Hard Skool Officially Released at Midnight - Sept 24

[Dangelus]

I’m pleased we got some news songs. I only listened to the leaks once for this very reason so it feels new to me. I dig it, I’m pleased it was released. I hope they release more. What the fuck are people complaining about now? When the vocals were recorded? Who gives a fuck?!

[RussTCB]

28 minutes ago, Tom-Ass said:

 

I will listen to it when I am in the mood and have a more open mind..

But yes.. I didn't like CD, Absurd and the idea of creating songs by slapping tracks over NuGnR demos isn't even remotely appealing to me.. I might be pleasantly surprised but I doubt it

I don't get why so many people are giving you a hard time about this. 

How is anyone shocked someone doesn't like Chinese Democracy? How is anyone shocked that someone might not be overjoyed that the "new" song is just a 20+ year old demo that Slash & Duff replaced parts on? 

Other than the shitty/awful production, I happen to dig the song. But I could totally see hiw/why someone else wouldn't. I'm not particularly excited about the lineage of the track either, but with GN'R it is what it is. 

[GoForJMark]

Was just checking out the Hard Skool soundcheck footage that we all saw. And noticed the screen on the stage, it appears that the band is being filmed? Do they usually test the cameras during soundcheck? Or could they be filming for a potential video of the song? 

[Tom-Ass]

2 minutes ago, RussTCB said:

I don't get why so many people are giving you a hard time about this. 

How is anyone shocked someone doesn't like Chinese Democracy? How is anyone shocked that someone might not be overjoyed that the "new" song is just a 20+ year old demo that Slash & Duff replaced parts on? 

Other than the shitty/awful production, I happen to dig the song. But I could totally see hiw/why someone else wouldn't. I'm not particularly excited about the lineage of the track either, but with GN'R it is what it is. 

Thanks Russ... I just wish everyone would respect each others opinion.. You and I have totally opposite opinions about CD and that is 100% fine.. Not everyone has to agree on everything Gn'R or be into them for the same reasons. .. I love their setlist and live shows.. Some people don't.. I thought Live Era was pretty good and everyone here hates it.. I could go on and on.. You will never see me give anyone a hard time for their opinion and that is what is so frustrating.. I am legitimately happy for anyone that likes it..  

[ChristianGNR]

That’s what happens when leaked versions of the songs surfaces on the internet. 

I’ve been thinking about not listening to any leaked material from now on. But that’s not easy when you have a band that takes so long to release officially something. 

6 minutes ago, GoForJMark said:

Was just checking out the Hard Skool soundcheck footage that we all saw. And noticed the screen on the stage, it appears that the band is being filmed? Do they usually test the cameras during soundcheck? Or could they be filming for a potential video of the song? 

That’s normal. They use soundcheck to test everything else like video, lighting and pyro 

Edited September 25, 2021 by ChrisMaciel

[ZODIAC]

i'm so sick of this "new song discussion". of course it's NEW, as it wasn't released before. 

when november rain was released in 1991, nobody was complaining about "axl startet writing this song ages ago!" 

art in general needs its time. a painting, a song,... it't done when the artist feels right to release it. nobody fucked up michelangelo after painting the sistine chapel over decades.

so... relax people. why can't you just enjoy this GNR rocker?! i for myself don't give a fuck how old this song might be, where it has its origins or who's playing the goddamn drums! i love the GNR sound it has, axls vocals, slashs guitar(solo) and the great bass (intro!)

as always, complaints, complaints, complaints... :-)

8 minutes ago, GoForJMark said:

Was just checking out the Hard Skool soundcheck footage that we all saw. And noticed the screen on the stage, it appears that the band is being filmed? Do they usually test the cameras during soundcheck? Or could they be filming for a potential video of the song? 

was thinking the same!

[default_]

Im with Tom on this one, Ive listened to the songs and enjoyed both tho. 
The thing for me is: Same old same old. The band didnt have the capacity to create new songs in almost five years of reunion and are relying on 20+ years old demos to keep the momentum.

its cool that Slash and Duff are back, but if this is all we’re gonna get, Id rather have NITL to be a one off tour thing, and then have the NuGNR guys back. At least I wouldnt feel cheated.

[RussTCB]

7 minutes ago, ZODIAC said:

i'm so sick of this "new song discussion". of course it's NEW, as it wasn't released before. 

when november rain was released in 1991, nobody was complaining about "axl startet writing this song ages ago!" 

art in general needs its time. a painting, a song,... it't done when the artist feels right to release it. nobody fucked up michelangelo after painting the sistine chapel over decades.

so... relax people. why can't you just enjoy this GNR rocker?! i for myself don't give a fuck how old this song might be, where it has its origins or who's playing the goddamn drums! i love the GNR sound it has, axls vocals, slashs guitar(solo) and the great bass (intro!)

as always, complaints, complaints, complaints... :-)

was thinking the same!

