Your least favorite Guns N'Roses Album? (Pick only ONE)

[t-p-d-a]

After watching Ritz 91

I'd say:  Chinese Democracy... thats not a band, it's a Circus Of Horror with Dr. Rose

[Sonic Reducer]

7 minutes ago, Nintari said:

I don't view the song that way. I see it as an account of a young, super-naive white kid from a bigoted background who's scared and trying to make sense of a new world that's overwhelming and threatening. He's paranoid, jumping at shadows, doesn't know who to trust and has thus, forms these base-line, hard-wired, rudimentary judgments. It's the first act of a larger act.

It's fascinating.

That's exactly how I see it, but listening to this song is like hanging out with someone like that. I know for sure I would have found that Axl insufferable.

[Cosmo]

Not counting Lies, if I had to choose one GNR album to never listen to again, it would be AFD for sure.

[Rovim]

2 hours ago, Nintari said:

But that wasn't my point. My point was that art's at its best when its 100% honest. And that song is 100% honest without even a hint of filter. Therefore, it's great art. As a matter of fact, imo, it's art personified. Sure, we can all argue about the subject matter, but as an artistic expression, it doesn't any better.

On a side note, Axl addressed this issue in Don't Damn Me, basically saying that what he sees and how he feels is what he puts into his music, and he's not apologizing for it because his job as an artist is to tell the truth... and that's what he did.

and then he apologized for it and never played it again. Still a great song imo.

[riot]

I'd say spaghetti but these are all covers.. so i guess lies. 

[Gordon Comstock]

Lies is an EP and TSI is a covers album, so if I'm only counting the 4 "real" albums then UYI II is my least favourite. It's their most inconsistent album. The half of the album that's good is really fucking good, but the rest is just filler.

[Gunner Gilby]

It's a toss up between Greatest Hits or Live Era 87-93. 

Greatest Hits doesn't really represent the bands sound. Five of the fourteen tracks are covers. There's only one previously unreleased track. And the band had no input into it.

I can enjoy most of Live Era. It's not even the occasional rerecorded vocal or touched up lead guitar part that's the biggest offence. It's when you get to Estranged and Rocket Queen and Gilby's rhythm guitar is missing. 

Of the studio albums if I had to pick a least favourite it'd be between Lies and Chinese. I hate the fake live crowd on the 86 tracks tho I love the tracks themselves. The 88 tracks are awesome. Patience is a great acoustic ballad. Used To Love Her and the Lies version of You're Crazy are two of my favourite GN'R songs. It's a pity that they're followed by One In A Million. Chinese Democracy is actually a great album. But it's not so much a band album. It's got so many players. Many of whom had already left the band. 

[Cosmo]

3 hours ago, Cosmo said:

Not counting Lies, if I had to choose one GNR album to never listen to again, it would be AFD for sure.

Not counting Spaghetti either, of course.

[janrichmond]

CD is my worst, and I try to give it a chance once a year. Still shit 💩

[Old_school_gnr_fan]

Chinese Democracy

I don't think I've listened to it since before the 2016 reunion. Never felt like a true Guns album to me

[merryfnchristmas]

1 hour ago, janrichmond said:

CD is my worst, and I try to give it a chance once a year. Still shit 💩

I do the annual listen too.

[janrichmond]

2 minutes ago, merryfnchristmas said:

I do the annual listen too.

hard to do the whole album in one sitting isn't it? 

[Nintari]

On 11/12/2022 at 2:27 PM, Rovim said:

and then he apologized for it and never played it again. Still a great song imo.

Right, thus completing the circle. And that's why it's not offensive to me. Everyone online is knee-jerk and idealistic right now. They don't understand context. They don't take into consideration a person's background or point of view. They don't allow for change and growth. It's basically, be perfect and flawless, or be erased. It's absolutely insane and won't last as a concept.

Besides, how many of the finger-pointers are without blame themselves? They're just as nasty, or even more so, than the people they try to destroy.

[Rovim]

34 minutes ago, Nintari said:

Right, thus completing the circle. And that's why it's not offensive to me. Everyone online is knee-jerk and idealistic right now. They don't understand context. They don't take into consideration a person's background or point of view. They don't allow for change and growth. It's basically, be perfect and flawless, or be erased. It's absolutely insane and won't last as a concept.

