“Get ready for something F’n special.. 1.24.24”

[bmus1]

We're all talking about what the video is gonna be like, but the real excitement about a GNR release is what info is going to leak via metadata or some Soundcloud post.

[SoulMonster]

33 minutes ago, Voodoochild said:

I think he meant that AI works with bots crawling artists styles and stealing to use (think on Disney wanting to sue the company that had this AI tool to draw any person as a Pixar character). 

It is a problem indeed, but I don't know much about the subject to form an opinion on this because I'm not sure how much (if anything) this algorithm actually grabbed copyrighted material for a tool such as Midjourney or whatever they used for The General. 

Well, that is obviously not what I am talking about. I am talking about visual artists using AI as a tool to create visual arts. Similar to in those videos from Blackstar from above. Typically through a prompt-based interface. So you get what you type as input, and therein lies the need to be innovative, artistic, novel, creative, to create something that people will find interesting. 

But to address what you are talking about: Yes, you can use AI to create visual arts that is sufficiently similar to copyrighted works to be infringing upon their IP. But you can also do this with just a pen and a pencil. I mean, any decent graphical artist can create images that are sufficiently similar to Disney characters to violate their IP, just using the normal tools of their trade. Is AI making such theft easier? Sure, at least as far as it opens up such infringement for anyone, even people with little artistic skills themselves, analogous to my point earlier that AI is a tool freely available to anyone to use to create art...or to steal art. 

[GnR Chris]

I freely admit I was being negative without seeing the finished video, but I wouldn’t call it whiny. I just really don’t like the way they promote something seemingly low-effort as “special.” Are they tone deaf to the hardcore fan base? 

Ultimately, “The General” was indeed released as a B side, so it’s dope it’s actually even getting a video. And it’s cool GNR is doing something in an “off” year. Hopefully this means we don’t have to wait for another tour to get a new song. 

Edited January 22 by GnR Chris

[SoulMonster]

4 minutes ago, GnR Chris said:

Are they tone deaf to the hardcore fan base? 

Yes. Absolutely. From now on, consider ALL communication from the band to be directed towards casual fans with absolutely no concern over how it will affect a few hundred hardcore fans. They have a product to sell and promote, we don't matter. 

[Jw224]

7 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Well, that is obviously not what I am talking about. I am talking about visual artists using AI as a tool to create visual arts. Similar to in those videos from Blackstar from above. Typically through a prompt-based interface. So you get what you type as input, and therein lies the need to be innovative, artistic, novel, creative, to create something that people will find interesting. 

But to address what you are talking about: Yes, you can use AI to create visual arts that is sufficiently similar to copyrighted works to be infringing upon their IP. But you can also do this with just a pen and a pencil. I mean, any decent graphical artist can create images that are sufficiently similar to Disney characters to violate their IP, just using the normal tools of their trade. Is AI making such theft easier? Sure, at least as far as it opens up such infringement for anyone, even people with little artistic skills themselves, analogous to my point earlier that AI is a tool freely available to anyone to use to create art...or to steal art. 

AI doesn't "create" anything.

[allwaystired]

23 minutes ago, GnR Chris said:

I freely admit I was being negative without seeing the finished video, but I wouldn’t call it whiny. I just really don’t like the way they promote something seemingly low-effort as “special.” Are they tone deaf to the hardcore fan base? 

Ultimately, “The General” was indeed released as a B side, so it’s dope it’s actually even getting a video. And it’s cool GNR is doing something in an “off” year. Hopefully this means we don’t have to wait for another tour to get a new song. 

We're an annoyance to them, if anything. 

They want people who will go to a gig, as part of their one or two shows a year nostalgia hit, pay a vast amount to do so, buy a load of low quality merchandise and fuck off until the next time they roll round. 

Anything else rocks the boat too much. 

They'd rather we disappeared I think. 

 

 

[SoulMonster]

34 minutes ago, Jw224 said:

AI doesn't "create" anything.

It creates just as much as a paintbrush or a pen does. So, nothing I guess, depending on how you want to define it. It is just a tool used by a visual artist.

In the case of most AI image creator software like Midjourney - as an example - it takes the text prompt given to it by a human being (which can be as innovative and creative as a human can be), the directions given through parameters defined by that human being (like what model sets to use, etc), and then based off on the data models it has installed, creates something that satisfy all conditions. This output will be entirely unique and novel. 