Here's some easy counter points:

November Rain wasn't 20+ years old

It also wasn't painted over by other people who had no hand in writing it

It also had excellent production 

[ZODIAC]

1 minute ago, RussTCB said:

Here's some easy counter points:

November Rain wasn't 20+ years old

It also wasn't painted over by other people who had no hand in writing it

It also had excellent production 

but....

it doesn't matter, how many years are between the first idea and the final release. 5 years, 10 years, 20 years... 

michelangelo had many students who helped him. in the end it's a michelangelo "product" nobody cares who made the "fillings".  at least Duff already worked on HS in 1996 one would assume.

in the end, the final song matters. no demos and nothing else...

MAYBE the production could be better, but come on... we got an official release by our favourite band. it's a great song...

[RussTCB]

1 minute ago, ZODIAC said:

but....

it doesn't matter, how many years are between the first idea and the final release. 5 years, 10 years, 20 years... 

michelangelo had many students who helped him. in the end it's a michelangelo "product" nobody cares who made the "fillings".  at least Duff already worked on HS in 1996 one would assume.

in the end, the final song matters. no demos and nothing else...

MAYBE the production could be better, but come on... we got an official release by our favourite band. it's a great song...

"but other artists did it" isn't really a solid argument for creativity.

While I personally agree that the final song is all that matters, I can see how others would be that Slash & Duff returned to their legendary positions just to re-record parts someone else wrote 20+ years prior. 

Again, I happen to like the song outside of the awful production. I'm a huge Robin Finck fan and I'm totally OK with what Slash did with replacing his solo. 

However, just because GN'R finally released the lowest possible creative product as new music doesn't mean I'm going to go around telling others they have to like it and/or pretend the history of the track doesn't exist. 

[Blackstar]

I think the closest GN'R related example, in relation to how far back the songs go, is Shadow of Your Love and Back Off Bitch, which were originally written circa 1982 by Axl and Paul Tobias, then were developed by Hollywood Rose and then re-arranged and recorded by Guns N' Roses.

In regards to the origins of Hard Skool, we now have an official statement that it was written solely by Axl, so no members of the CD era had a hand in originally writing it. So it seems it's an Axl song that was arranged by CD era members (and probably there was an earlier arrangement by Duff, Matt and maybe Slash, if it dates from 1996 - and I think it does) and now it's been arranged and recorded by the current lineup.

The only difference is, of course, that in the case of Shadow and Back Off the whole songs, including the vocals, were re-recorded.

Edited September 25, 2021 by Blackstar

[denin]

I too have come around to enjoy Hard Skool 2.0. It's certainly better to have Slash & Duff re-do the music, instead of copy-pasting bits into the mix.

Yet, Axl in around 2000:

"I write the vocals last, because I wanted to invent the music first and push the music to the level that I had to compete against it."

20 years later his line is approximately:

"I throw the original music away and have the new band compete against my age-old vocal takes. That'll show 'em."
 

This weird-ass approach does appear to meld Slash's UYI-informed playing with Axl's CD era quirks pretty well. Unusual way to make music, but... this band.

 

Edited September 25, 2021 by denin

[IncitingChaos]

6 minutes ago, denin said:

I too have come around to enjoy Hard Skool 2.0. It's certainly better to have Slash & Duff re-do the music, instead of copy-pasting bits into the mix.

Yet, Axl in around 2000:

"I write the vocals last, because I wanted to invent the music first and push the music to the level that I had to compete against it."

20 years later his line is approximately:

"I throw the original music away and have the new band compete against my age-old vocal takes. That'll show 'em."
 

This weird-ass approach does appear to meld Slash's UYI-informed playing with Axl's CD era quirks pretty well. Unusual way to make music, but... this band.

 

Axl also said he prefers writing lyrics and melody first then having Slash work the instrumental arrangement out, and Slash likes writing “guitar first” songs abut it’s harder for Axl to write lyrics that way and led to writers block once haha so idk if the man knows what he wants 

[default_]

17 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

In regards to the origins of Hard Skool, we now have an official statement that it was written solely by Axl,

When was this said? 👀

[Blackstar]

2 minutes ago, default_ said:

When was this said? 👀

There is a press release from the band/label. From a couple of pages back in this thread:

https://www.mygnrforum.com/topic/224697-hard-skool-officially-released-at-midnight-sept-24/?do=findComment&comment=4907101

 

[alfierose]

4 minutes ago, IncitingChaos said:

Axl also said he prefers writing lyrics and melody first then having Slash work the instrumental arrangement out, and Slash likes writing “guitar first” songs abut it’s harder for Axl to write lyrics that way and led to writers block once haha so idk if the man knows what he wants 

That's interesting. I can see why that becomes an issue. Which one has the more 'usual' way of working? Is there a more usual way?

