What do you want them to do next?

[Zeppelin]

6 hours ago, RONIN said:

Just retire I think. Axl has nothing left to say creatively and frankly hasn't since 1994.  The more he goes on, the more the legend of his genius just erodes. All the myths and assumptions we had about the Chinese Democracy era are slowly imploding one at a time. Many of us thought the CD era was a fertile creative period, that Axl went on a mad tear of writing and recording 3.5 albums worth of material that he, for reasons of artistic integrity and insanity, never bothered to promote or release outside of a single album that was forced out of his hands. But it seems to be getting clearer that maybe most of the material that wasn't released and "saved" for CD 2 just plain sucked and was rightfully dumped by Geffen. That would also line up with the rumors of them thinking the earlier versions of the Chinese Democracy material were also weak - this would explain the armada of CD producers needed to inject some life into this project. 3.5 albums in retrospect was more like 1.5 albums at best.

I feel bad for the people who wanted CD 2 and have been waiting years for it. Imagine waiting for a decade thinking he has "Big Guns" and getting a trilogy of turds like Absurd, Hard School, and Perhaps. The singles give the appearance at the very least that Rose has nothing, just running on fumes since '94 - the village leaks were shockingly poor and I was in disbelief that a talent like Axl could have been so uninspired to create material like that. Atlas is an embarrassment. It all felt like a joke. Like this GnR project was some hobby he'd pick up a few times a year when he was bored. It seems to me like Interscope/Geffen are the biggest bag holders of all time in the music business after trusting Axl. 13 million for CD.  Not to mention million dollar bonuses for delivering work on time (he never did). Imagine paying 13 million for new songs from GnR on par with AFD/Illusions and getting back stuff many years later like Riad, IRS, Atlas, Hard School, etc. Axl punked them. What a colossal waste of money, talent, and time. Forget a trilogy, as Bob Ezrin said, he didn't even have a single album worth of good songs - if I'm being generous, maybe half an album's worth of top shelf material. This is what you broke up the old band for?? Isn't "The General" named after the chinese takeout he had - General Tso's chicken? Am I totally off or was that the rumor on here? Wasn't there a Weird Science episode back in the day where the characters become rockstars and name their next single "Chopsticks" after looking at their Chinese takeout because they didn't give a rat's ass anymore - about their fans or the band? I'm not making that up, that's a real episode.

Why couldn't he just put out a butt rock album with Slash in '96 if he wasn't going to do anything with all those alt-rock guys and members of NiN in his band? He poached a bunch of guys from Trent's band just so he could be like NiN and then didn't do shit with it. Someone in "The General" thread said (and I'm paraphrasing) that it seems like Rose just spent a few hundred hours pro-tooling these CD tracks with vocals back in 2001/2002 and that's it - he just added layers, cheesy effects, a school bell on hard school, a random choir on twat, etc - no new lyrics, vocals, etc ... aside from a couple touch-ups in 2007 and early '08. And then nothing again. Basically, a lot of this stuff sounds unfinished because...it probably is. He had no idea what he was doing and Interscope was doling out millions for this. Somewhere in this mess was Yoda advising him about psychic energies and Beta/Doug Goldstein telling him about how great this new band was working out and that everything he was doing was awesome.

I'd lay decent odds that nearly everything they still have left in the vault as far as new music is probably just hundreds of hours of instrumental material. Rose's work ethic speaks for itself,  I cannot imagine much completed work with vocals still unreleased. He has had 25 years (since 1998) to finish this stuff. Are there even 20 finished CD songs? I would be shocked if there were. I think it would have been cool for Axl to just put out a solo album of his best experimental tracks - especially after hearing The General. Regardless of whether they were good or not, it would have been different enough to garner some interest and he wouldn't have had the weight of GnR's legacy to deal with. That would have been a fine way to end the Axl Rose story in the mid to late 90's. But he just hid behind the GnR name - endlessly auditioning all these dudes from bands he admired and selling them some fantasy trilogy of "experimental" albums. Clearly at some point these people stopped buying this. Each new iteration of the band was a downgrade from the previous one. By the end, the only guitarist he could attract to his band to put the finishing touches on his "big guns" was DJ Ashba.

