Least favorite thing since Slash/Duff returned…

[©GnrPersia]

9 hours ago, PatrickS77 said:

Well, that's your opinion. Majority seems to disagree. He plays those songs good enough.

Same to you. There's no fact-checking data to verify your claim. So that's your opinion.

[Sweersa]

Diminished hope for a proper full album (CD2).

Hard Skool. (I prefer the Village mix)

[PatrickS77]

1 hour ago, ©GnrPersia said:

Same to you. There's no fact-checking data to verify your claim. So that's your opinion.

Fact is. Most people in that stadium don't give a shit about CD songs. So whatever.

[PatrickS77]

3 hours ago, invisible_rose said:

 Ticketmaster are absolutely to blame for much of it. Are you aware of the Platinum Artist policy?

In terms of GNR jacking prices - they’re charging pretty much the same as any other band. Def Leppard & Motley Crue are charging even more. At the end of the day, a partially reformed GNR is a bigger pull than Axl & Friends for the vast majority of people/fans - so the price reflects that. This isn’t a specific GNR issue. This is an industry issue IMO.

Ticket prices everywhere are disgraceful. 

Yes. I am. But Ticketmaster acts on behalf of the tour promoter. TM does what the tour promoter permits/wants them to do. TM is the middleman (obviously the fact that Live Nation merged with/owns Ticketmaster dilutes things a bit, but in general it's a company acting according to the tour promoter). Whatever extra profit TM generates, is not for TM to keep. And prices absolutely start with whatever the artist is getting as a guaranteed sum. Somehow everyone else need to make money too. And so the ticket price is high enough to make back what the artist gets + whatever is needed so everyone else will make a profit too (and not make it a total risk for everyone else). And whatever is made on top of what the artist is initially making, a cut of that goes to the artist too.

The fact that they are a bigger pull enables them to play stadiums instead of arenas. So they would get more money either way, without jacking up the fee they are asking for playing. There absolutely would be no reason to suddenly ask for more money, other than greed and the only way I excuse that greed is the fact that they give epic 3+ hour shows to somehow justify the added cost, compared to the years where it just was fake GNR. So they absolutely could have stuck to the prices they had and still make more money, due to bigger audiences.

Edited February 26, 2023 by PatrickS77

[Tom-Ass]

19 hours ago, mystery said:

My least favorite thing is Slash and Duff just going with the flow and realizing the band is just their meal ticket now.

This is a big one.  They seem to have just went against everything they always stood for. They just "go with the flow" and appease to the point where it doesn't matter if the quality of their performance is subpar. Other than that, Axl's voice, Hardschool and Absurd. Those two songs were pretty much the nail in the coffin for me. 

 

 

[allwaystired]

45 minutes ago, PatrickS77 said:

Yes. I am. But Ticketmaster acts on behalf of the tour promoter. TM does what the tour promoter permits/wants them to do. TM is the middleman (obviously the fact that Live Nation merged with/owns Ticketmaster dilutes things a bit, but in general it's a company acting according to the tour promoter). Whatever extra profit TM generates, is not for TM to keep. And prices absolutely start with whatever the artist is getting as a guaranteed sum. Somehow everyone else need to make money too. And so the ticket price is high enough to make back what the artist gets + whatever is needed so everyone else will make a profit too (and not make it a total risk for everyone else). And whatever is made on top of what the artist is initially making, a cut of that goes to the artist too.

The fact that they are a bigger pull enables them to play stadiums instead of arenas. So they would get more money either way, without jacking up the fee they are asking for playing. There absolutely would be no reason to suddenly ask for more money, other than greed and the only way I excuse that greed is the fact that they give epic 3+ hour shows to somehow justify the added cost, compared to the years where it just was fake GNR. So they absolutely could have stuck to the prices they had and still make more money, due to bigger audiences.

Absolutely. 

All the 'variable pricing' and 'platinum' pricing bullshit is at the request of the artists in conjunction with Ticketmaster. 

People often forget that when they're getting screwed- the artists are totally complicit in this. Which is why some (in the increasing minority) still don't have it for their ticket sales. 