But in the end, the output is not better than the directions given by the humans, and the confines defined by the data models it has to use. Somewhat similarly as it is with a pen or a paintbrush. 

The limitations with AI art today are both that artists need to learn how to wield this tool for efficient use, and the limitations present in the existing data models (resulting in flaws like wrong number of digits on hands, etc, and inability to correctly translate text prompts into visuals). Most software is also not sophisticated enough to allow for individuality in the AI art similar to what we have with conventional visual arts, like individuality in the choice of color palette, pen stroke signatures, etc etc, but now I guess many digital artists will disagree with me. 

 

 

Edited January 22 by SoulMonster

[Tyler Drama]

On 1/20/2024 at 2:28 AM, Towelie said:

Would it kill Axl to appear in a music video not using compilations from live shows?

This.

[DeNfr]

soooooooo I watched a preview of the video and all I have to say :  
STOP crying like BABIES, it's really really well done.
 

especially that moment where Frank Ferrer morphs into Matt Sorum, that was ace.

[Voodoochild]

1 hour ago, SoulMonster said:

Well, that is obviously not what I am talking about. I am talking about visual artists using AI as a tool to create visual arts. Similar to in those videos from Blackstar from above. Typically through a prompt-based interface. So you get what you type as input, and therein lies the need to be innovative, artistic, novel, creative, to create something that people will find interesting. 

But to address what you are talking about: Yes, you can use AI to create visual arts that is sufficiently similar to copyrighted works to be infringing upon their IP. But you can also do this with just a pen and a pencil. I mean, any decent graphical artist can create images that are sufficiently similar to Disney characters to violate their IP, just using the normal tools of their trade. Is AI making such theft easier? Sure, at least as far as it opens up such infringement for anyone, even people with little artistic skills themselves, analogous to my point earlier that AI is a tool freely available to anyone to use to create art...or to steal art. 

I was just trying to explain what he meant. Like I said, I don't have an opinion about those things and I'm not disagreeing with you either.

[themadcaplaughs]

Wow...this went off the rails quick even by MyGNR standards. I think it's pretty obvious that the idea seems to be AI graphics were used to enhance a concept that was developed. Like someone else said, I sincerely doubt they typed "create a Guns N' Roses music video for The General" into Bing chat. There seems to be some real misunderstanding of how AI would/could be used, and a lot of people sounding like Grandpa Simpson yelling at the cloud. 

For what it's worth, I will judge the video when it comes out and will be honest about it. Like @Blackstar said, I am not the biggest fan of the aesthetic, but to call it devoid of creativity seems harsh. It seems more creative than the "Aburd" or "Perhaps" videos. I think it's cool that, for this batch of songs, we'll have two music videos. One will be a more "traditional" performance video (for the more "classic" sounding song) and one will be something a little weird (for the more idiosyncratic song). If that does not match what GN'R did in the 1990s, I do not know what would. 

Edited January 22 by themadcaplaughs

[Zeppelin]

Can't spell "F'N SPECIAL" without "AI."

[Sweersa]

Velvet Revolver and Slash's 2010 solo album had some cool music videos.

The VR video where Matt was lip syncing to Scott's vocals in a bit was cringe though. 

[Its Tino]

I think the AI element is lame, but I’m happy for them to release a little something during their “off time”.
 

Maybe they used AI so Nando wouldn’t sexually harass it

Edited January 22 by Its Tino

[Jw224]

4 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

It creates just as much as a paintbrush or a pen does.

 

 

No, it literally doesn't, lol. AI can only reproduce what it is fed (often other people's art or copyrighted material), it does not create anything. Anyway, I'm not gonna go around in circles as it's becoming mind numbing.

[Blackstar]

Going by the narrow definition of what consists creation (making something original), AI doesn't create art (or anything else) nor is it a tool for creating art. AI is something new, so the debate about whether it can be used as a creative tool is new as well.