With the disclaimer that I have never written a song nor played an instrument beyond the recorder in school, Axl's method seems the most logical to me. It strikes me as harder to write a song around guitar riffs than to overlay them onto something that already has structure and lyrics.

[IncitingChaos]

7 minutes ago, alfierose said:

That's interesting. I can see why that becomes an issue. Which one has the more 'usual' way of working? Is there a more usual way?

With the disclaimer that I have never written a song nor played an instrument beyond the recorder in school, Axl's method seems the most logical to me. It strikes me as harder to write a song around guitar riffs than to overlay them onto something that already has structure and lyrics.

Axl said they did AFD more his way then UYI got complicated because he started getting handed these guitar songs and told he had to put lyrics to them. I don’t think all of AFD was written like Axl said though, Izzy could do a riff and write lyrics, but seems like Axl and Slash relied on eachother more to do 50/50

[IncitingChaos]

Basically I think they both worked. Slash would have wrote Paradise and Sweet Child before Axl pinned lyrics to em, but obviously songs like Edtranged, November Rain were already made before Slash got to em 

[GNR_RNR]

It’d be cool if we started getting these EP’s for different tour legs.
 

A couple new songs and a couple live cuts. maybe add some of the covers. 

[GnR Chris]

11 hours ago, agustingloger said:

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 

 

 

 

What’s funny is all you heard from “casual” rock fans when Guns dropped “Absurd” was, “Who’s singing? It doesn’t sound like Axl?” Then they drop “Hard School” and it has Axl’s trademark sound, and people like this are all, “he can’t hit these notes anymore.”

You can’t please keyboard warriors. And I fully believe Axl can still hit these notes.  No one can do it for a three-hour set at 60. But “Rock the Rock” proved he can go in the studio and lay down vintage vocals. 

[jekylhyde]

13 minutes ago, alfierose said:

That's interesting. I can see why that becomes an issue. Which one has the more 'usual' way of working? Is there a more usual way?

With the disclaimer that I have never written a song nor played an instrument beyond the recorder in school, Axl's method seems the most logical to me. It strikes me as harder to write a song around guitar riffs than to overlay them onto something that already has structure and lyrics.

From what I've read, most bands write the music first and melodies plus lyrics second. That's also the way I write songs, because I think it's way easier to come up with a melody when you have chords, because you can "find" the notes of the melody from the notes of the chords.

Doing it the other way sounds a bit too difficult or complicated to me. But then again, I've gotten used to doing it that way. So, I guess it's all about what works for you personally.

And I am more of a rhythm guy, than a melody guy, so that also factors in. If you find melody easier than rhythm, it makes sense to do the melodies first. 

[ZoSoRose]

I honestly think this is the perfect GNR reunion single, I don’t have many critiques. A new album might not be coming “soon” but this and Absurd show that Axl is not afraid to put out new music that was “made” (redone) quickly. I think we will get one more album out of them for sure. Hopefully 2022. I doubt this will be the last Guns N’ Roses song

[Steff_66]

16 minutes ago, alfierose said:

That's interesting. I can see why that becomes an issue. Which one has the more 'usual' way of working? Is there a more usual way?

With the disclaimer that I have never written a song nor played an instrument beyond the recorder in school, Axl's method seems the most logical to me. It strikes me as harder to write a song around guitar riffs than to overlay them onto something that already has structure and lyrics.

People mostly write music first but "Axl's method" is actually a legitimate way to work. I know last Rob Zombie album was written that way, Zombie did all the vocals with a rhythm machine before the band started working on it. Ozzy also comes to mind, in Sabbath he would sing over Iommi's riffs but in his solo career sometimes he would sing a vocal melody to the guitarist and have him figure out what to play underneath.

[Free Bird]

1 hour ago, default_ said:

The thing for me is: Same old same old. The band didnt have the capacity to create new songs in almost five years of reunion and are relying on 20+ years old demos to keep the momentum.

We really don't know what the guys wrote. It doesn't have to be the only material they have just because that's what they released.

And in all fairness. I think "the band" has created more then enough new material. What's questionable is Axl's contribution to anything new.

[GnR Chris]

5 hours ago, Lies They Tell said:

To be fair, we don't actually know if it's a recent decision by Axl to include the Eye On You vocals on Hard Skool. It's possible that he made that decision already 15 years ago or so.

The Hey's and the scream might have been a part of Hard Skool most of the songs existence. At the end of the day we were never supposed to hear Eye On You. If it wasn't for the leaks we would have never known that he used vocals from another song on Hard skool.

Who knows if some vocals in the old classic songs were originally recorded for one song, but used on another song instead. We don't know cause we don't have all the unfinished songs that Axl recorded during the UYI days for example. But it's possible that he cut and pasted vocals already back then.

This is an excellent point I hadn’t considered.