[invisible_rose]

2 hours ago, PatrickS77 said:

Yes. I am. But Ticketmaster acts on behalf of the tour promoter. TM does what the tour promoter permits/wants them to do. TM is the middleman (obviously the fact that Live Nation merged with/owns Ticketmaster dilutes things a bit, but in general it's a company acting according to the tour promoter). Whatever extra profit TM generates, is not for TM to keep. And prices absolutely start with whatever the artist is getting as a guaranteed sum. Somehow everyone else need to make money too. And so the ticket price is high enough to make back what the artist gets + whatever is needed so everyone else will make a profit too (and not make it a total risk for everyone else). And whatever is made on top of what the artist is initially making, a cut of that goes to the artist too.

The fact that they are a bigger pull enables them to play stadiums instead of arenas. So they would get more money either way, without jacking up the fee they are asking for playing. There absolutely would be no reason to suddenly ask for more money, other than greed and the only way I excuse that greed is the fact that they give epic 3+ hour shows to somehow justify the added cost, compared to the years where it just was fake GNR. So they absolutely could have stuck to the prices they had and still make more money, due to bigger audiences.

Ok, seems like you just wanna blame GNR/TB for something that every other artist is doing. 

1 hour ago, allwaystired said:

Absolutely. 

All the 'variable pricing' and 'platinum' pricing bullshit is at the request of the artists in conjunction with Ticketmaster. 

People often forget that when they're getting screwed- the artists are totally complicit in this. Which is why some (in the increasing minority) still don't have it for their ticket sales. 

Yes, but it isn't just GNR, is it? It's an industry thing that just shouldn't be allowed, but the monopoly Ticketmaster has means they get away with it. While ever people keep paying, they'll keep doing it - which is part of the reason I won't be going again this year.

[PatrickS77]

1 hour ago, invisible_rose said:

Ok, seems like you just wanna blame GNR/TB for something that every other artist is doing. 

Yes, but it isn't just GNR, is it? It's an industry thing that just shouldn't be allowed, but the monopoly Ticketmaster has means they get away with it. While ever people keep paying, they'll keep doing it - which is part of the reason I won't be going again this year.

I don't give a shit what other artists are doing. If they were doing what other artists are doing, they would release albums. That's something where they also don't follow what other arists are doing. So it has no bearing what other artists are doing. It was their decision to jack up prices.

Edited February 26, 2023 by PatrickS77

[Lies They Tell]

No new album is pretty much the only disappointment I have. Or lack of new music to be precise. It doesn't even have to be in album form. I'm fine with singles, but two songs is just way too little. Why does this band always have to give the bare minimum. I'm totally fine with remakes of old CD-era material. I love both Hard Skool and Absurd.

Sure they've released the AFD and UYI remasters, but I personally never cared about any of that. I never really listen to live music.

I always wanted new music from GNR more than a reunion. It's been really great to see Axl, Slash and Duff together on stage again, but lack of new music has left a sour taste in my mouth and I've never been as bored with this band as I am currently.

That being said, I'm sure that they will release new music again at some point and I'm sure that I will love it. That's more than I can say about most bands. This band releases music at an extremely slow pace, but when they do release music, it's better than most music out there. So I can't complain too much.

[allwaystired]

47 minutes ago, invisible_rose said:

Ok, seems like you just wanna blame GNR/TB for something that every other artist is doing. 

Yes, but it isn't just GNR, is it? It's an industry thing that just shouldn't be allowed, but the monopoly Ticketmaster has means they get away with it. While ever people keep paying, they'll keep doing it - which is part of the reason I won't be going again this year.

Oh no, not just GNR by any means. It's just that it's done in conjunction with them - as it is with all artists. 

By the way,  I'm really not defending Ticketmaster here, I absolutely despise them. 

[Tom2112]

3 hours ago, PatrickS77 said:

Yes. I am. But Ticketmaster acts on behalf of the tour promoter. TM does what the tour promoter permits/wants them to do. TM is the middleman (obviously the fact that Live Nation merged with/owns Ticketmaster dilutes things a bit, but in general it's a company acting according to the tour promoter). Whatever extra profit TM generates, is not for TM to keep. And prices absolutely start with whatever the artist is getting as a guaranteed sum. Somehow everyone else need to make money too. And so the ticket price is high enough to make back what the artist gets + whatever is needed so everyone else will make a profit too (and not make it a total risk for everyone else). And whatever is made on top of what the artist is initially making, a cut of that goes to the artist too.

The fact that they are a bigger pull enables them to play stadiums instead of arenas. So they would get more money either way, without jacking up the fee they are asking for playing. There absolutely would be no reason to suddenly ask for more money, other than greed and the only way I excuse that greed is the fact that they give epic 3+ hour shows to somehow justify the added cost, compared to the years where it just was fake GNR. So they absolutely could have stuck to the prices they had and still make more money, due to bigger audiences.

