07/13/23 - Paris, FR - LaDefense

[D4NNY]

8 hours ago, Martin Riggs said:

You think TWAT has been a more successful song than Slither? I doubt most casual fans are even aware of the song. Slither was a Grammy winning hit song that is still played on radio stations around the world to this day..I don’t think I’ve heard TWAT played on the radio in 15 years. I assume that’s likely true for most people. 
 

Regarding the live performance of TWAT, I like the screams too but the way he sings the verses kinda ruins it for me. 

You were talking about Slither as a live performance and I used TWAT as a live performance? You said “impact” which implied ‘reaction’ to live performances. Now you’re talking about Grammy awards and radio play? And you also said about Axls live voice on CD songs. So in terms of “Live shows” yes I still believe TWAT is a winner “live” 
 

The vast majority of people paying to attend these concerts don’t care about them. The one VR song they play had a much bigger impact than any of the songs on CD.

Edited July 16, 2023 by D4NNY

[freak6767]

On 7/15/2023 at 5:54 AM, Alejandro GNR said:

Hey I agree and have said it many times here!!!

Quote

You can criticize Axl in these songs as much as you want, Slash  damaged all the solos like an amateur guitarist and without taste, not a word, right?

Fucking Slash can't play the solos he wrote himself!

He fries at every opportunity that comes along, the truth is Slash is not a shadow of his former self.

Play a solo from the bottom of the soul, something that Slash did like no one else, unfortunately it is in the past

Edited yesterday at 05:12 AM by KIKOZ3

I also agree unfortunately.

I said it before and will say it again especially after being front row the Paris gig.

I love Slash, but his amp sound is terrible/weak (and at this point I would even say his amp sound "choice" because Fortus's sound is crystal clean, way much more appropriate so this is not a sound stage mix issue) and his playing is always rushed, not in the pocket, and why so many notes/wanking the neck for hours?!! Less is more man! (oh and the fuzz pedal now constantly on during solos, wtf!!! sustain from his amp is so weak, that he needs this awful fuzz?!)

His playing and improvisation used to be so tasteful...

When Richard Fortus plays a few solos, his technique, sound, is putting Slash's to shame. You would think after touring with a guy like Fortus, Slash would step up (sort of emulation, in a good way) but I dont see that at all.

Front row at Paris confirmed exactly what I have been hearing online for years now, something with Slash's guitar sound and playing is up... (and this is not a general sound stage/mix issue, just listen to Fortus sound, no issue there) 

This may come across like I'm a 4US fanboy (and I do like what he plays for GNR, as guitarist I have to acknowledge his great musicianship), but I'm a huge (is there a bigger word ?) Slash fan, so come on man, do something!

I'll upload the Paris Coma solo, which, although not perfect, wasn't too bad all things considered.

Edited July 16, 2023 by freak6767

[Ollster42]

3 minutes ago, freak6767 said:

I also agree unfortunately.

I said it before and will say it again especially after being front row the Paris gig.

I love Slash, but his amp sound is terrible/weak (and at this point I would even say his amp sound "choice" because Fortus's sound is crystal clean, way much more appropriate) and his playing is always rushed, not in the pocket, and why so many notes/wanking the neck for hours?!! Less is more man! (oh and the fuzz pedal now constantly on during solo, wtf!!! sustain from his amp is so weak, that he needs this awful fuzz?!)

His playing and improvisation used to be so tasteful...

When Richard Fortus plays a few solos, his technique, sound, is putting Slash's to shame. You would think after touring with a guy like Fortus, Slash would step up (sort of emulation, in a good way) but I dont see that at all.

Front row at Paris confirmed exactly what I have been hearing online for years now, something with Slash's guitar sound and playing is up... (and this is not a general sound stage/mix issue, just listen to Fortus sound, no issue there) 

This may come across like a 4US fanboy (but I do like what he plays for GNR, as guitarist I have to acknowledge his great musicianship), but I'm a huge (is there a bigger word ?) Slash fan, so come on man, do something!

I'll upload the Paris Coma solo, which, although not perfect, wasn't too bad all things considered.

Yeah idk man I thought the exact same thing, although the less distorted crunchy sound slash uses live now is good for his rhythm playing and sits well in the mix of the band in that respect but for the leads it's just not great and he's rushing to get as many notes in as possible for what would normally be a simple but melodic fill. He's still using original 80's Marshall Silver Jubilee JCM 2550 amps that he's used since mid '88 but he just doesn't use as much gain as he did back then and his tone was awesome on both the appetite and illusion tours

just not enough sustain

[freak6767]

59 minutes ago, Ollster42 said:

Yeah idk man I thought the exact same thing, although the less distorted crunchy sound slash uses live now is good for his rhythm playing and sits well in the mix of the band in that respect but for the leads it's just not great and he's rushing to get as many notes in as possible for what would normally be a simple but melodic fill. He's still using original 80's Marshall Silver Jubilee JCM 2550 amps that he's used since mid '88 but he just doesn't use as much gain as he did back then and his tone was awesome on both the appetite and illusion tours

just not enough sustain

Exactly! Rhythm sound/gain is ok (although his rhythm playing is even sometime rushed too LOL )

But yeah the lead sound is weak, just not enough sustain, way too many notes.