As for this current version of GnR that exists now, all they really have of value to fans is the archival material. If they had actual releasable stuff from the mid-90's, you might have something. That mid 90's stuff prior to the breakup has real sentimental value to the long suffering fans of this band. But Axl likely never completed any vocals as per usual - so again, you have nothing. They have pro-recorded stuff from 88-93 that would make for great live albums/show releases. How about new dolby mixes of the Illusion material. Maybe redo Illusions how Slash wanted them - a "naked" mix. How about documentaries with archival footage from the AFD and Illusions tours? They don't even have to do anything new! But all of this is doomed with the circus clowns they have managing the band. So how about new material you say? Well... Axl can't sing all that well these days - and their writing talent is a major question mark - it's a real question whether they can even put together one decent track on the level of Shotgun Blues at this point. So maybe retiring without tarnishing the legacy further would be the best way to maintain their reputation rather than turning into a cheesy legacy act like KISS. Let people continue to believe the myth that GnR broke up in their prime...that if the AFD 5 were reunited or even if just Slash and Axl are together again, mana from heaven will drop.

Damn. I thought I was hard on the band.

[F*ck Fear]

On 12/13/2023 at 9:13 AM, THELINESMAN said:

I want them to write new music from scratch. Preferably lots of blues based hard rock. Release an album of mostly back to roots tracks. New Slash riffs. New Axl lyrics and vocals. Lots of signature rasp. A few piano tracks like illusions, release a killer 14 track album. Do a last mega music video. Release something to coincide with a big movie. Pure fan service stuff. I’d love it.

These two things no longer go hand in hand.

[ZoSoRose]

40 minutes ago, Zeppelin said:

Damn. I thought I was hard on the band.

Pretty epic slam- down from @RONIN. I can't fault anything he said in it, even if I like CD and the singles for what they are

[SoulMonster]

7 hours ago, RONIN said:

I feel bad for the people who wanted CD 2 and have been waiting years for it. Imagine waiting for a decade thinking he has "Big Guns" and getting a trilogy of turds like Absurd, Hard School, and Perhaps.

Don't feel bad for me, Hard Skool is great, and Perhaps and Absurd are not too shabby, either. And then we have The General, too. Not to mention songs we haven't received yet, like State of Grace which is among my top 5 GN'R songs. Seems like you are the one I should feel bad about because you don't seem happy with things.

[Mikey Whipwreck]

The only realistic things left are the remaining reworked CD era songs getting an official released, and more stuff from the pre-reunion vaults leaking. I'm interested in hearing whatever's left. 

Axl has shown no desire to write and record new material since 2007. He's creatively bankrupt. Everyone would be better off if he just admitted it like Billy Joel did years back.

[Stay.Of.Execution]

I'll never understand people who want a band they like/liked to retire. Let others still enjoy it.

[gnfnrs1972]

I take every track I can get. I like some and some not so much. But they are all interesting to me. Changing away from the iconic voice is what gets me.....in the studio. He's a mess live so I care nothing about hearing his cringe worthy live performance. He's like the Forrest Gump of rock n roll now, where good shit happens for him even if he has no brain.

[Tom2112]

On 12/12/2023 at 7:17 PM, ZoSoRose said:

Well, The General and Soul Monster have now come and gone. Whether or not you like them, the unthinkable has happened and we now have (in some capacity) most of the most talked about "CD2" songs in a pre-2018 GNR world-

Jackie Chan
The General
Oklahoma
Atlas Shrugged
Soul Monster
Oklahoma
Tonto
Zodiac
Thyme
Quicksong
Silkworms
OMG alt. 
Going Down

...with some previously unknown songs like State of Grace, Perhaps, and all the other instrumentals. 

So, what do you want next?

 

Like most people here, I wanted to hear this material so bad. Many spent over a decade speculating and talking about these tracks- which is fucking crazy to me because all we really had were song titles. Still, we did it anyways. We built up a mythical Chinese Democracy 2. It was ready to go in 2010, and it didn't come out after all these years because of Axl. Well, after getting the 4 reunion- songs, I don't think that is true anymore. Regardless of if I like them or not (I overall do), they very much feel like leftovers to me. Almost like they are unfinished. That is how the locker leaks and 5- singles feel to me. It is clear Axl is not reworking or adding to these arrangements, they are just copy/pasting Slash and Duff. 