Not a kid rock fan, but he did that summer tour where he placed his tickets in a $35 price range, and he said he still made a boat load of money. 

For some shows I get it that it probably needs to be a more expensive ticket. But with gnr. It's a basic stage, there's basically no fireworks,  just a few screens and LEDs... It's basic. So they could cut their fee and still make a great deal of money... But the artist has to want to make it better for fans over their own personal gain... And gnr and many other bands are only concerned with the bottom dollar.

[allwaystired]

2 hours ago, Tom2112 said:

Not a kid rock fan, but he did that summer tour where he placed his tickets in a $35 price range, and he said he still made a boat load of money. 

For some shows I get it that it probably needs to be a more expensive ticket. But with gnr. It's a basic stage, there's basically no fireworks,  just a few screens and LEDs... It's basic. So they could cut their fee and still make a great deal of money... But the artist has to want to make it better for fans over their own personal gain... And gnr and many other bands are only concerned with the bottom dollar.

Not sure if you know them but Paul Heaten and Jacqui Abbott of The Beautiful South did an Arena tour in the UK where every ticket was £30. 

I saw them talking about it on a TV show and he said that really, with those prices, they were making more than enough money and that he was opposed to greed and hoped more artists would do the same. 

Not my cup of tea musically, but if he's saying he's making more than enough money out of £30 Arena tickets.....imagine the levels of greed that must be going on, even when you factor in more expansive stage sets etc. 

[Powerage5]

Lack of new music. Every single other complaint I have would be more palatable if there was at least a bit of artistic integrity to back it all up. Axl’s voice, stale set lists, insane ticket prices, inept management - if there was new music, I could live with all of that. I can’t say the same if you fixed any one of those complaints I just rattled off. 

[janrichmond]

Axl's vocals these past few years are the only reason I'm not bothered about seeing them live again. Obviously, the setlist needs a refresh but that is not the biggest issue. 

[Powderfinger]

5 hours ago, allwaystired said:

Not sure if you know them but Paul Heaten and Jacqui Abbott of The Beautiful South did an Arena tour in the UK where every ticket was £30. 

I saw them talking about it on a TV show and he said that really, with those prices, they were making more than enough money and that he was opposed to greed and hoped more artists would do the same. 

Not my cup of tea musically, but if he's saying he's making more than enough money out of £30 Arena tickets.....imagine the levels of greed that must be going on, even when you factor in more expansive stage sets etc. 

 

Despite being a committed rocker back then, The Beautiful South were always acceptable to me, very clever songs…. I saw them live somewhere in the early 90s and they were killer. 

[Powderfinger]

5 hours ago, janrichmond said:

Axl's vocals these past few years are the only reason I'm not bothered about seeing them live again. Obviously, the setlist needs a refresh but that is not the biggest issue. 

You saw the last real GNR gig in 91, if I recall correctly. I saw peak Axl in 92. 
I think that makes it harder to listen to him now than if we had gotten into them in the last 20 years. 
 

I accept Axl’s vocals are shitty for lots of reasons, I get it, but what’s keeping me away is Frank. I can’t even enjoy the music the way it was and could be played. The mix of Axl’s vocals and Franks Drumming is why I’m not bothered. 

[rockphantom]

59 minutes ago, Powderfinger said:

You saw the last real GNR gig in 91, if I recall correctly. I saw peak Axl in 92. 
I think that makes it harder to listen to him now than if we had gotten into them in the last 20 years. 
 

I accept Axl’s vocals are shitty for lots of reasons, I get it, but what’s keeping me away is Frank. I can’t even enjoy the music the way it was and could be played. The mix of Axl’s vocals and Franks Drumming is why I’m not bothered. 

Frank is a major issue for me too. The reunion would have been so much better with Steven and/or Matt. I know the GNR catalog inside and out, after hearing these 30+ year old songs tens of thousands of times over the decades. 
It's very easy to spot Frank's mistakes on the NITL live recordings. His most well-known fuck-up was when he fumbled the end of Nightrain on the Harlem Apollo SXM live broadcast. Frank has improved since April 2016. However, he is still a bar band level drummer supporting a stadium level live rock production (I don't consider GNR to be a true band these days). Sure, Steven and Matt may have aggravating personalities gauging from what we've heard/read over the years, but they were both integral parts of GNR's Golden Era, and should have been given a chance to redeem themselves by sharing drumming duties during the Reunion Era. 