I'm glad at least a 2nd person on this earth thinks the same as I do!

Let me guess, you're a guitarist too by any chance? if so, then it may be guitarist thing to notice/feel this kind of things I guess... ahahaha!

[AxlSlashthebest]

11 hours ago, Tyson said:

Any media reviews?

https://www.parismatch.com/culture/musique/guns-nroses-perdu-ses-epines-227328

[Blackstar]

12 hours ago, Tyson said:

Any media reviews?

Both very positive:

https://www.leparisien.fr/amp/culture-loisirs/musique/tubes-mythiques-son-desastreux-que-retenir-du-concert-marathon-de-guns-nroses-a-la-defense-arena-14-07-2023-GIXIA5E6INHRTNYVPKAPZ4RDHY.php

https://www.numero.com/fr/musique/guns-n-roses-concert-paris-la-defense-arena-compte-rendu

Edited July 16, 2023 by Blackstar

[GNRmello77]

https://youtu.be/ZpuSWKO37Gc

slither

 

 

[We love Axl Rose]

Photos from the show in the Weert: 

[AxlSlashthebest]

1 hour ago, Blackstar said:

Both very positive:

https://www.leparisien.fr/amp/culture-loisirs/musique/tubes-mythiques-son-desastreux-que-retenir-du-concert-marathon-de-guns-nroses-a-la-defense-arena-14-07-2023-GIXIA5E6INHRTNYVPKAPZ4RDHY.php

https://www.numero.com/fr/musique/guns-n-roses-concert-paris-la-defense-arena-compte-rendu

it's very positive exept for us (France) that the sound was bad (it's the journalist who said that). I read the opposit from peoples who was there

[Heider95]

10 minutes ago, AxlSlashthebest said:

it's very positive exept for us (France) that the sound was bad (it's the journalist who said that). I read the opposit from peoples who was there

The sound was amazing in Paris, very loud! I saw lots of people wearing ear plugs

I went to see Iron Maiden last night in Milan. I could barely hear them playing

[Amir]

2 hours ago, Blackstar said:

Both very positive:

https://www.leparisien.fr/amp/culture-loisirs/musique/tubes-mythiques-son-desastreux-que-retenir-du-concert-marathon-de-guns-nroses-a-la-defense-arena-14-07-2023-GIXIA5E6INHRTNYVPKAPZ4RDHY.php

https://www.numero.com/fr/musique/guns-n-roses-concert-paris-la-defense-arena-compte-rendu

“To call the sound muddy would be an insult to mud”

Sound was good where I was (at the front) but I can’t speak for everywhere else in the arena. At the Glasgow gig I found Slash to be lower in the mix than even Fortus.

Edited July 16, 2023 by Amir

[Ollster42]

3 hours ago, freak6767 said:

Exactly! Rhythm sound/gain is ok (although his rhythm playing is even sometime rushed too LOL )

But yeah the lead sound is weak, just not enough sustain, way too many notes.

I'm glad at least a 2nd person on this earth thinks the same as I do!

Let me guess, you're a guitarist too by any chance? if so, then it may be guitarist thing to notice/feel this kind of things I guess... ahahaha!

yeah I'm a guitarist too dude

Edited July 16, 2023 by Ollster42

[Martin Riggs]

8 hours ago, D4NNY said:

You were talking about Slither as a live performance and I used TWAT as a live performance? You said “impact” which implied ‘reaction’ to live performances. Now you’re talking about Grammy awards and radio play? And you also said about Axls live voice on CD songs. So in terms of “Live shows” yes I still believe TWAT is a winner “live” 
 

The vast majority of people paying to attend these concerts don’t care about them. The one VR song they play had a much bigger impact than any of the songs on CD.

No, I was saying that Slither had a much bigger impact in general than any song that was on CD. Axl unfortunately sings Slither like shit so I’m not commenting on its live impact. 

[Tom2112]

6 hours ago, freak6767 said:

I also agree unfortunately.

I said it before and will say it again especially after being front row the Paris gig.