Personally, I am ready to move on. I love Chinese Democracy, it is one of my all- time favorite albums, but I wish Axl would find a bit more gas in the tank. I am grateful we got to hear all of the above so we as a weird fanbase can move on. I'll take what I can get, but do we really think the completely unheard stuff like Seven is going to blow our minds? I'd happily take that, Zodiac, Oklahoma but we don't even know if they have vocals. Overall, I am content with what we have from the CD sessions, and feel like I have enough closure as a fan. Monsters being a good GNR track, helps. 

The most exciting thing, by far, would be all- new material with new lyrics and vocals from Axl. I'll be honest, it probably wouldn't be that good, but I'd be excited to hear them at least try. 

My thoughts exactly.

Move on, new material written by the current band with brand new lyrics and vocals. 

But yeah, I'll also take what I can get and just not like what they release 😄

[Tom2112]

16 hours ago, Stay.Of.Execution said:

I'll never understand people who want a band they like/liked to retire. Let others still enjoy it.

Sometimes it's for the best. Like a fighter you love to watch but know that they've taken some severe hits and shouldn't compete anymore.

I think under the right guidance gnr have a good record in them. Great? Excellent? That's probably a stretch at this point given what they consider good enough to release these past few years.

[allwaystired]

17 hours ago, Stay.Of.Execution said:

I'll never understand people who want a band they like/liked to retire. Let others still enjoy it.

There's something really sad about watching things fade away though and get progressively worse. 

So many bands are remembered as all time greats because they split or ended before that stage. 

 

[Stay.Of.Execution]

9 minutes ago, allwaystired said:

There's something really sad about watching things fade away though and get progressively worse. 

So many bands are remembered as all time greats because they split or ended before that stage. 

 

everyone at the concerts is having a great time though. so they can't be that shit as mygnr might suggest they are.

[allwaystired]

1 minute ago, Stay.Of.Execution said:

everyone at the concerts is having a great time though. so they can't be that shit as mygnr might suggest they are.

Playing devil's advocate here a bit.....people have a good time watching some really, really awful shit! 

Speaking for myself, yeah I enjoyed the tour this year. 

[Jw224]

I want to hear the other CD material. I'm not overly interested in seeing what the band can do nowadays as I have my doubts it would be any good. Not that i'd complain if they did actually go in and do some new stuff, just saying my expectations would not be very high is all.

Edited December 15, 2023 by Jw224

[Tom2112]

6 minutes ago, Jw224 said:

I want to hear the other CD material. I'm not overly interested in seeing what the band can do nowadays as I have my doubts it would be any good. Not that i'd complain if they did actually go in and do some new stuff, just saying my expectations would not be very high is all.

Are your expectations higher for the remainder of the Chinese stuff?

[JAxlMorrison]

14 hours ago, Stay.Of.Execution said:

everyone at the concerts is having a great time though. so they can't be that shit as mygnr might suggest they are.

I know right? Thats where the ludicrousity of these boards sometimes comes out. That just because they analyze every single live performance and don’t like the vocals, the shows are a catastrophic mess that everyone laughs at or feels ripped off by, thus ruining the idea of “holy GNR’s precious reputation.” Ain’t the case! At least 80-85% of the people have a blast and rave about the experience. 

[Georgina Arriaga]

On 12/14/2023 at 3:37 AM, RONIN said:

Just retire I think. Axl has nothing left to say creatively and frankly hasn't since 1994.  The more he goes on, the more the legend of his genius just erodes. All the myths and assumptions we had about the Chinese Democracy era are slowly imploding one at a time. Many of us thought the CD era was a fertile creative period, that Axl went on a mad tear of writing and recording 3.5 albums worth of material that he, for reasons of artistic integrity and insanity, never bothered to promote or release outside of a single album that was forced out of his hands. But it seems to be getting clearer that maybe most of the material that wasn't released and "saved" for CD 2 just plain sucked and was rightfully dumped by Geffen. That would also line up with the rumors of them thinking the earlier versions of the Chinese Democracy material were also weak - this would explain the armada of CD producers needed to inject some life into this project. 3.5 albums in retrospect was more like 1.5 albums at best.