On the flip side, In 2016, I heard that the 4 "additional musicians" supporting A/S/D each receive a salary of $50,000 per WEEK while on tour. Can anyone confirm/deny this?

If this is true, I don't blame Frank for sticking around. Only a complete FOOL would give up that kind of income. 
I bet if Frank quit the band, that Brian Mantia would be offered the drum stool, just to further stick it to Steven and Matt. 

[mystery]

3 minutes ago, rockphantom said:

Frank is a major issue for me too. The reunion would have been so much better with Steven and/or Matt. I know the GNR catalog inside and out, after hearing these 30+ year old songs tens of thousands of times over the decades. 
It's very easy to spot Frank's mistakes on the NITL live recordings. His most well-known fuck-up was when he fumbled the end of Nightrain on the Harlem Apollo SXM live broadcast. Frank has improved since April 2016. However, he is still a bar band level drummer supporting a stadium level live rock production (I don't consider GNR to be a true band these days). Sure, Steven and Matt may have aggravating personalities gauging from what we've heard/read over the years, but they were both integral parts of GNR's Golden Era, and should have been given a chance to redeem themselves by sharing drumming duties during the Reunion Era. 

On the flip side, In 2016, I heard that the 4 "additional musicians" supporting A/S/D each receive a salary of $50,000 per WEEK while on tour. Can anyone confirm/deny this?

If this is true, I don't blame Frank for sticking around. Only a complete FOOL would give up that kind of income. 
I bet if Frank quit the band, that Brian Mantia would be offered the drum stool, just to further stick it to Steven and Matt. 

Your point about this not being a "true" band is interesting because it reminds me of stories of Bruce Springsteen and Prince who wouldn't put up with shoddy musicianship.

Prince one time noticed a single bad note from one of his guys and just glared at him for the rest of that performance.

It shows that Guns isn't really a tight unit if you have Frank doing this and Slash doing what he wants for Chinese Democracy songs.

[rockphantom]

3 minutes ago, mystery said:

Your point about this not being a "true" band is interesting because it reminds me of stories of Bruce Springsteen and Prince who wouldn't put up with shoddy musicianship.

Prince one time noticed a single bad note from one of his guys and just glared at him for the rest of that performance.

It shows that Guns isn't really a tight unit if you have Frank doing this and Slash doing what he wants for Chinese Democracy songs.

I haven't considered GNR to be a true band since the end of the UYI era. At this stage, it's the "Guns N' Roses Las Vegas Revue" featuring Axl, Slash, and Duff of Guns N' Roses. 

[MaskingApathy]

On 2/25/2023 at 7:08 AM, guitarpatch said:

That they decided to not re-record those CD era songs from the ground up 

 

On 2/25/2023 at 9:59 AM, rockphantom said:

Worst thing for me is GNR's "War on Fans".

What I mean by this, is punishing fans for freely trading live recordings that were never and likely never will be made available officially.

In addition, I have the following gripes:

Axl's mickey voice is EXTREMELY annoying to me.
The predictable setlists also turn me off. 


The fact that Frank is on drums when both Steven and Matt are available.
I don't have anything against Frank as a human being, but he can't compete with what Steven and Matt could bring to the band.
I always imagined a "reunion" being a celebration of the golden era, and that the original five, plus Matt, Dizzy, and Gilby would have a part to play at EVERY show.
Instead, we ended up with Slash and Duff joining Axl's GNR "Las Vegas style revue" band. The spirit of the Golden Era of GNR has been long dead.
At such high ticket prices, fans are owed a more complete reunion, IMHO!

I am glad that a version of GNR featuring A/S/D is touring for those who are interested.
I won't shame fans that are still into what is on offer in 2023. However, I have checked out and won't be interested in seeing GNR ever again unless MAJOR changes are made.

Peace and respect to ALL fans of any age or era!
In the grand scheme of things, Guns are JUST a rock band, and not worth arguing over with strangers on the internet.
Life is too short! 

The video takedowns also were a big dark spot on this era of the band. Seems to have stopped now though.

On 2/25/2023 at 11:34 AM, GnR Chris said:

Without question, the most disappointing thing is the lack of new music and the lame radio silence regarding anything band-related unless it’s peddling merch. 

There was so much goddamn excitement in late 2015 that continued through 2016. Slash and Duff were back. GNR were putting on killer shows. So much goodwill. And then … endless touring. The bloom is off the rose. 