Besides, how many of the finger-pointers are without blame themselves? They're just as nasty, or even more so, than the people they try to destroy.

don't get what you mean by completing the circle and what is the context? if I had a bad experience with a black guy one time and a homosexual man that other time and I was a famous musician who made sure to write a verse at the end there that acts as a disclaimer that I'm not racist and homophobic even though I went all out with using the N word, the F word, the immigrant thing, etc and generalized the shit out of those groups of people then it's fine, I'm not racist and homophobic? even the rest of Axl's own band didn't really get behind the lyrics.

I think some words have the power to spread hate even if I believe that Axl is not that guy anymore and people can change.

racism and homophobia are still real issues irl so it makes sense that there is social presence that condems this shit so society doesn't tolerate it as much anymore. It's progress as I see it and I don't think this song should ever be played in a show, (I still listen to it often cause it's a great song imo and it doesn't offend me, but I think it shows that Axl was in a very negative and ugly place in that aspect back then in his life and maybe confused his own personal experience with entire groups of people and as angry as he was, chose to find release by writing a song that I feel was used in the end by idiots to fuel more hate. 

also this song wasn't erased, and culture is not so easily erased either. you can still listen to it as much as you want but I think I know what it is and it's not an innocent song, no matter how Axl tried to justify it.

I believe it's important to find a healthy balance between freedom to say what you feel and the decency to not be a racist and homophobic piece of shit cause that should be unacceptable, no matter how you try to frame it. 

 

Edited November 14, 2022 by Rovim

[star]

To all those that mention TSI..

I happen to like TSI

It is both the UYI albums i have slight issue with, as i have always felt, they should have released a single album containing only the best tracks. As we know, the plan was to release a double album to clear the slate to make way for new material. As we know, that failed, as the band parted ways. Axl formed 'new ' G'n'R 

..good to see Axl, Slash, Duff back together. If only they could get Izzy and Adler back, and work on that final album, before they head to the place above, or below. 

[Karice]

8 hours ago, Rovim said:

don't get what you mean by completing the circle and what is the context? if I had a bad experience with a black guy one time and a homosexual man that other time and I was a famous musician who made sure to write a verse at the end there that acts as a disclaimer that I'm not racist and homophobic even though I went all out with using the N word, the F word, the immigrant thing, etc and generalized the shit out of those groups of people then it's fine, I'm not racist and homophobic? even the rest of Axl's own band didn't really get behind the lyrics.

I think some words have the power to spread hate even if I believe that Axl is not that guy anymore and people can change.

racism and homophobia are still real issues irl so it makes sense that there is social presence that condems this shit so society doesn't tolerate it as much anymore. It's progress as I see it and I don't think this song should ever be played in a show, (I still listen to it often cause it's a great song imo and it doesn't offend me, but I think it shows that Axl was in a very negative and ugly place in that aspect back then in his life and maybe confused his own personal experience with entire groups of people and as angry as he was, chose to find release by writing a song that I feel was used in the end by idiots to fuel more hate. 

also this song wasn't erased, and culture is not so easily erased either. you can still listen to it as much as you want but I think I know what it is and it's not an innocent song, no matter how Axl tried to justify it.

I believe it's important to find a healthy balance between freedom to say what you feel and the decency to not be a racist and homophobic piece of shit cause that should be unacceptable, no matter how you try to frame it. 

 

The Band when it comes to backing up Axl  sometimes don't hold much water. The Band backed up Axl at first when it came to Get In The Ring, but then left him to fend for himself which hurt him. 

 

[Nintari]

22 hours ago, Rovim said:

don't get what you mean by completing the circle and what is the context? if I had a bad experience with a black guy one time and a homosexual man that other time and I was a famous musician who made sure to write a verse at the end there that acts as a disclaimer that I'm not racist and homophobic even though I went all out with using the N word, the F word, the immigrant thing, etc and generalized the shit out of those groups of people then it's fine, I'm not racist and homophobic? even the rest of Axl's own band didn't really get behind the lyrics.

I think some words have the power to spread hate even if I believe that Axl is not that guy anymore and people can change.

racism and homophobia are still real issues irl so it makes sense that there is social presence that condems this shit so society doesn't tolerate it as much anymore. It's progress as I see it and I don't think this song should ever be played in a show, (I still listen to it often cause it's a great song imo and it doesn't offend me, but I think it shows that Axl was in a very negative and ugly place in that aspect back then in his life and maybe confused his own personal experience with entire groups of people and as angry as he was, chose to find release by writing a song that I feel was used in the end by idiots to fuel more hate. 

also this song wasn't erased, and culture is not so easily erased either. you can still listen to it as much as you want but I think I know what it is and it's not an innocent song, no matter how Axl tried to justify it.

