Kat Benzova sues GNR/Fernando for copyright infringement and sexual harassment

[Coma16]

I wonder what the status of lithographs will be for future touring, assuming Nando gets the corn.

[jamillos]

22 minutes ago, PJ87 said:

Sorry I don't live on the forum board dude and post all day just so I can get attacked by other people. In fact, this is why I don't post much because as soon as you do you get attacked by some loser that thinks he's holier than thou because he is a master poster on a forum. What ulterior motive would I have? I could give a shit either way. Just my opinions. 

You know what, I now definitely believe you're a lawyer. Good day, mate.

[ZoSoRose]

9 minutes ago, PJ87 said:

16,150 posts? 

You tell me, Mr. Legit Business Insider Lawyer Man

[Joraz]

2 hours ago, BucketEgg said:

yep, the story is getting picked up

https://metalinjection.net/news/guns-n-roses-sued-over-copyright-infringement-manager-sued-for-disturbing-workplace-harassment

https://www.nme.com/news/music/photographer-suing-guns-n-roses-for-copyright-infringement-and-manager-for-sexual-harassment-3539044

The most alarming thing about this is the titles and the way they are written "Photographer Suing Guns N Roses & Its Management" when they read "Suing Guns N Roses" people automatically assume the band members... not a good look for the band...

[StrangerInThisTown]

Don't see Axl cutting ties with TB, it's his whole family at this point in life. All I can see happening is Fernando being "demoted" to a background person really

Edited November 15, 2023 by StrangerInThisTown

[vloors]

4 hours ago, StrangerInThisTown said:

Don't see Axl cutting ties with TB, it's his whole family at this point in life. All I can see happening is Fernando being "demoted" to a background person really

From the case notes it sounds like Monkey handler could be up his alley if he gets demoted.

Edited November 15, 2023 by vloors

[Joraz]

30 minutes ago, jamillos said:

You know what, I now definitely believe you're a lawyer. Good day, mate.

We now believe more than ever

[Heather14]

Now I can see Twitter posts from RS or NME quoted everywhere, and of course they will use a picture of Axl and Slash. It sucks.

[PelozoF]

10 hours ago, Stay.Of.Execution said:

I still think her pictures were bad and this has nothing to do with this case, but nice try. Please ask your source about new gnr stuff. 

How the fuck are Kat's pictures bad 💀

[gnfnr2k]

"claims another photographer for the band, Jarmo, wasn’t treated in the same way as she was."    

 

Jarmo is a photographer now?

[ZODIAC]

5 minutes ago, Dave_gnfnr2k said:

"claims another photographer for the band, Jarmo, wasn’t treated in the same way as she was."    

 

Jarmo is a photographer now?

He has been around with a camera, in front of the stage, for quite a few years now. Every once in a while... 

[Panda2]

 

[surforia]

11 hours ago, jettesnel said:

 

 

You won the internet today with this post.  I almost spit out my drink!

[Stay.Of.Execution]

2 hours ago, PelozoF said:

How the fuck are Kat's pictures bad 💀

I'm not a fan of her constant use of black and white pics. Makes her pictures seem lifeless and boring.

[alfierose]

5 hours ago, PJ87 said:

As a lawyer myself, I see this as nothing more than financial dispute. Bringing claims of harassment and retaliation won't survive if she isn't an employee. An employment relationship is a prerequisite, she herself admits she was a 1099 contractor and not an employee. At best, these are breach of contract and copyright claims. The employment/harassment related claims are to attempt to gain leverage and are likely just salacious in nature (and could potentially invoke a reimbursement of attorneys fees in California). I suspect GNR/Lebeis will file a demurrer motion to this complaint rather swiftly.

This case will probably be settled out of court fairly quickly. It's a typical business dispute, these things happen all the time in business and GNR, touring, and music industry is no different. I will add that I read the complaint by Benzova's lawyer, it was pretty sloppy, and he's been licensed for only ONE YEAR. He will be outmatched. Not to say her claims don't have some merit, I wouldn't know that one way or another. But just because she alleges things doesn't make them true. She could take any little off color joke made in the last 7 years of touring, and spin it to look salacious and bad. Curious to know whether she played along and made any jokes or innuendos along the way... Hell hath no fury like a photographer scorned! 

I agree the document isn't great. Some of the spelling is terrible for a legal document. It's likely she can't afford good representation so best case scenario for everyone involved is that it's settled out of court. Doesn't mean there's no truth to her allegations but people rarely get proper justice in David v Goliath type situations.

[megaguns1982]

 there’s a million hotchicks out there who are “photographers”.  Find a new one.

[allwaystired]

5 hours ago, Blackstar said:

Regardless of which side is right about the ownership of the photos, this is just incredibly far from how a business as big as GN'R is should be managed.

I wonder if Axl knew this. I doubt he did because, for all his flaws (and this has even been considered as one of his flaws) he is known to be infamously obsessed about wanting to have everything on paper and under contract, but also as someone who wants to be fair to people who work for him.

That "family doesn't need contracts" thing seems incredibly likely. 

Family doesn't indeed need contracts. Million dollar touring enterprises do. If GNR aren't aware of this, then Kat is in for a very big day. 

[Georgina Arriaga]

5 hours ago, PJ87 said:

As a lawyer myself, I see this as nothing more than financial dispute. Bringing claims of harassment and retaliation won't survive if she isn't an employee. An employment relationship is a prerequisite, she herself admits she was a 1099 contractor and not an employee. At best, these are breach of contract and copyright claims. The employment/harassment related claims are to attempt to gain leverage and are likely just salacious in nature (and could potentially invoke a reimbursement of attorneys fees in California). I suspect GNR/Lebeis will file a demurrer motion to this complaint rather swiftly.