I feel bad for the people who wanted CD 2 and have been waiting years for it. Imagine waiting for a decade thinking he has "Big Guns" and getting a trilogy of turds like Absurd, Hard School, and Perhaps. The singles give the appearance at the very least that Rose has nothing, just running on fumes since '94 - the village leaks were shockingly poor and I was in disbelief that a talent like Axl could have been so uninspired to create material like that. Atlas is an embarrassment. It all felt like a joke. Like this GnR project was some hobby he'd pick up a few times a year when he was bored. It seems to me like Interscope/Geffen are the biggest bag holders of all time in the music business after trusting Axl. 13 million for CD.  Not to mention million dollar bonuses for delivering work on time (he never did). Imagine paying 13 million for new songs from GnR on par with AFD/Illusions and getting back stuff many years later like Riad, IRS, Atlas, Hard School, etc. Axl punked them. What a colossal waste of money, talent, and time. Forget a trilogy, as Bob Ezrin said, he didn't even have a single album worth of good songs - if I'm being generous, maybe half an album's worth of top shelf material. This is what you broke up the old band for?? Isn't "The General" named after the chinese takeout he had - General Tso's chicken? Am I totally off or was that the rumor on here? Wasn't there a Weird Science episode back in the day where the characters become rockstars and name their next single "Chopsticks" after looking at their Chinese takeout because they didn't give a rat's ass anymore - about their fans or the band? I'm not making that up, that's a real episode.

Why couldn't he just put out a butt rock album with Slash in '96 if he wasn't going to do anything with all those alt-rock guys and members of NiN in his band? He poached a bunch of guys from Trent's band just so he could be like NiN and then didn't do shit with it. Someone in "The General" thread said (and I'm paraphrasing) that it seems like Rose just spent a few hundred hours pro-tooling these CD tracks with vocals back in 2001/2002 and that's it - he just added layers, cheesy effects, a school bell on hard school, a random choir on twat, etc - no new lyrics, vocals, etc ... aside from a couple touch-ups in 2007 and early '08. And then nothing again. Basically, a lot of this stuff sounds unfinished because...it probably is. He had no idea what he was doing and Interscope was doling out millions for this. Somewhere in this mess was Yoda advising him about psychic energies and Beta/Doug Goldstein telling him about how great this new band was working out and that everything he was doing was awesome.

I'd lay decent odds that nearly everything they still have left in the vault as far as new music is probably just hundreds of hours of instrumental material. Rose's work ethic speaks for itself,  I cannot imagine much completed work with vocals still unreleased. He has had 25 years (since 1998) to finish this stuff. Are there even 20 finished CD songs? I would be shocked if there were. I think it would have been cool for Axl to just put out a solo album of his best experimental tracks - especially after hearing The General. Regardless of whether they were good or not, it would have been different enough to garner some interest and he wouldn't have had the weight of GnR's legacy to deal with. That would have been a fine way to end the Axl Rose story in the mid to late 90's. But he just hid behind the GnR name - endlessly auditioning all these dudes from bands he admired and selling them some fantasy trilogy of "experimental" albums. Clearly at some point these people stopped buying this. Each new iteration of the band was a downgrade from the previous one. By the end, the only guitarist he could attract to his band to put the finishing touches on his "big guns" was DJ Ashba.

As for this current version of GnR that exists now, all they really have of value to fans is the archival material. If they had actual releasable stuff from the mid-90's, you might have something. That mid 90's stuff prior to the breakup has real sentimental value to the long suffering fans of this band. But Axl likely never completed any vocals as per usual - so again, you have nothing. They have pro-recorded stuff from 88-93 that would make for great live albums/show releases. How about new dolby mixes of the Illusion material. Maybe redo Illusions how Slash wanted them - a "naked" mix. How about documentaries with archival footage from the AFD and Illusions tours? They don't even have to do anything new! But all of this is doomed with the circus clowns they have managing the band. So how about new material you say? Well... Axl can't sing all that well these days - and their writing talent is a major question mark - it's a real question whether they can even put together one decent track on the level of Shotgun Blues at this point. So maybe retiring without tarnishing the legacy further would be the best way to maintain their reputation rather than turning into a cheesy legacy act like KISS. Let people continue to believe the myth that GnR broke up in their prime...that if the AFD 5 were reunited or even if just Slash and Axl are together again, mana from heaven will drop.

Wow! A lot of WOW! 