I believe it's important to find a healthy balance between freedom to say what you feel and the decency to not be a racist and homophobic piece of shit cause that should be unacceptable, no matter how you try to frame it. 

 

It completes the circle of a human being starting off in once place and then finishing up in another.

As far as context goes, at one point, Axl was just a little boy, free of prejudice and bigotry until his parents, friends, church leaders, people at the grocery store etc. put those ideas into him. He grew up in an environment which harbored such beliefs as fact. So when he hitchhiked to LA, and he saw these things, he connected the dots with all the stuff he was told growing up and believed them to be proof-positive; the black guy selling gold chains; the Indian overcharging things at the convenient store; the press running stories about homosexuals spreading AIDs... it was like, of course. He'd only been warned about this stuff his whole life. So it only made sense at the time, and being a truthful artist, he decided to tell his story about it in a song.

But it was an incomplete story, and as time went by, his intelligence gleaned a broader truth, and he realized the error in his views and changed and became a complete person with a better understanding of the world.

No one is racist or bigoted inherently. They are programmed to be that way. But don't try to tell that to the equally bigoted finger-pointers. They're bigoted, after all. They see things exactly the same way that racially bigoted people do: black and white, evil and righteous, right and wrong. The concept of context does not exist for them, and they don't care because again, they are prejudice. But there is no way they're changing the world with anger and resentment and hostility. Even with love and understanding, there's still almost no chance for the type of change they're calling for--but at least there's some. With hate, there's zero.

Zero.

[Rovim]

2 minutes ago, Nintari said:

It completes the circle of a human being starting off in once place and then finishing up in another.

As far as context goes, at one point, Axl was just a little boy, free of prejudice and bigotry until his parents, friends, church leaders, people at the grocery store etc. put those ideas into him. He grew up in an environment which harbored such beliefs as fact. So when he hitchhiked to LA, and he saw these things, he connected the dots with all the stuff he was told growing up and believed them to be proof-positive; the black guy selling gold chains; the Indian overcharging things at the convenient store; the press running stories about homosexuals spreading AIDs... it was like, of course. He'd only been warned about this stuff his whole life. So it only made sense at the time, and being a truthful artist, he decided to tell his story about it in a song.

But it was an incomplete story, and as time went by, his intelligence gleaned a broader truth, and he realized the error in his views and changed and became a complete person with a better understanding of the world.

No one is racist or bigoted inherently. They are programmed to be that way. But don't try to tell that to the equally bigoted finger-pointers. They're bigoted, after all. They see things exactly the same way that racially bigoted people do: black and white, evil and righteous, right and wrong. The concept of context does not exist for them, and they don't care because again, they are prejudice. But there is no way they're changing the world with anger and resentment and hostility. Even with love and understanding, there's still almost no chance for the type of change they're calling for--but at least there's some. With hate, there's zero.

Zero.

makes sense. I've learned everything I know from people at the grocery store. Give me a fuckin' break lol. Axl wrote a racist and homophobic song. It's a great song imo, but I think it's pretty clear what point of view you have to have to write such a song as a musician. 

yes, I believe he is brutally honest. Always was, but you you can't excuse your actions by shrugging it off as "just being honest!".  And it wasn't just one thing. We know he treated women like shit as well. You make it seem like he should get a medal for writing an honest song. It can be done without the racism and homophobia. Absurd is a good example of the progress. 

sometimes I think the finger is pointed at you cause you're fuckin' up, No one should have the freedom to spew hateful shit that has the potential to snowball to actual violence and that's why you don't really come across songs like OIAM in the mainstream anymore which must be a good thing imo.

[Nintari]

6 hours ago, Rovim said:

 No one should have the freedom to spew hateful shit that has the potential to snowball to actual violence and that's why you don't really come across songs like OIAM in the mainstream anymore which must be a good thing imo.

The world is ugly and full of bad things. You can't hide from it. You can't change it. The only thing you can do is learn how to tolerate it and move on.

 

Also, nice boys don't play rock 'n roll.

[Rovim]

3 hours ago, Nintari said:

The world is ugly and full of bad things. You can't hide from it. You can't change it. The only thing you can do is learn how to tolerate it and move on.

 

Also, nice boys don't play rock 'n roll.

nah, I don't believe it. It's all sunshine, orgies and icecream. Look: thanks to many good, quality people who are not just focused on themselves and have the motivation to make it better, there is always improvement in many areas in life.