I love Slash, but his amp sound is terrible/weak (and at this point I would even say his amp sound "choice" because Fortus's sound is crystal clean, way much more appropriate so this is not a sound stage mix issue) and his playing is always rushed, not in the pocket, and why so many notes/wanking the neck for hours?!! Less is more man! (oh and the fuzz pedal now constantly on during solos, wtf!!! sustain from his amp is so weak, that he needs this awful fuzz?!)

His playing and improvisation used to be so tasteful...

When Richard Fortus plays a few solos, his technique, sound, is putting Slash's to shame. You would think after touring with a guy like Fortus, Slash would step up (sort of emulation, in a good way) but I dont see that at all.

Front row at Paris confirmed exactly what I have been hearing online for years now, something with Slash's guitar sound and playing is up... (and this is not a general sound stage/mix issue, just listen to Fortus sound, no issue there) 

This may come across like I'm a 4US fanboy (and I do like what he plays for GNR, as guitarist I have to acknowledge his great musicianship), but I'm a huge (is there a bigger word ?) Slash fan, so come on man, do something!

I'll upload the Paris Coma solo, which, although not perfect, wasn't too bad all things considered.

It's been a long time since I listened to Slash live where I was impressed. His sound is so thin, his playing is quite unmusical. Even on record he's failing to capture great performances or write memorable solos. I think his taste has just changed, and unfortunately for a percentage of fans we don't really enjoy it. Not saying he's bad all the time, it's mostly just when he tries to improvise... Something he was once pretty fluid at.

[D4NNY]

5 minutes ago, Martin Riggs said:

No, I was saying that Slither had a much bigger impact in general than any song that was on CD. Axl unfortunately sings Slither like shit so I’m not commenting on its live impact. 

I agree with you, I don’t want to or like to, but I do. Contraband was released properly and smartly. If Axl had actually done proper promotion for the album, interviews, music videos etc it would be a completely different story but sadly we know how it went down, zero videos, no interviews. Which is bizarre in terms of all the effort he put in putting the band together, touring, decade worth of recording and then just next to no effort for the release. 

[drlaban]

9 minutes ago, D4NNY said:

I agree with you, I don’t want to or like to, but I do. Contraband was released properly and smartly. If Axl had actually done proper promotion for the album, interviews, music videos etc it would be a completely different story but sadly we know how it went down, zero videos, no interviews. Which is bizarre in terms of all the effort he put in putting the band together, touring, decade worth of recording and then just next to no effort for the release. 

CD should have been mixed as CB/UYI/TSI. 

[Martin Riggs]

27 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

It's been a long time since I listened to Slash live where I was impressed. His sound is so thin, his playing is quite unmusical. Even on record he's failing to capture great performances or write memorable solos. I think his taste has just changed, and unfortunately for a percentage of fans we don't really enjoy it. Not saying he's bad all the time, it's mostly just when he tries to improvise... Something he was once pretty fluid at.

People on this site get quite carried away taking shit about Slash imo. I think some of you take for granted that he’s been the consistent star of these reunion years and act like he’s a dude who can’t play anymore. From one of the reviews posted above, but has been the overall consensus of most reviews for the last 7 years:

“If the two stars of the team - Axl Rose and Slash are 61 and 57 years old, they still provide the show for more than 3 hours. The bad boys of rock known for their delays, and, in recent years, a vocal decline of the leader, proved that evening that they have nothing to envy to the youngest. The group's great asset remains the genius of guitarist Slash”

[Rovim]

1 minute ago, Martin Riggs said:

People on this site get quite carried away taking shit about Slash imo. I think some of you take for granted that he’s been the consistent star of these reunion years and act like he’s a dude who can’t play anymore. From one of the reviews posted above, but has been the overall consensus of most reviews for the last 7 years:

“If the two stars of the team - Axl Rose and Slash are 61 and 57 years old, they still provide the show for more than 3 hours. The bad boys of rock known for their delays, and, in recent years, a vocal decline of the leader, proved that evening that they have nothing to envy to the youngest. The group's great asset remains the genius of guitarist Slash”

is anyone here really saying that Slash can't play anymore? his playing is less musical in comparison to when he was at his peak imo as well. I don't think anyone is trying to take anything away from Slash, he's still one of the best guitar players around and probably ever to my ears, but I feel like he's just not as inspired anymore and there is less feel in his playing. This is a fairly common thing and just because Axl has lost some of his ability as a vocalist, doesn't mean that Slash stayed at the same level. 

just listen to any old Guns show and I think the difference in quality of playing speaks for itself. He was still great at the show I've attended this year but there was much noodling. DTJ was the highlight Slash moment but there were a lot of great moments, it's just not even close to the sounds that so naturally came out of his guitar in his prime imo.