[Blackstar]

On 12/14/2023 at 11:37 AM, RONIN said:

Isn't "The General" named after the chinese takeout he had - General Tso's chicken? Am I totally off or was that the rumor on here? Wasn't there a Weird Science episode back in the day where the characters become rockstars and name their next single "Chopsticks" after looking at their Chinese takeout because they didn't give a rat's ass anymore - about their fans or the band? I'm not making that up, that's a real episode.

Not a rumour, true story. But it was Brain and his friends who he wrote the instrumental with that named it after General Tso's chicken. Just a random joke working title (similarly to other instrumentals that were written by NuGnR members and not Axl) that Axl apparently decided to keep after he wrote lyrics to it.

Edited December 16, 2023 by Blackstar

[Roccar]

Next thing is to get Izzy back, at least as a permanent writing partner. Then they can get back to their core music style. Pay Izzy equally. He deserves that for being the heart and soul of GNR. Take him on tour when he wants to. Fortus can fill in on tour but if Izzy can join the creative part again they can really make a comeback

[pbj_jam]

release the entirety of the leftovers under the condition they contain vocals or an album like so; CD,Shacklers,Better,Atlas,IfTheWorld,TWAT,Catcher,Perhaps,Riad,TheGeneral&Monsters,Sorry,SOG,Hardstool,Prostitute

closing the book with the intended followup to illusions as deus intended.

 

New material with Axl riffing ontop of tophats stuff, no bueno and no comprendo for mesa

 

 

[bumcheecksmcghee]

Play 1 or 2 last shows early 2025. LA and NY etc.. 2 big time stadiums/cities.

Gives axl plenty of time to get some voice back.

Get izzy an Steven or Matt (or both)..

Gives it that O.G GNR feel**

And play the 2 shows, 2 hours each, one show the hits/deep cuts then alternate 2nd show, other hits/other deep cuts.. maybe 1 cover each show, no Chinese stuff. And just finish up there. Let's slash an duff off the hook creatively... closure with izzy an the drummers back finally. And let's Axl finish with some dignity at least cos atm, he is just woeful and clearly uninspired creatively.....

** no 4tus, Frank or Melissa included in these shows. Yes to dizzy though **

The end.

....

Then a 2028 re-reunion.. 🤦🤣

Nahhhh i jokes lol..

No more new music after that, just re issues an boxsets of the old stuff, (CD boxset to include all the rest of what's out there... TSI with a second disc of covers the band could do from songs performed live after 1993, witchita, whole lotto rosie etc) 

The end 🤘🙋🙂

[jamillos]

To start acting like a band again. And not like a goddamn corporation, with a sole shareholder to boot. 

Ain’t gonna happen, is it. 

Forget it. 

[Ratam]

6 hours ago, Blackstar said:

Not a rumour, true story. But it was Brain and his friends who he wrote the instrumental with that named it after General Tso's chicken. Just a random joke working title (similarly to other instrumentals that were written by NuGnR members and not Axl) that Axl apparently decided to keep after he wrote lyrics to it.

I think is to be poor taste put joke title to one song about such dramatic theme. It is the reason i doubt TG is about abuse.

[GNROSAS]

All the Chinese era reworked & finished songs to be released within 2024 dripped fed.
All those (including the 4 ones laready released) to be presented in an album format at the end 2024 (CD II)
2024 to bring full closure to that era, for everyone.🤞 

2025 focus on a new era writting new songs from scratch.
Even maybe bring Izzy, Steven or Brain in the the studio/ for writing purposes if needs be.
Not necessarily involve Izzy & Steven in the future long tours though, Richard  & Brain are fine to me.
Get rid of Frank!

 

Edited December 16, 2023 by GNROSAS

[Blackstar]

4 hours ago, Ratam said:

I think is to be poor taste put joke title to one song about such dramatic theme. It is the reason i doubt TG is about abuse.

I have no doubt about the subject matter being child abuse. I think the title probably had a different meaning to Axl and that's why he kept it, like I said in another thread:

 

[Ratam]

31 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

I have no doubt about the subject matter being child abuse. I think the title probably had a different meaning to Axl and that's why he kept it, like I said in another thread:

 

Then these title is of poor taste, how Axl not realized? Axl live in his own planet...😁