen?

[SoulMonster]

I figure you doesn't get the complainers VALID points...

The main complain: RAP version of the song. Full rap version. Shitty editing, Axl claimed the past he doesn't like these things etc.

You just don't get the point

Where did Axl claim he wouldn't like that commercial? You think it is awful, I think it is hilariously bad, but hey! maybe Axl thinks it is cool, or fun, or okay?

Fine, but don´t tell me. Tell the people who are bashing Slash for doing that same thing. For them when Axl does is right. But when Slash does it is wrong.

You don't think there is a quantitative and qualitative difference in how Axl and Slash have sold the music of GN'R to various commercials and alternative projects?

[DownUnderScott]

I dont care if Axl does bloody tampon commercials (pardon the pun), It's good to see him open to do stuff - anything!

Its just good to see Axl out there , in any format.

:-)

[bigcountry]

I agree the rap PC is shit.

Axl looks pretty dang good in the commercial.

If my memory serves me correct he likes to watch soccer, and with everyone saying he is irrelevant in this day and age, now he gets in a promo ad for Budweiser and the World Cup. If you like Bud or not it is a huge brand and has million upon millions of loyal follows, just as the World Cup does and Axl is smack dab in the middle of both in a commercial.

Does that make him any more or less relevant, no but him and PC got picked for big commercial so he still is somewhat relevant.

I hope he and who ever else has to approve GNR song licensing continue with it, just hope they can work out something better than the rap PC and Slash's debacle, both are equally shit to me as far as the remake of the songs.

To those saying he is being a sell out, he has a longgggggggg way to go to equal Slash as a sell out but I got nothing against Slash making money off the songs he helped create, but to say Axl is a sell out is a bit of a stretch.

At about the 1:45 mark, I no it wasn't him but when they show the close up a the guitar being player than hand and the way it moves sure looks like Slash.

Edited June 13, 2014 by bigcountry