 

[Martin Riggs]

9 minutes ago, Rovim said:

is anyone here really saying that Slash can't play anymore? his playing is less musical in comparison to when he was at his peak imo as well. I don't think anyone is trying to take anything away from Slash, he's still one of the best guitar players around and probably ever to my ears, but I feel like he's just not as inspired anymore and there is less feel in his playing. This is a fairly common thing and just because Axl has lost some of his ability as a vocalist, doesn't mean that Slash stayed at the same level. 

just listen to any old Guns show and I think the difference in quality of playing speaks for itself. He was still great at the show I've attended this year but there was much noodling. DTJ was the highlight Slash moment but there were a lot of great moments, it's just not even close to the sounds that so naturally came out of his guitar in his prime imo.

 

Fair enough, but I think some of the criticism is exaggerated for whatever reason. Maybe some of his passion will come back if/when Axl decides he wants to be more than just a money making legacy nostalgia act.  🤷‍♂️ 

[beebee_head]

When did prime Slash end?

[Rovim]

7 minutes ago, beebee_head said:

When did prime Slash end?

all I know is that for me personally, he still had it throughout the '90's and even if Snakepit is not really my thing, that was for me the last time he was at his very best. I think that drugs and alcohol and the fire of being just a lot younger have all contributed to the quality of his playing. Not that I'd want him to fall off the wagon again. That didn't help his playing when it happened in the VR days mostly in his live performances imo.

[Tom2112]

39 minutes ago, Martin Riggs said:

People on this site get quite carried away taking shit about Slash imo. I think some of you take for granted that he’s been the consistent star of these reunion years and act like he’s a dude who can’t play anymore. From one of the reviews posted above, but has been the overall consensus of most reviews for the last 7 years:

“If the two stars of the team - Axl Rose and Slash are 61 and 57 years old, they still provide the show for more than 3 hours. The bad boys of rock known for their delays, and, in recent years, a vocal decline of the leader, proved that evening that they have nothing to envy to the youngest. The group's great asset remains the genius of guitarist Slash”

Where did I say he can't play? Put on your glasses old boy. I said quite the opposite BUT his improv is pretty bad more often than not... And his guitar sound does him no favours, if you're going to play with that sound then you need to be a whole lot more accurate as a soloist.

And of course Slash is the star of the show. People love him, he's iconic and for the most part he's great... But you can't just ignore all the other stuff because it doesn't suit your fandom. He isn't up there playing the wrong chords all night, but he's lost some of his taste sensibilities. His rhythm is still pretty solid, it's not all about soloing at the end of the day. 

And I'm not a "Richard is the best" guy either. He's clearly a great player and tight but I don't really love his lead style. Love his nightrain solo though.

22 minutes ago, beebee_head said:

When did prime Slash end?

I'd say sometime after the contraband your. There's been periods of greatness since though

[freak6767]

1 hour ago, Rovim said:

is anyone here really saying that Slash can't play anymore? his playing is less musical in comparison to when he was at his peak imo as well. I don't think anyone is trying to take anything away from Slash, he's still one of the best guitar players around and probably ever to my ears, but I feel like he's just not as inspired anymore and there is less feel in his playing. This is a fairly common thing and just because Axl has lost some of his ability as a vocalist, doesn't mean that Slash stayed at the same level. 

just listen to any old Guns show and I think the difference in quality of playing speaks for itself. He was still great at the show I've attended this year but there was much noodling. DTJ was the highlight Slash moment but there were a lot of great moments, it's just not even close to the sounds that so naturally came out of his guitar in his prime imo.

 

I echo 100% the above too.

Exactly what I was trying to verbalize. 

Again, Slash is my ultimate guitar hero, I picked up the guitar when I was 11 after listening to bootlegs from my best friend's older brother, and I'm now 42, and the guitar never left me... So I'll always be the 1st one to defend Slash if anything.

But it's also fair to express what's been going on, and not sounding presumptuous but my 30 years of playing and analyzing his playing inside out (like many here I'm sure), it's fair to say that I can easily spot/hear the differences, or maybe his "evolution" should we say instead? for better or for worse (worse here IMO) it's just not the same. (same goes for SMKC too)

Imagine for a second, less notes, more powerful lead sound for solos with sustain and improvising solos you could almost sing listening back, how rad would that be? (oh wait exactly what he did in the 90's!! ahaha)

I also agree, and I think I wrote this here before in another thread, up until both Snakepit albums he still had it, (Doin' Fine...!!!), and a few songs from his 1st solo album.

Edited July 16, 2023 by freak6767

[freak6767]

On another lighter note, found these interesting as there were some slight last minute variation to the setlist we had in the end (and Coma isn't even on there):

Edited July 16, 2023 by freak6767

[Stay.Of.Execution]

Why are easy and dtj on the alt setlist? Doesn't make sense