But the debate, in general, about what can be considered a product of creativity and, by extension, art goes way back and it applies to a lot of other stuff, including modern visual art. Does someone who relies on the use of existing original works/concepts to make something new create art? Or is it just derivative? For example: Does a collage consist art? Did Andy Warhol make art? And how about the Kostabi painting that became the artwork of UYI? Or the GN'R lithographs that use classic paintings, movie posters etc. as basis replacing some key elements in the originals with GN'R themed stuff (skeletons, skulls, roses etc). I suppose it depends on whether there is an artistic purpose and process. A collage made of family photos is not the same as a collage made by a visual artist. And I think it's not much different with AI.

Edited January 22 by Blackstar

[Dummy]

Looking forward to hearing this. Although, i was hust listening to circus maximus and i was thinking. The day that seven is going to leak is probably going to be the greatest day of our lives. And we don't even know if circus maximus is seven.

We'll probably have to wait another 20 years for se7en though

[LandOla]

Gonna be so gay

[chinese stew]

Fuck...I won't be able to sleep till 1.24.24 

[GNRmello77]

Here's an unlikely theory for you regarding the 'something special' The General video will feature a date as a hidden message which will tell the release date of the next album...

[Gunner Gilby]

28 minutes ago, GNRmello77 said:

Here's an unlikely theory for you regarding the 'something special' The General video will feature a date as a hidden message which will tell the release date of the next album...

Lol. I suspect if that's your hope you're setting yourself up for disappointment. Of course I'd love to be proven wrong. 

[jman2000]

4 hours ago, Its Tino said:

I think the AI element is lame, but I’m happy for them to release a little something during their “off time”.
 

Maybe they used AI so Nando wouldn’t sexually harass it

Post of a lifetime right here. 

[evilfacelessturtle]

23 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said:

 

Some of the selects were in mono ffs But that's not really the point, of course the Ritz was better, it's a great release and was praised on here. Most selects seemed half-assed and got a mixed response. My point was that when the band releases something good, the responses are positive.

Despite some oversensitive people thinking this place is full of haterz, the criticism of using AI is valid.

Shit, I didn't realize that!

I'm not into AI in theory, but I'm reserving judgement until I see it.

[GNRmello77]

2 hours ago, Gunner Gilby said:

Lol. I suspect if that's your hope you're setting yourself up for disappointment. Of course I'd love to be proven wrong. 

It's more wishful thinking than hope, I don't expect anything but it's fun to use your fantasy sometimes.. being a fan for so long does that to people 

[evilfacelessturtle]

14 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

Exactly. It is a tool, a technique to create visualizations. In a sense it is making visual arts more available to everybody. You don't need to know how to paint, or draw, yourself, to create visual arts, now you can do it on your computer through AI-assisted rendering. You still need to direct the AI to create something that realizes your vision of the art. And if you are poor at that, or if you use poor software and you don't edit and optimize afterwards, the results will be poor. Just like if you are poor at drawing or painting. The big difference is that you can't really admire the technique that went into the art, like the brushstrokes of Rembrandt, or whatever, but you can still admire the outcome. AI-created art will still do what art is supposed to do, inspire emotions and make us intrigued. 

I get that conventional visual artists have a big problem with AI-generated art, because, again, it makes their technique superfluous to an extent, but the upside it that it allows for people without the these manual techniques to also create art, which is good. It democratizes visual arts, in a sense. And I get that AI-generated art can be extremely shoddy when not done correctly, and come across as soulless and hence not art. But if it is done with purpose, where an artist uses AI simply as a tool to realize a vision, and maybe exceed technical limitations he has, and when the results are edited/controlled, then I see little problem with it. Except of course that it means more competition for visual artists who might already be struggling in a competitive industry...but that is progress, I suppose?

I referred to opponents to AI as luddites, previously, and there is something to it. I have myself used AI to generate visuals for various hobby projects and I am astonished by the world that has opened up before me. Artists will have to learn how to use AI as one of the tools in their repertoire, and the best artists will, as always, be those that utilize the tools at hand to create works that we intrigues and awes us. 

You make a fair point, but only as applied to hobbyists. The unfortunate reality is that this tool, like all other technological developments, will in fact be used by the ownership class to hold even more power over the rest of us. It's hard enough as it is to make a career in the arts. Now corporations can have art custom made on demand for a tiny fraction of what it costs to employ a human being.

9 hours ago, Jw224 said:

AI doesn't "create" anything.

Neither do humans. Every word has been written before, every note and chord has been played before. Civil War is far from the first song with a G-B-E chord progression.