Yes, not capitalizing on the excitement is probably the biggest disappointment.

On 2/25/2023 at 5:22 PM, mystery said:

We need an opposite version of this thread because despite what seems like negativity, there has been good things that have come out of the reunion. If the reunion sucked that much with no redeeming qualities it wouldn't be as successful as its been.

 

23 hours ago, Ak1nney said:

The setlists. Most casual GNR fans filling the seats know 10 songs at most. They're there for Jungle, Knockin, Sweet Child, November Rain, Live and Let Die, Paradise City, etc. There's absolutely no reason why the other dozen songs or so shouldn't have been switched up with every new leg/year within the same country. Also, ditch the weird covers. It's fine to do Wichita or Black Hole Sun for a while, but we don't need them being mainstays like The Seeker.

I've followed this whole reunion but admittedly went to just one show because I wanted to keep that happy memory of the reunion and not let it wear out. Cincinnati 2016 was too good to tarnish with the voice going downhill steadily since 2016 and the setlist barely changing.

You got to see Steven! That's my favorite moment from the reunion. Honestly with the setlist they're playing a big chunk of their catalog already, it's just us diehards who are following every show and want to hear certain other songs. Seeing them in 2021 changed my mind because even though I already knew what songs were coming it was still an exciting set and relatively well paced (only weak point was KOHD being really long but I think they do that on purpose as a chance for Axl to rest his voice). I thought the AC/DC covers last year were fun and Slash seemed to have a blast playing those. Axl's voice, well it just is what it is now. He's still putting in effort though; that was pretty clear at the 2021 show I was at. 

1 hour ago, rockphantom said:

Frank is a major issue for me too. The reunion would have been so much better with Steven and/or Matt. I know the GNR catalog inside and out, after hearing these 30+ year old songs tens of thousands of times over the decades. 
It's very easy to spot Frank's mistakes on the NITL live recordings. His most well-known fuck-up was when he fumbled the end of Nightrain on the Harlem Apollo SXM live broadcast. Frank has improved since April 2016. However, he is still a bar band level drummer supporting a stadium level live rock production (I don't consider GNR to be a true band these days). Sure, Steven and Matt may have aggravating personalities gauging from what we've heard/read over the years, but they were both integral parts of GNR's Golden Era, and should have been given a chance to redeem themselves by sharing drumming duties during the Reunion Era. 

On the flip side, In 2016, I heard that the 4 "additional musicians" supporting A/S/D each receive a salary of $50,000 per WEEK while on tour. Can anyone confirm/deny this?

If this is true, I don't blame Frank for sticking around. Only a complete FOOL would give up that kind of income. 
I bet if Frank quit the band, that Brian Mantia would be offered the drum stool, just to further stick it to Steven and Matt. 

Yes, Frank. It's disappointing that they couldn't bring in Matt back in 2016; that would've brought a lot more energy to the whole production (and it would show in Slash and Duff's playing). And have Steven play a little too, although it seems like he's been having issues lately. And if Axl was that against Matt being there then just bring in Fitzy; he would kill it too.

[S1lkw0rm1]

I loved every show I went to, but I am disappointed at how little the stage design has changed over the last seven years. I find some of visuals really tacky and cheap, to be honest. I wish they worked with NIN or Radiohead production teams for once.

Musically, I don't understand Frank's offbeat drumming, Axl's whistle and when Axl sings over Slash's riff at the beginning of Paradise City. 

[PatrickS77]

4 hours ago, rockphantom said:

I bet if Frank quit the band, that Brian Mantia would be offered the drum stool, just to further stick it to Steven and Matt. 

People still don't get why Steven/Matt/Fitz or any Slash/Matt associated person will get that job. Especially not in 2016. By now things might have changed, should Ferrer drop out.

[JAxlMorrison]

On 2/25/2023 at 2:03 AM, Nintari said:

The sad realization that GNR is figuratively through, and has been since 1993. 

Ticket sales strongly disagree. 

[Dacroix]

Frank.

[JAxlMorrison]

On 2/26/2023 at 9:10 AM, PatrickS77 said:

Fact is. Most people in that stadium don't give a shit about CD songs. So whatever.

Inaccurate. I’ve seen plenty of people rocking out to ChiDem and Better. 
 

and I remember specifically, the East Rutherford crowd giving This I Love one hell of a reaction. 

Edited March 3, 2023 by JAxlMorrison