This case will probably be settled out of court fairly quickly. It's a typical business dispute, these things happen all the time in business and GNR, touring, and music industry is no different. I will add that I read the complaint by Benzova's lawyer, it was pretty sloppy, and he's been licensed for only ONE YEAR. He will be outmatched. Not to say her claims don't have some merit, I wouldn't know that one way or another. But just because she alleges things doesn't make them true. She could take any little off color joke made in the last 7 years of touring, and spin it to look salacious and bad. Curious to know whether she played along and made any jokes or innuendos along the way... Hell hath no fury like a photographer scorned! 

Thank you for your insight. What Is demurrer motion?

I noticed the spelling errors, and I Guess she cannot afford a better representation, I wish her the Best in this dispute and I thank her for help to bring Nando down. 

That family Is so toxic, how Is possible that one of the Lebeis Is the accountant? Is beyond me

[Karice]

I always found something creepy and unsettling about Fernando. He just seems sleazy and off to me. If Kat's accusations are true, Fernando should be automatically terminated, not just fired. And jailed. IIRC, terminated means fired permanently, but just fired has a chance to be rehired. If it turns out that Fernando didn't do the accusations, and Kat is lying to get money, she should be sued and ragged and dragged, and jailed.

[allwaystired]

5 hours ago, PJ87 said:

As a lawyer myself, I see this as nothing more than financial dispute. Bringing claims of harassment and retaliation won't survive if she isn't an employee. An employment relationship is a prerequisite, she herself admits she was a 1099 contractor and not an employee. At best, these are breach of contract and copyright claims. The employment/harassment related claims are to attempt to gain leverage and are likely just salacious in nature (and could potentially invoke a reimbursement of attorneys fees in California). I suspect GNR/Lebeis will file a demurrer motion to this complaint rather swiftly.

This case will probably be settled out of court fairly quickly. It's a typical business dispute, these things happen all the time in business and GNR, touring, and music industry is no different. I will add that I read the complaint by Benzova's lawyer, it was pretty sloppy, and he's been licensed for only ONE YEAR. He will be outmatched. Not to say her claims don't have some merit, I wouldn't know that one way or another. But just because she alleges things doesn't make them true. She could take any little off color joke made in the last 7 years of touring, and spin it to look salacious and bad. Curious to know whether she played along and made any jokes or innuendos along the way... Hell hath no fury like a photographer scorned! 

As a lawyer yourself I thought you might be aware that an employment relationship is absolutely NOT a prerequisite of bringing a successful harassment claim. 

https://www.eeoc.gov/harassment

Good luck in the court room. 

Edited November 15, 2023 by allwaystired

[AxlRoseCDII]

This case will likely be settled ASAP. The longer it goes on the more it lingers in the headlines and continues the (deserved) bad publicity. 

[alfierose]

27 minutes ago, allwaystired said:

That "family doesn't need contracts" thing seems incredibly likely. 

Family doesn't indeed need contracts. Million dollar touring enterprises do. If GNR aren't aware of this, then Kat is in for a very big day. 

This 'family' stuff is ridiculous. It's how the mafia operates not big businesses (which GNR definitely is). Even Fernando should have a water tight contract. If he doesn't he should be questioning at this point whether this might be a bad thing for him too.

I wonder if Mick Jagger is still available to run up a Power Point session on Rock Band Business 101? 

[Lethalis]

7 hours ago, AxlRoseCDII said:

Considering Duff is a pretty big believer in the Me Too Movement, would be nice to see a statement from him condemning Fernando for his actions. Put your money where your mouth is, Duff.

Interesting... Duff should be sensitive to this indeed, having 2 daughters and all. I have a daughter myself, and it really changes the way you look at the world.

All of a sudden you are on the lookout, making sure no creepy men are around lol.

I would have fired Fernando immediately.

[allwaystired]

1 minute ago, alfierose said:

This 'family' stuff is ridiculous. It's how the mafia operates not big businesses (which GNR definitely is). Even Fernando should have a water tight contract. If he doesn't he should be questioning at this point whether this might be a bad thing for him too.

I wonder if Mick Jagger is still available to run up a Power Point session on Rock Band Business 101? 

Absolutely. We're not talking about a pub band here, we're talking about a major business operation. It's quite amazing that this sort of thing hasn't been tested in a legal structure previously. 

You'd hope that this incident will be a significant wake-up call for the band and the way they operate, as goodness knows how many other things could flood through in the wake of this. When you operate at the level they have been doing since 2016 if you're not absolutely protected at all levels you're a sitting duck. 

What I've always found remarkable is that we know so much about it all. I have literally zero idea who manages other bands and musicians I like- and why should I? It's as irrelevant to me as a consumer as who is managing my local McDonalds. 

[Lethalis]

44 minutes ago, allwaystired said:

That "family doesn't need contracts" thing seems incredibly likely. 

Family doesn't indeed need contracts. Million dollar touring enterprises do. If GNR aren't aware of this, then Kat is in for a very big day. 

As someone how grew up with a father who had his own business... family does need contracts and very clear rules about what is business and what is family.

I have worked for my father 5 years and it destroyed our relationship. I'm not a workaholic like he was and we had way too many discussions about that until I just quit and told him to f*** off.

I had my own career after that, nice 9 to 5 jobs instead of 24/7 work all the time.