The world was uglier, more racist, sexist and homophobic even 15 years ago not to mention 100 years ago. It doesn't happen by itself. You wouldn't want to live back then. When you want to improve, you have to take responsibility for your actions and own it. I'm talking about the opposite of hiding from whatever truth you want to express but there are ways to do it like a cunt in a crude way like OIAM where Axl basically chose to do it at all costs which I think was juvenile, naive, and selfish and there are ways to, like I've said earlier, find the right balance between speaking your truth and to be at least somewhat sensitive and aware to the implications of your actions. 

the freedom you lose to be a piece of shit like it's 1955 is what happens when the world "grows up" and people sometimes collectively learn from their mistakes. It usually seems to happen slowly and gradually and when it doesn't, it just stagnates or becomes even worse in many cases.

as for your silly little comment at the end there: please.... if you don't have anything of value to say, don't say anything at all cause being a musician shouldn't give you the right to be a shit person or any other profession for that matter imo. "I need the freedom to be racist right now cause I'm an artist that needs to work on some issues". It's just another excuse to act like an angry child.

 

Edited November 16, 2022 by Rovim

[jamillos]

Least favourite album... that’s difficult (and what’s not with this band, huh), because:
a) I either count CD or not. If I do, it’s CD. If I don’t – since it’s seen by many as just Axl’s solo, which is understandable – then it gets easier. 
b) With CD gone, there’s TSI. But do I count it? If I do, it’s TSI. If I don’t – since it’s a cover album, not their own music – then it gets easier... but trickier at the same time. 
c) Then we’re left with basically three records. One of them being a double album and one of them a short hybrid. And within this group, how could Lies not lose when the only opponents left are AfD and UYI? 
So... using this elimination method (and I can’t help myself, but I can’t just take their entire discography and simply pick an album), and since the rest is obviously untouchable, it’s either CD, TSI, or Lies.

[Nintari]

15 hours ago, Rovim said:

nah, I don't believe it. It's all sunshine, orgies and icecream. Look: thanks to many good, quality people who are not just focused on themselves and have the motivation to make it better, there is always improvement in many areas in life.

The world was uglier, more racist, sexist and homophobic even 15 years ago not to mention 100 years ago. It doesn't happen by itself. You wouldn't want to live back then. When you want to improve, you have to take responsibility for your actions and own it. I'm talking about the opposite of hiding from whatever truth you want to express but there are ways to do it like a cunt in a crude way like OIAM where Axl basically chose to do it at all costs which I think was juvenile, naive, and selfish and there are ways to, like I've said earlier, find the right balance between speaking your truth and to be at least somewhat sensitive and aware to the implications of your actions. 

the freedom you lose to be a piece of shit like it's 1955 is what happens when the world "grows up" and people sometimes collectively learn from their mistakes. It usually seems to happen slowly and gradually and when it doesn't, it just stagnates or becomes even worse in many cases.

as for your silly little comment at the end there: please.... if you don't have anything of value to say, don't say anything at all cause being a musician shouldn't give you the right to be a shit person or any other profession for that matter imo. "I need the freedom to be racist right now cause I'm an artist that needs to work on some issues". It's just another excuse to act like an angry child.

 

This may shock you, but you absolutely do have a right to be a "shit person". It's not against the law to be mean, racist, bigoted, ignorant or even say hateful things, despite what other online activists may claim... and there's no changing that. You can go online and try wielding your imaginary sword in an attempt to rid the world of bad people all you want. But bad people and bad things date back to the very beginning of time and will continue until the very end of time. And while it may be less bad now... it'll never be even close to the utopian society that the aforementioned activists envision. Human beings are hardwired against it, and there is no undoing that on a mass scale.

Having said all that, I'm done having this discussion with you. It's become clear to me through your tone that you never intended to have a thorough exchange of ideas in the first place. You saw what I wrote, misinterpreted it, then decided to engage in a debate based on that misinterpretation so that you could tell me how wrong I was and how right you were. I'm not interested in that. Find someone else.

Edited November 16, 2022 by Nintari

[JimiRose]

Think this is only really a conversation for bands that have lots of albums. GnR basically have 3. Appetite. Use your Illusion. Chinese democracy. UYI being split into 2 individual matters little. it's a double album. lies is an EP, TSI a cover album, live era is a live album. 38 years ago this band got together. 3 albums of original material. 

[Tom-Ass]

I will always count LIES as an album and it is my second favorite Guns album. Technically it is two EPs but if anyone is being honest 99.99999% of people had never heard LLAS before LIES came out.  It may have only been 8 songs but many of the great albums of the 70's only had 7-9 songs on them. 

Lastly the record industry treated it as an album and it made it to #2 on the billboard charts as an album. 

[El Guapo]

Chinese Democracy